Posted on 04/03/2010 3:12:52 PM PDT by NYer
This is my 16th Easter.
For the first 38 years of my life I did not celebrate Easter because I was one of Jehovah’s Witnesses, a pseudo- Christian group with a very strange economy of salvation. It is not easy to describe life in a cult like Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is very dark. Even their light is darkness.
Jehovah’s Witnesses do not believe in the Trinity, so they do not believe in the deity of Christ. They believe that Jesus was Michael the Archangel before he came to earth, and that after he was resurrected, he went back to being Michael the Archangel — but with the name “Jesus.” They do believe Jesus died (but not on a cross) to save mankind from sin and death by atoning for the disobedience of Adam. Jesus had to be a perfect man, to match Adam in every respect, and thus he takes Adam’s place as our father. I know this is weird — not to mention the whole ontological problem of how he is an angel, then a human, and then an angel again — but I’m telling you about it because I want you to know that I had an idea that I could call myself a Christian and believe Jesus died for me, without conceiving of Jesus as God.
Most of you reading this are like my grandchildren who have heard all their lives that Jesus died for you and that Jesus is God the Son –- true God from true God. It has never dawned on you, because it was always the light that you lived in.
But it dawned on me.
In 1993, after a long and harrowing period of life disruption, searching for the peace and transformative power that I read about in the New Testament, I had an encounter with Christ.
Long my imprisoned spirit lay,
Fast bound in sin and nature’s night;
Thine eye diffused a quickening ray—
I woke, the dungeon flamed with light;
My chains fell off, my heart was free,
I rose, went forth, and followed Thee.
I did not know then that he was Deity, but I knew that he was not who the Jehovah’s Witnesses said he was. I knew that I would have to leave the religion that I had grown up in and known all my life. I would have to walk away from every relationship of my adult life. I went to a church.
Now to you, that might seem like the most natural thing in the world for me to do. You want to know about Jesus, you go to a church. But for me it was terrifying. I had always been told that churches housed demons. Jehovah’s Witnesses do not even like to turn their cars around in a 
church parking lot. But that visit to a church set me on the road to learning the truth about Jesus. It became pretty clear, pretty quickly that Christians worshiped Jesus. The fundamental fact of my religious upbringing had been that you only worshiped God (Jehovah), who is Jesus’ father. To worship anything or anyone else was to be guilty of idolatry. But there was a tractor beam on my heart. I had to figure out who Jesus really was.
Having left what I recognized to be a religion of error, I was very leery about falling into error or being misled once again. But I knew that I had to open my mind to the witness and the arguments of Christians around me in order to untwist the distorted way I had learned to read scripture.
A humorous skit put on one time at a meeting of ex-Jehovah’s Witnesses illustrated what I was facing. It featured a “Christian” trying to “help” a recently-exited Witness. When the ex-JW expressed confusion about Christian doctrine, the Christian said, “Oh, it’s easy. Just believe everything the opposite.”
“What are you talking about?” the baffled ex-JW asked.
“Well, you didn’t used to believe in the Trinity, and now you do. You didn’t used to believe in the deity of Christ, and now you do. You didn’t used to believe in the immortal soul, and now you do. You didn’t used to believe in going to heaven, and now you do. You didn’t used to believe in celebrating Christmas, and now you do. See, everything is the opposite. It’s easy.”
The appreciative laughter with which this was greeted gave testament to the fact that it is not easy! And the more you care, really care, about the truth, the harder your struggle is. If you have always lived in the truth, you can’t imagine how hard it is.
For a while I lived in a partial shadow. I was in love with Jesus, but still didn’t know what to make of all the Christian adoration of Him? How could I explain this phenomenon if he were not God?
I found some relief by latching onto the biblical image of the Church as the Bride of Christ. After all, what would be more natural than for a bride to be focused on her bridegroom? Of course Christians sang love songs to Jesus! It was the Jehovah’s Witnesses who were strange — like a bride who ignored her groom and tried to give all her affection to her father-in-law instead.
