Posted on 03/28/2009 2:49:11 PM PDT by NYer
I attended Mass at St. Peter’s Basilica in Rome, which is obviously a major tourist attraction, and I was in line for Communion behind a Japanese man who obviously was not Catholic, for he didn’t know what to do! The priest gave him communion anyway and as I stepped up, I heard him confide to his altar server in Italian—”his First Communion”.
They didn’t make a big deal of it.
True. The Catholic Church sees no impediment for the Orthodox to receive as far as the Catholic Church is concerned. We urge the Orthodox to obey their bishops but pose no obstacle for their receiving with us ourselves.
“I wonder how many Episcopalians know or even care about the Articles of Religion these days.”
Unfortuneatly. not near enough. The Church has been taken over by Ultra Libs and Homos. I don’t even attend the Episcopal Church anymore. When we get a Conservative Anglican Church in this area, I’ll probably join it.
In the Eastern Churches, the sacraments are referred to as the Holy Mysteries because, as you pointed out, it is a mystery as to how it works.
“People who don’t receive Communion can come forward for a blessing with their arms crossed across their chest. Many do it. Why doesn’t this individual want to come forward for a special blessing by the priest?”
I saw this for the first time last week at a funeral mass. It reminded me of our practice of blessing a non-Orthodox who approaches at communion time with the chalice. Its a nice thing to do.
My last dealing with a priest turned out to be a bad one. It involved an annulment and the Diocese of Hartford. I feel they betrayed and lied to me. There really is no way to resolve it.
I have no real animus toward the Church. I just don't believe much of what they say or preach.
I go to the Episcopal church and hear sermons that are relevant and I can understand. The sermons I used to hear in Catholic churches always left me cold.
I studied the Gospels in High School. It's not like I don't have an idea what they mean. I just never hear a Catholic priest explain the Gospel passage he just read in a way that connects.
“Consubstantiation” is a term often used to describe the Lutheran view of the Real Presence. It is not a term used by Lutherans however.
Speak for yourself.
The Catholic Church teaches, as always, that the substance of the bread and wine are totally obliterated and only the substance of Body and Blood exists. This is the "change" in "substance" that is what "Transubstantiaion" means.
What you describe is not the Catholic position.
From the CCC: (http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p2s2c1a3.htm#1376)
1376 The Council of Trent summarizes the Catholic faith by declaring: “Because Christ our Redeemer said that it was truly his body that he was offering under the species of bread, it has always been the conviction of the Church of God, and this holy Council now declares again, that by the consecration of the bread and wine there takes place a change of the whole substance of the bread into the substance of the body of Christ our Lord and of the whole substance of the wine into the substance of his blood. This change the holy Catholic Church has fittingly and properly called transubstantiation.”
****** I think this is not quite true. Pray means nothing more than to ask humbly. It comes from the Latin which translates as ‘to entreat.’ Therefore we Catholics actually do pray to Mary. ******
Thanks for the honesty...Of course you guys pray to Mary, and your saints...
Some of the posters are being dishonest and trying to fleece the crowd...
Here’s a link to Catholics Online...A page with the title of Prayers to Mary with many, many prayers to Mary...
Why the deception???
http://www.catholic.org/prayers/prayer.php?s=31
The Melkite Catholics in our parish, fold their arms across their chests in preparation to receive communion. However, the practice in our Church is to bless children who have not yet made First Communion and non-Cathoic visitors, by gently placing the chalice on their head. As Kolokotronis noted, it is a reverent blessing to behold and always comes as a beautiful surprise for first time Catholic visitors who approach to receive communio with young children in tow.
The reason that article condemns that idea is quite simply because that is Catholic dogma, dogma which has not changed one iota.
To that end, Anglicans, Orhtodox and Catholics are today essentially agreed on the doctrine of the Eucharist.
Orthodox and Catholics are essentially agreed on the doctrine of the Eucharist. Anglo-Catholic Anglicans who (tacitly or explicitly) reject Article XXVIII are pretty much essentially agreed also, but Rome doesn't consider their priests' orders to be valid (by and large) so, while they say correct things about the Eucharist, they don't really have the real Eucharist (in Rome's view).
There is no "essential agreement" between Catholics and Orthodox, on the one hand, and Anglicans who accept Article XXVIII on the nature and meaning of the Eucharist.
Here: We ask the saints for favors -- primarily or exclusively intercessory prayer -- and we say nice things about them. We do those things in postures or contexts commonly associated with Christian prayer. (Kneeling, hands folded, heads bowed, in a church, etc.)
You can call that "prayer". You can call it "pepperoni pizza". You can call it anything you want.
So, why the obsession? We know the saints aren't God, and aren't gods, either. But they're closer to God than you are, and if I wouldn't hesitate to ask your prayers, why should I hesitate to ask theirs?
Well, apparently your church likes to call them prayers...So why shouldn't I, and you...
So, why the obsession? We know the saints aren't God, and aren't gods, either. But they're closer to God than you are, and if I wouldn't hesitate to ask your prayers, why should I hesitate to ask theirs?
Then why do you ask them for things that only God can provide??? Here's a couple of your prayers...
Powerful Aid Prayer to St. Michael
Glorious Prince of the heavenly hosts and victor over rebellious spirits, be mindful of me who am so weak and sinful and yet so prone to pride and ambition. Lend me, I pray, thy powerful aid in every temptation and difficulty, and above all do not forsake me in my last struggle with the powers of evil.
Amen.
~~~~~~
Prayer to St. Francis for Life
Gentle St. Francis, you were so devoted to the humanity of Christ. Your heart burst with appreciation toward O God for taking on human life. You saw beauty and goodness in all living things - in birds that sing, the fish that fill our waters, and all that lives in nature.
Help us to imitate your reverence for life wherever it may be. Especially, humble Francis of Assisi, help us to help others to see the worth of each living, unborn baby sheltered in its mother's womb.
May all people have the grace to understand that these tiny, budding lives have the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
~~~~~~
I doubt that you ask one of your frinds to heal you, or provide a wife/husband for you...Why would you ask someone you hope is in heaven to do it???
Nor is such a request in the prayers you posted.
Perhaps such obsessions are born of hatred....or something more sinister.
Pray means ask.
Leave the Calvinists out of it, that's completely off topic.
“Substance” is understood as not being the physical qualities, but what the it’s essentially or “substantially” made of. “Substance” comes from Latin and means what stands underneath, not the upfront. The fact remains that the elements of the Eucharist, once consecrated, retain the physical qualities of bread and wine. Afterall, it does taste like bread (or a bread like substance if your parish uses wafers), and “drunk with the Holy Spirit” won’t sway officer friendly if you drive home after having reverently disposed of too much excess consecrated wine. What the Articles of Religion are doing is refuting the common misunderstanding of transubstantiation that it means the the people are somehow fooled into seeing and tasting bread and wine. It really is bread and wine. And it really is flesh and blood. I don’t want to get into the Definition of Chalcedon, but I that’s how I think of it.
Besides, the liturgy gives a strong hint of Anglican thinking- just read the Prayer of Humble Access.
Please see my response to SoothingDave. I think the confusion is more about a misunderstanding of terms than of anythin substantive.
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