Posted on 02/14/2009 9:43:20 AM PST by restornu
"God Became Man So That Man Might Become A God." St. Athanasius
... when the intellect has been perfected, it unites wholly with God and is illumined by divine light, and the most hidden mysteries are revealed to it. Then it truly learns where wisdom and power lie... While it is still fighting against the passions it cannot as yet enjoy these things... But once the battle is over and it is found worthy of spiritual gifts, then it becomes wholly luminous, powerfully energized by grace and rooted in the contemplation of spiritual realities. A person in whom this happens is not attached to the things of this world but has passed from death to life." St. Thalassios, "On Love, Self-control and Life in accordance with the Intellect" Philokalia (Vol. 2)", p. 355)
'Can a man take fire into his bosom, and his clothes not be burned?' (Prov. 6:27) says the wise Solomon. And I say: can he, who has in his heart the Divine fire of the Holy Spirit burning naked, not be set on fire, not shine and glitter and not take on the radiance of the Deity in the degree of his purification and penetration by fire? For penetration by fire follows upon purification of the heart, and again purification of the heart follows upon penetration by fire, that is, inasmuch as the heart is purified, so it receives Divine grace, and again inasmuch as it receives grace, so it is purified. When this is completed (that is, purification of heart and acquisition of grace have attained their fullness and perfection), through grace a man becomes wholly a god." St. Simeon the New Theologian (Practical and Theological Precepts no. 94, Writings from the Philokalia on Prayer of the Heart; Faber and Faber pgs. 118-199)
Instead of telling me what your idea of God is not, can you do it over and just tell me what you believe God is.
You know, tell me what you think God is without bashing Mormon beliefs.
Here is the question again;
Please relate what you believe the doctrine of the Trinity adds to your understanding of what happened before “In the beginning”
Hey, I'm not a "dancer." Either we help define beliefs by contrast, or we "dance" in a way that seeks to ne'er step on toes.
So tell me who your God is, and not who He isn’t.
++++++
From what I have seen of your testimonies, you seem to be nothing more then a nonMormon.
Fred to Colofornian - From what I have seen of your testimonies, you seem to be nothing more then a nonMormon.
________________________________________________
Which is more than enough to make the God of the Bible happy with Colofornian...
And I did that in post 119:
(1) He is social. Relational. Even apart from His relationship to angels and mortals.
(2) He relates perfectly within Himself as well as to others due to His omniscience and omnipotence and omnipresence. And due to His eternal immortality, He's always been that way -- He hasn't had to "grow" into such perfection. The Biblical passage that perhaps best applies here omniscient-wise is 1 Cor. 2:10-11: The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God. For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the man's spirit within him? In the same way no one knows the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God.
Don't you see, Fred? I could ask you the question based upon this passage of who among your friends or family knows your thoughts except your spirit? Yet, neither one of us would claim that your spirit is a separate entity from you, would we? (No!) You and your spirit are one -- and more one with you than just having the same purpose and will. Likewise, the Holy Spirit and the Father are one (in more than just purpose and will). The Holy Spirit knows the Father perfectly -- something only a divine entity could do -- and yet this knowledge is perfect relational knowledge...not just what we would call "head knowledge."
(3) He has authority in Himself, which means He has no father-god, no grand-god, grand council, etc. to get things approved.
(4) The Trinity is partriarchal. The Father is recognized as the Source of beings (angels, people). This keeps the theological picture of Creator vs. creature crisply in focus.
(5) Another important "omni" is omnipresence. The Trinity is able to give high treatment to this with, for example, the Holy Spirit. He is everywhere and is therefore not limited by a localized body.
(6) The Trinity allows us to give the highest recognition to Jesus Christ. The Jesus of the Bible was equal with God (Phil. 2:6) and shared the Father's glory (John 17:5).
Eph. 4: 14 14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
Well, here's my best testimony - and it includes God's testimony in your KJV...please note all these synonyms for "testimony" here -- "bear record,""bear witness,""witness", "testified,""the record," etc. :
For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.
He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.
And this is the record, that God HATH GIVEN [present tense] to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
He that HATH [present tense] the Son HATH life; and he that HATH NOT the Son of God HATH NOT [present tense] life.
These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye MAY KNOW [present tense] that ye HAVE [present tense] eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. (1 John 5:7-13)
Fred, you've asked me a lot of questions over the past year and a half or so. And you've asked a lot of questions of others. It's time for you to answer some, if you please:
Do you have the witness or testimony in yourself that you have belief in the Jesus Christ of the Bible? (1 John 5:10)
Have you embraced the treasured record that you HAVE eternal life right now? (1 John 5:11)
Do you have the Son of God now? (1 John 5:12)
Do you know with complete certainty that you HAVE eternal life? (1 John 5:13)
You see more than eternal life being any kind of progression, it's a relationship with a true Father-Son Being: And this is eternal life, and you KNOW the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom He has sent. (John 17:3)
Do you know Him as He is?
F, we have been telling you what God is - you just don't want to listen and only want to insist that the definition of mormonism is correct. Your boring little question has been answered - now the decision is in your corner. Are you going to continue to believe the word of a man of highly dubious character, or the tested teachings of the bible.
Only for Clarity.
shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach Adonai
8 For by grace you are saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, for it is the gift of God; 9 Not of works, that no man may glory. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus in good works, which God hath prepared that we should walk in them. (Eph 2)
Now don't get me wrong, I have an admiration for the strong spirituality and devotion to family that the Mormon people hold on too. Plus I like the way they vote. But seeing these daily devotionals each morning when I pull up FreeRepublic is nearly as annoying as that dreaded doorbell ring that you knew was coming when you saw the two nicely dressed young men biking through the neighborhood.
No it isn’t just you. It drives me to distraction. In fact I almost feel that I must refute each and every one of their inane posts - - but I try to refrain, at least sometimes.
Well played, and very true.
Not that it matters to some, for there is what is true, and what is “truth”
Just ignore the man behind the curtain. Let you feelings guide you.
Oh but the irony drips off that one...
At least he is consistent...
Use the farce Luke...
God has eternal life because He has no beginning no end.
Eternal life has no beginning and no end.
Now you have just taught me that I can have eternal life, even though I have a beginning.
Does eternal life have a beginning or not?
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