Meanwhile, I was participating in Christian prayer and worship to the best of my limited understanding. I also asked questions, and I studied… and studied and studied. Finally I was turned on to reading the Early Church Fathers. It started to became clear to me that this teaching — that Jesus was Divine, was God in the flesh — was really Christian teaching from the beginning, was the apostolic witness.
There was just one problem left in my mind: If Jesus was God, then that man on the Cross was God.
It would mean that God had died.
It would mean that God had died… for me.
For all time, there will be no more astounding, no more elevating, no more humbling proposal to a human soul than this.
And can it be that I should gain
an interest in the Savior’s blood!
Died he for me — who caused his pain –
For me who him to death pursued?
Amazing love! How can it be
that thou, my God, shouldst die for me?
He left his Father’s throne above
(so free, so infinite his grace!),
emptied himself of all but love,
and bled for Adam’s helpless race.
’Tis mercy all, immense and free,
for O my God, it found out me!
Amazing love! How can it be
that thou, my God, shouldst die for me?
The sun had come up in my life.
[The lyrics are from the hymn, "And Can it Be (Amazing Love)", by Charles Wesley. Enjoy the lovely rendition here.]
Actually Plinyelder what do you think are the number of people who believe exactly as you do...that is the number of people who are taught just as you have displayed in that link to me.(http://www.thewordsofeternallife.com/cross.html)All those things contained on that page. My guess is very minute. A further guess is that it has always been minute. Yes I believe that you would always count a certain cross section of Christians as being in your camp. But there is hardly anyone that believes as you do. Your probably non-denominational and you have a ‘historic view’ of the lineage of the first Christians as being devoted to symbols
and practices of paganism and false gods and not being rooted in Christ. Of course this view, makes your beliefs all the more credible.
Just sent this to a dear friend who is also a convert from the Jehovah’s Witnesses.
Great story!
Well yes, I and a number of friends of mine did help Dr Kennedy open his first ‘house of worship’ way way back, I’d say around 11967 or 68.
We remodeled and transformed the old firehouse on commercial blvd, (if you lived in the area as long as you say .. you’ll know the place) into his first group meeting area.
It was myself and friends of mine who came over from The House of Ichthus to lend a hand.
The House of Ichthus was a converted funeral home on Wilton Drive in Wilton Manors and a place for the kids, (and dopers) to hang out and Maybe find Christ, back in the sixties.
I don’t consider the new cathedral that Dr Kennedy built on Federal Hwy as just a ‘lowly’ drywalled barn .. Do you?
Yes, I knew Dr Kennedy and it would appear .. Long before you did.
So What?
Your argument is spurious at best.
Are you going to try to convince me and others that the more people that believe in a certain way .. are the ones who know best?
Remember the Broad Road that Jesus spoke of or The Narrow Path?
I think that Jesus himself, struck down that very argument with this parable?
How can one comment “to nobody” on an open forum that is
read by thousands of people?
How can someone post “Jesus on a stick” in a Christian
country without expecting others, who have made this
man Jesus their Lord and Savior, not to comment back?
Weird.
Sir, I run into your type all the time on christian forums.
Disparaging someones devotion to God when someone is either engaged in levity,laughter,correcting someone else, or other some such situation as it regards religion.
Its kind of Pharasaical dont you think?
Quit the the ‘I’m holier than you talk’!
Because thats the ego game you play.
Actually, your probably a very smart guy. It is a spurious argument. However, have you ever compared and contrasted your beliefs and the bible verses that support them versus what Catholicism teaches and the bible verses they use to support it. So many people verify truth initially with their religion and then just use that support beam for truth on all the rest without checking. So they know that all the other denominations got it wrong because their literature and experts tell them about all the other denominations.
Borrowed Opinion. Usually when I contradict something in another denomination(like Mormonism), these guys just usually go back to an elder and get there take. Its kind of a waste of time. Because these people rely on borrowed opinions instead of search for truth. Why do all these contradictions in faith exist...not enough fact checkers, too many people with emotional investments. Keep on the search my friend. I’ve been there , done that.
