Posted on 12/02/2008 10:25:39 AM PST by NYer
Ultimately ... it matters not.
thanks-very interesting
In the "big picture" of course the actual date is irrelevant.
But, as the article says, "If you lived with the Mother of Our Lord, what would you ask of her? EVERYTHING. 'Mother, what was Jesus’ favorite food? When was He born? What games did He play as a child? What were His first words?…'”
You want to know as much about your Beloved as you can.
Interesting theories. But I’d say it’s just as likely that Christians set the date to piss off the pagans.
Mostly it matters to those who call Christians pagan for celebrating it.
Rosh Hashannah is associated with the "Birthday of the World." It is supposed to coincide with the day on which G-d created Adam. Rosh Hashannah occurs in the fall, never close to March 25.
BTW, my non-Christian understanding is that the early Christians chose the date to coincide with the Roman Saturnalia so that their celebration would not be particularly conspicuous.
ML/NJ
Yes. The dispute with the East is not about the date of Christmas, but which calendar to use. According to the Julian calendar which the Orthodox use to this day for liturgical purposes, the date of December 25 is on Gregorian January 7. Prior to the synchronization of the calendar with the Catholic West in 1917, any Russian would tell you that he is celebrating Christmas on December 25, and you Westerners just don't know when December 25 is.
The point of the article is that there are plenty explanation for the date of December 25 that are intrinsic to the Christian worldview, and not a result of a pagan influence.
April 17th
I always found it interesting that Luke 2:8 gives us “Now there were shepherds in that region living in the fields and keeping the night watch over their flock.”
Sheep were typically penned up at night or driven into caves. In the spring, however, the shepherds kept them out in the fields because they were birthing lambs (don’t forget Jesus was the “lamb of God).
So unless it was springtime the shepherds would have been home in bed rather than watching over their sheep.
I wonder why the Apostles never celebrated Christ’s birth? And if they did, I wonder why such celebrations are not in the Bible?
John says at the end of his Gospel that there is much more that could have been recorded that was not recorded. Just because the Bible does not record the celebration of Jesus' birth doesn't mean such celebrations did not happen. It is not necessary to know the actual calendar date of Jesus' birth to believe in him.
Biblical Dates for the Birth of Yochanan the Immerser and for the Conception and Birth of Yeshua HaMashiachshalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach Adonai
Yeah, that's right, thanks for the great pic though.
Of course they asked Mary.
Wow ... interesting observation! I had never considered that.
The Apostles celebrated His Resurrection. That is far more important than His birth. IIRC, birthdays were not considered important events in those times. Descendancy was what mattered and still does, in that part of the world as evidenced by Matthew 1:1-17. The first question asked, even today, is "What is your (family) name?"
No hostility intended, but this is not true. The Creation season (Ro'sh HaShanah and the week prior) comes in the fall, not the spring.
“I always found it interesting that Luke 2:8 gives us “Now there were shepherds in that region living in the fields and keeping the night watch over their flock.”
Sheep were typically penned up at night or driven into caves. In the spring, however, the shepherds kept them out in the fields because they were birthing lambs (don’t forget Jesus was the “lamb of God).
So unless it was springtime the shepherds would have been home in bed rather than watching over their sheep.”
I have a tendency to agree with you. It might just be that Christ was conceived on Dec 25, rather than born on that date. I wonder how many shepherds would be out watching their flocks in the winter time? It’s an interesting theory. I don’t know enough about all that went on at different times of the year to know for sure. But if Israel has the same seasons as we do in this hemisphere, then it would make sense that He was born at the end of summer.
Again, I don’t know enough to make a real educated guess, but it does make for an interesting debate. It’s one of those mysteries we’ll find out someday.
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