Posted on 03/03/2010 7:19:22 PM PST by marshmallow
Rome, Italy, Mar 3, 2010 / 04:20 pm (CNA).- A renowned exorcist in Rome recently released a book of memoirs in which he declares to know of the existence of Satanic sects in the Vatican where participation reaches all the way to the College of Cardinals. A second demonologist, also residing in Rome, entered the debate this week, clarifying the origins of the information and defending the Vatican's clergy as an "edifying and virtuous" collection of prelates.
In a book of memoirs released in February, the noted Italian exorcist Fr. Gabriele Amorth affirmed that "Yes, also in the Vatican there are members of Satanic sects." When asked if members of the clergy are involved or if this is within the lay community, he responded, "There are priests, monsignors and also cardinals!"
The book, "Father Amorth. Memoirs of an Exorcist. My life fighting against Satan." was written by Marco Tosatti, who compiled it from interviews with the priest.
Fr. Amorth was asked by Tosatti how he knows Vatican clergy are involved. He answered, "I know from those who have been able to relate it to me because they had a way of knowing directly. And it's something 'confessed' most times by the very demon under obedience during the exorcisms."
The famous Italian exorcist was also asked if the Pope was aware of Satanic sects in the Vatican, to which Fr. Amorth replied, "Of course, he was informed. But he does what he can. It's a horrifying thing."
Benedict XVI, being German, comes from a place "decidedly averse to these things," argued Fr. Amorth, saying that in Germany "there practically aren't any exorcists." However, he clarified, "the Pope believes (in them)."
The Italian priest also warned of the existence of bishops and priests who do not believe in Satan in the interview. "And yet, in the Gospel, Jesus speaks extensively about it, so it should be said, either they've never read the Gospel or they just don't believe it!"
Fr. Jose Antonio Fortea Cucurull, a Spanish priest and theologian who specializes in demonology and is now studying for his doctorate of theology in Rome, responded to Fr. Amorth's assertions on March 1.
After reading reports of Fr. Amorth's accusations pointing a finger at members of the clergy, including cardinals, Fr. Fortea declared that it is a "duty of justice" to speak out in their defense.
Noting that some prelates "are more spiritual and others more earthly, some more virtuous and others more human," he wrote on his blog, "from there to affirm that some cardinals are members of Satanic sects is an unacceptable distance."
The Spanish priest then explained the sources of information used by Fr. Amorth to say that Satanic sects are operating in the Vatican.
In addition to the people that seek help for demonic possession, said Fr. Fortea, "innumerable persons come to us who claim to have visions, revelations and messages from Our Lord." Among these, "a certain number offer apocalyptic messages and revelations about the infiltration of Satanism and the Masons within the dome of the Church."
Fr. Fortea added that the only acceptable stance is to suspend judgment of the messages while they are subjected to time-intensive discernment, "sometimes months for each one of the cases."
The other source Fr. Amorth refers to, according to Fr. Fortea, is the demons who are being exorcised. Of this, the Spanish priest wrote that knowing whether or not the demon is telling the truth "is in many cases impossible."
"We can know with great confidence when a demon tells the truth in the subject directly related with the exorcism. That is, the number of demons, their name and similar things. But we cannot be confident in what regards concrete news relating to people."
"Father Amorth does not have other sources of knowledge than the two that I just cited," indicated the Spanish exorcist, "I refer to his own words for this affirmation."
Fr. Fortea observed that the existence of similar messages from the same sources is "something known by me just as (it has been) by many other colleagues for many years."
"Among exorcists, some have come to similar conclusions as those of Fr. Amorth. Others have not."
Fr. Fortea also defended those implicated in Fr. Amorth's statements, stating, "Our College of Cardinals, if we compare it with past centuries is the most edifying and virtuous that history has ever known. One would have to go back to the epoch of the Roman Empire to find a body of electors so distanced from all earthly pretension as the current one is.
"Cardinals might be better or worse," he reflected, "but all have upright intentions and seek the glory of God."