Thank You and God Bless.
Oh, I finally get it. It was all levity. I get.
Hey bud, choose anything other that Jesus Christ as
a subject for your levity and I won’t give a crap
about it. Who did you glorify with your ‘levity’?
Hey, he said devotion. Now that’s funny!
immature
For those that don't know .. That is some 'Primo' real estate that Dr Kennedy's 'Church' is sitting on there.
Just across the bridge from Lauderdale Beach.
Funny, isn’t it?
I could ‘claim’ to be an X anything and post my rantings about the EVILS and HARDSHIPS that I had to endure because of those Bad Catholics or those Bad Mormons or those .. Well you get the idea.
Hey .. No One twisted your arm or held one of your loved one’s as hostage and made you do ANYTHING!
Like piranhas are apt to do .. Whenever the JW’s are brought up or whenever someone ‘claims’ to be an X witness .. The ripping and tearing begins.
Makes you wonder?
It is possible that 11967 may prove to be a significant year for someone some day.
We remodeled and transformed the old firehouse on commercial blvd, (if you lived in the area as long as you say....
You were a hired paperhanger, carpenter, plumber, or drywaller, perhaps, not one who claims to have ever been a parishioner. By the way, I don't believe I ever claimed I lived "in the area," but it's pretty clear you're playing kinda loose with facts, and feigning false familiarities here already. I'll let that just speak for itself.
It was myself and friends of mine who came over from The House of Ichthus to lend a hand.... a place for the kids, (and dopers) to hang out and Maybe find Christ, back in the sixties.
OK, so what you're saying is that you were in rehab. As Seinfeld would say, "Not that there's anything wrong with that...."
Yes, I knew Dr Kennedy and it would appear .. Long before you did. So What?
The difference it appears is that I actually knew Dr. Kennedy for 35 years and about the most you've said so far is that you and a few other contemporary chums did some remodeling for him a few years before that. Yeah, on that note I guess you could say, "so what?"
Of course, the way I figure it is, if you were any good at the first job he would have called you back to help build the other building. But then again maybe what I've just exposed is the primary source of your JW-driven envy.
Might want to give your favorite local "kingdom hall" a drywall call if you're looking for some work.
You won't need a work reference from Dr. Kennedy. They probably know you pretty well over there at "kingdom hall" already.
You are kidding, right?
Not even close. And there is VERY VERY early evidence that the traditional Cross (2 pieces) is what was used both by the Persians and the Romans. UGH!
Russell new NOTHING about Greek and the JW twisting of scripture is rivaled only by the Mormons.
The *shape* of the cross on which Jesus died is totally irrelevant. Sure, it could have been a stake or a cross or whatever. Why is that even important? Jesus died after being hanged on some wood. *That* is what’s important.
So, why did the Greek Christians of the first centuries always show a cross! I would imagine that they knew what it meant. All the iconography shows a cross.
- - - - -
Not only that but first century Roman graffiti insulting Christians ALSO shows a CROSS as well.
You are only using ONE of THREE primary definitions of a cult.
You are using the ANTHROPOLOGICAL definition, cults are also classified by Sociological and Theological definitions.
Most valid religious groups fit into the Anthro definition, but JW’s, LDS and other groups fit into all three definitions, so you must be precise as to what you mean by ‘cult’.
When referencing pseudo-Christian groups, it is almost always used in the theological sense.
Would you like characteristics of cults using ALL three definitions?
Dr. Martin died broke and spent more money in ministry than he ever made.
While I was never lucky enough to meet him, I am friends with several of his longtime associates.
There is, of course, the reference Jesus makes to the holes in his hands made by the... (wait for it) ... nails! Note the use of the plural.
*I* believe Jesus was hanged on a cross. I’m just saying that the actual shape is not worth fighting about. I never understood why JW made such a big deal over something so irrelevant.
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