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Young people are more conservative than older people, they are more orthodox in their approach to religion and voted for the Calvinist CDA party at the last election, researcher Joke van Saane of Amsterdam's VU university told the paper....little remains of the Calvinist work ethic. 'I really noticed how many people said 'I already work hard. I am not working any harder',' she told Trouw.
1 posted on 04/29/2009 3:00:47 PM PDT by Alex Murphy
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To: Alex Murphy

They ought to put their faith in Christ, not Jean Cauvin.


2 posted on 04/29/2009 3:01:56 PM PDT by Petronski (For the next few years, Gethsemane will not be marginal. We will know that garden. -- Cdl. Stafford)
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To: Alex Murphy

French Huguenot (Calvinist) ancestors Bump


9 posted on 04/29/2009 3:28:10 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: Alex Murphy

I’m not a big fan of Calvin, but it’s better than them having heroin-addled gay sex in the middle of a street in Amsterdam, I suppose.


16 posted on 04/29/2009 3:44:48 PM PDT by Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus (Third Parties are for the weak, fearful, and ineffectual among us.)
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To: Alex Murphy

“Young people are more conservative than older people, they are more orthodox in their approach to religion and voted for the Calvinist CDA party at the last election, researcher Joke van Saane of Amsterdam’s VU university told the paper.”

Best news I’ve learned all day. Maybe they’ll effectively counteract the entrenched secularism and the rise of Islam. Tell some of these young Calvinists to move over here to the U.S.


21 posted on 04/29/2009 4:04:42 PM PDT by ReformationFan
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To: Alex Murphy
Young people are more conservative than older people, they are more orthodox in their approach to religion and voted for the Calvinist CDA party at the last election

Yeah, gay marriage (since 2001 !), legal drugs, assisted suicide, involuntary euthanasia in many cases, an illegitimacy rate almost as high as that of white Americans and one of the highest rates-of-increase in illegitimacy in the developed world ... the Netherlands is virtually a Calvinist paradise. (not)

I'm glad the young people are (allegedly) "more conservative" and "more orthodox" than their elders, but it would be hard for them to be less conservative or less orthodox.

30 posted on 04/29/2009 4:42:57 PM PDT by Campion ("President Barack Obama" is an anagram for "An Arab-backed Imposter")
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To: Alex Murphy

“And little remains of the Calvinist work ethic. ‘I really noticed how many people said ‘I already work hard. I am not working any harder’,’ she told Trouw.”

Well, maybe they DO work hard enough.

Besides, the Nethwelands is the most thoroughly un-Christian country in the West. As a Catholic apologist, I’d love to blame their pathetic state on the Calvinists, but as a Catholic apologist, I’m also committed to the truth. So I have to admit that the Catholic Church in the Netherlands is pretty wretched. Maybe we can all blame the PCUSA? ;^D


31 posted on 04/29/2009 8:06:28 PM PDT by dangus
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To: Alex Murphy

OK, I’m gonna don my flamesuit and jump right into this:

The problem with Calvinism is this:

The Calvinist doctrine of absolute depravity ends up not only affirming the doctrine of original sin, which is true, but an absolute denial of prevening grace. Prevening graces are ways God works in a sinner’s life to draw him towards salvation, before he actually is saved. For instance, a just society bans pornography and extra-marital sex by the grace of God through the virtuous stivings of the saved. An un-regenerated sinner therefore avoids addiction to pornography or sexual promiscuity and therefore is less hardened against Christianity.

In addition, there’s the notion of “once saved, always saved.” Even if someone thinks they’re saved, if they commit a grave sin, they must have only intellectually assented to salvation, and therefore be mistaken.

The result of these two doctrines is a black and white world which works well for youth. And I don’t mean to say that black and white is inherently fallacious; I think we need more willingness as a society to see certain things as inherently, objectively good and others as inherently, objectively evil.

But even the saved sin. Catholics call this “concupiscence.” Christ has removed the eternal stain of original sin, but we still have a tendency to commit our own sin. So Catholics believe in confession, and practices designed to lessen concupiscence, such as mortification of the flesh through fasting, abstinence, etc. (In fact, many Calvinists also practice such means of perfection, but as mere worship, not purgation.) Recognziing the need for constant spiritual purification and the existence of prevening grace, Catholicism still retains black and white moral values, while recognizing that the unsaved may be progressing towards salvation, while the saved may still falter.

The Calvinist has no such recourse. At youth, this is a great motivator towards sinlessness. When he commits a grave sin, the Calvinist can by redoubling the sincerity of his faith assure himself that he is now saved, even though he once was a wretch. The problem comes as the Calvinist gains experience. He sins, he repents, he sins again. If he holds that he was not a true Christian before committing a sin, then nothing he did before that sin had any merit. That’s a bitter pill to swallow. If he’s young, he will still have profound developmental stages he can pass through and suppose that on the other side of a stage, he wasn’t truly saved but now he is. But as he attains stability, it becomes harder to accept that his life was pure black before his sin, and pure white after. With each grave sin, he is more and more challenged to find some way to prove to himself that his life is somehow radically different than before his sin.

On the other hand, if he is once and for all saved, then the sin must not have been a grave sin. Aaahhh, there’s the downfall. Worse, it can’t be a matter of trying harder, because, remember, there is nothing he can do to cooperate with grace, according to Calvinism.

Masturbation? Who is hurt, and where does the bible specifically condemn masturbation?

Divorce? Moses wouldn’t’ve allowed it if it were really that evil... you must be misinterpreting Jesus.

Pre-marital sex? It’s an expression of love. As long as it’s not adultery. OK, it’s a sin, but not a grave one.

Homosexuality? Well, there’s one we can all agree on. Well, those of us who are heterosexuals, anyway.

The problem is that it’s all these elders who have compromised their idealism that make up the church leaders. Of course, there’s plenty of issues that they can agree on:

Funding Israel is evil.

Using paper bags is evil.

Eating fatty foods is evil.

Fox News is evil.

All this nonsense, of course, drives away all the young ones to form their own denomination, or go non-denominational.


37 posted on 04/29/2009 8:56:44 PM PDT by dangus
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