He concluded by emphasizing, "Statements must be proven, especially when they are about such grave accusations that affect the honorability of those who form part of the Head of the Church as far as they help the Supreme Pastor."
Exactly my thought. I think Malachi Martin knew what he was talking about, too.
“a certain number offer apocalyptic messages and revelations about the infiltration of Satanism and the Masons within the dome of the Church.”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
uh...WHAT?
Yes, this really gives weight to Windswept House!!!!
Markbsnr, what in the world do you think of this???
I don’t have the correct frame of reverence to put this into
a context that makes sense...
best,
ampu
I don’t have the correct frame of reverence to put this into a context that makes sense...
Ummmmm, I have no idea. I know that the evil one has always tried to have inroads into the Church, but this book? One problem is that one that is so heavily involved in evil might become prone to evil; the analogy might be a DEA agent who becomes addicted to heroin, or a gang unit member who starts to run with the gangs.
I very much appreciate your question to me; thank you. I think, after some quick googling, that the good Father might have simply lost his compass bearing. I pray that this is not substantial and that the good Father has not succumbed himself. Vaya con Dios, my friend. May you walk the Via of Christ.
Interesting. Not sure I believe his claims but it is THEORETICALLY possible.
I would be interested in reading the book to see how he comes to these conclusions.
“We can know with great confidence when a demon tells the truth in the subject directly related with the exorcism. That is, the number of demons, their name and similar things.”
I guess there is honor among demons?
Windswept House—what a book!
I’ve never looked at Bishops and Cardinals the same way after reading it many years ago.
Martin was an insider. He knew that of which he wrote.
MarkBsnr,
Thanks for your thoughts and your friendship.
I agree we have an enemy who is devious and
would like nothing better than the Church/s
to fail.
May what he writes not be true...
best,
ampu
Agreed. Actually, all of Martin’s books are excellent, each in their own way.
If Fr. Amorth says it, believe it. He’s trained most of the world’s exorcists and has done more than any other priest living. Especially the part about various clergy not believing in Satan. It’s probably more of a case that they don’t want to.
I was thinking of Malachi Martin as well...
First I have heard about any of this. A question for you. Is it not a GOOD thing to NOT believe in Satan?
Really? I learned the hard way that I'm not cut out to read Fr. Amorth's accounts. Bad things tend to happen. This isn't his first book.
Is it not a GOOD thing to NOT believe in Satan?
Well, to not believe in Satan is to not believe in evil or, for that matter, truthfully, Hell. This is something for us to fear, so we should all believe in it. Don't worship Satan, evil or Hell, but believe it exists, oh, yes. It's NOT a good thing to forget and the people compiling the Lectionary keep omitting the Bible verses from the readings that refer to all three. One of Satan's favorite tricks is to "disappear" so that people don't believe. Not a good thing.
‘night.
By “believe in Satan,” Fr. Amorth means to believe in the existence of Satan. Thus, “believing in Satan” is a good thing, because the Church teaches that Satan exists. As does the entire New Testament.
No, I had not hear of Fr. Amorth's accounts, nor based upon what I read in this post do I want to. Not that I discount the account, just have no desire to put this information into my mind.
Well, to not believe in Satan is to not believe in evil or, for that matter, truthfully, Hell. This is something for us to fear, so we should all believe in it. Don't worship Satan, evil or Hell, but believe it exists, oh, yes. It's NOT a good thing to forget and the people compiling the Lectionary keep omitting the Bible verses from the readings that refer to all three. One of Satan's favorite tricks is to "disappear" so that people don't believe. Not a good thing.
Thank you for the explanation. The words, believing in Satan, initially, read differently to me than what you explain to me what your words intended.
And I had not ever given in specificity any thought to these particulars. Yet I know that Satan knows Scripture far better than any flesh being, and is well crafted in using Scripture to tempt anyone he can to do his bidding. And it surely seems he and his fellow travelers are quite busy these days every where.
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