Posted on 03/23/2009 10:27:54 AM PDT by fproy2222
I am tired of how some anti-Mormons here at FR, and other places, mis-use the history and teachings of my Church.
This was posted:::::::::
“”””” President John Taylor stated: "Christianity...is a perfect pack of nonsense...the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 6, p.167); “””””
Here is the part of the article not posted for you and as you read it, you will find that it does not say the things about my church that is implued by leaving out large parts of the text.
Please note, the address is to us, the LDS people, from one of the church leaders at the time, telling us that we are not doing what we should and that we must do better.
In no way is President Taylor saying what the original post says he is saying..
Notice how the “…” jump the first part of the post into another sentence and into another thought.
The information is taken out of context and turned into an untruth.
I have put “{{}}” around the parts posted to make it easer to see the misuse of this document.
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We have first to learn submission to the will of God ourselves, through various trials, persecutions, and the development of our weaknesses and imperfections, and thereby learn to appreciate the goodness and blessings that flow from him. We must see that we ourselves first learn obedience, and then teach others. But how can we teach others a lesson which we have not learned ourselves?
There is not nation now that acknowledges that hand of God; there is not a king, potentate, nor ruler that acknowledges his jurisdiction. We talk about {{ Christianity }}, but it {{ is a perfect pack of nonsense }}. Men talk about civilization; but I do not want to say much about that, for I have seen enough of it. Myself and hundreds of the Elders around me have seen its pomp, parade, and glory; and what is it? It is a sounding brass and a tinkling symbol; it is as corrupt as hell; {{ and the Devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work that the Christianity of the nineteenth century. }}
(Journal of Discourses, 26 vols. [London: Latter-day Saints' Book Depot, 1854-1886], 6: 167.)
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I just posted a referenced quote.
Your founders are your worst enemies.
I wonder if part of God's judgement in the eternities will be to lock all the LDS presidents in a room together. My money would be on Brigham Young being last MAN standing...
The bodies of heaven of Flesh and Bone are different than how many think it is consitant with the corporal body.
It is quite clear that Taylor is saying the the Christianity of the 19th Century was "a perfect pack of nonsense" and "it is as corrupt as hell and the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century"
So I don't see your point here.
Taylor was not taken out of context. Taylor saw the Christianity of the 19th Century as the work of the devil.
You can try and do a song and dance about what was said, but it is clear he was talking about every other religion other than Mormonism.
19th Century Mormons did not consider the LDS Church to be a branch of "Christendom". 21st Century Mormons are attempting to portray the LDS Church as just another branch of Christendom, but you won't find anyone in authority in the 19th Century (or most of the 20th Century) making that assertion.
Your really cracking me up here.
God is not a lwayer, he does not parse words or decieve. Not MY God.
Huh?
Asbestos underwear comes as a standard feature.
Of course Mormons are Christians...
Alma 46
12 And it came to pass that he rent his coat; and he took a piece thereof, and wrote upon it—In memory of our God, our religion, and freedom, and our peace, our wives, and our children—and he fastened it upon the end of a pole.
13 And he fastened on his head-plate, and his breastplate, and his shields, and girded on his armor about his loins; and he took the pole, which had on the end thereof his rent coat, (and he called it the title of liberty) and he bowed himself to the earth, and he prayed mightily unto his God for the blessings of liberty to rest upon his brethren, so long as there should a band of Christians remain to possess the land—
14 For thus were all the true believers of Christ, who belonged to the church of God, called by those who did not belong to the church.
15 And those who did belong to the church were faithful; yea, all those who were true believers in Christ took upon them, gladly, the name of Christ, or Christians as they were called, because of their belief in Christ who should come.
16 And therefore, at this time, Moroni prayed that the cause of the Christians, and the freedom of the land might be favored.
Did you leave that Lutheran church like you said you were going to?
You can see that, I can see that, nearly all of the posters here can see that. What seems to be asserted is that the title of the speech was suppose to be something to encourage the mormons to do better, therefore that portion had to do with encouraging mormons to do better too. If that speech had stayed on that theme, the disputed quotation would never have occurred. But when you read the whole thing, Taylor starts to get off subject about half way. There have been agitators from another website trying to accuse anti's of lying and some how Taylor's view of Christianity as presented in now some kind of lie.
Oh really? Gee, I guess that all those other mormon groups don't count, you know who didn't agree that Young, et al was the prophet. Or those mormons who continued in the 'everlasting covenant' of Sect 132 (which still hasn't been removed). We are far more united than the propaganda you are spoon fed would lead you to believe. How about Neo-orthodox mormons - ever heard about them?
Of course they are NOT!
Yet, you apparently unable to answer “who is Christ”?
And those who would assert that would be liars.
I am a non-denominational Christian. I don't need to carry the baggage of men, being a Christian means Christ helps me with mine.
I wonder if part of God’s judgement in the eternities will be to lock all the LDS presidents in a room together. My money would be on Brigham Young being last MAN standing...
LoL, now THAT would be fun to watch.
Agreed - perhaps the title of the thread should be changed to reflect such.
Thanks, reaganaut. I appreciate your taking the time.
I probably deleted it, sigh.
There have been agitators from another website trying to accuse anti’s of lying and some how Taylor’s view of Christianity as presented in now some kind of lie.
This is a big problem the LDS have. They claim to be the only true church, but when confronted with problems, they say “we don’t believe that anymore” or “that person was speaking as a man, not a prophet.”
How can they know when the prophet is speaking as a prophet. And when the prophet spoke as a prophet and then an new prophet contradicts the earlier prophet.
The JoD was considered scripture by the saints of the time, yet now it isn’t?
Then how can they claim they are still the “true” church founded by JS, and claim to be glad there are prophets, when they ignore these same teachings and prophets. If they no longer believe it, then how can they claim to be the “true church”.
“Cafeteria Mormonism” is rampant apparently.
God does not change. God is not a liar. God is not a God of confusion. At least not MY God.
The LDS god, OTOH, apparently is.
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