Posted on 05/16/2008 12:06:26 AM PDT by Gamecock
After modeling a seeker-sensitive approach to church growth for three decades, Willow Creek Community Church now plans to gear its weekend services toward mature believers seeking to grow in their faith.
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Since 1975, Willow Creek has avoided conventional church approaches, using its Sunday services to reach the unchurched through polished music, multimedia, and sermons referencing popular culture and other familiar themes.
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.....surveyed congregants at Willow Creek and six other churches, suggested that evangelistic impact was greater from those who self-reported as "close to Christ" or "Christ-centered" than from new church attendees. In addition, a quarter of the "close to Christ" and "Christcentered" crowd described themselves as spiritually "stalled" or "dissatisfied" with the role of the church in their spiritual growth. Even more alarming to Willow Creek: About a quarter of the "stalled" segment and 63 percent of the "dissatisfied" segment contemplated leaving the church.
(Excerpt) Read more at christianitytoday.com ...
Amen!
I think that is where the dissatisfaction stems from. They reach a point where they begin to realize they need a Saviour and know that their relationship with Jesus is not what it should be. I think this a wonderful step in the right direction.
Exactly.
No revelation is not the same as insight.
Lectio is supposed to engender "new" personal insight, not new dogma.
Yep.
Unfortunately, she is also considered by many to be a Universalist.
Well...since Protestants form their doctrine on prayer from the Bible, and not church tradition, we disagree because the Bible holds to one form.
Some are called to other practice of prayer. It is always to be under proper guidance by a competent spiritual director.
Protestants don't have, or need, "spiritual directors".
Protestants don't pray by emptying their minds through breathing, body posture and relaxation techniques. We don't come to know God through "silence". Our revelation of God comes through the completed Scriptures.
Excellent post.
She made many similar statements.
In contrast, Jesus Christ said, "I am the way, and the truth and the life: no one comes to the Father except through me." (John 14:6)
“This “huge shift” ain’t good! “
You’re correct. Exit seeker-sensitive churches. Enter the emerging and emergant churches. Makes me want to scream. The lines are very blurred.
Nail on the Head. Gud Jub!
“They also, falsely, believe that the Church’s primary reason for existing is evangelism. It is not. It exists for God’s glory and for the edification of the saints.
Seeker sensitive worship is the antithesis of Paul’s direction and therfore unbiblical (not glorifying to God).”
Do you discursively pray without ceasing? What constant chatter that must be.
We don't come to know God through "silence".
"Be still and know that I am God."
Protestants don't pray by emptying their minds through breathing,..
Another common misconception; you are never "empty" or alone. What is in your mind or psyche if you empty it of you?
Protestants don't have, or need, "spiritual directors".
Surely wisdom and experience is valued by Protestants; or does each start anew? Dangerous and unnecessary.
Our revelation of God comes through the completed Scriptures.
This wouldn't be the "personal revelation" you criticized earlier would it?
Thanks for your reply.
Can you share God’s love without sharing Jesus as well?
“Preach the gospel. And if necessary, use words.” - St. Francis of Assisi
I hope you are right, but I’m wondering if book and tape sales have slowed, and he’s decided that he can sell a new set of material to everyone who bought the first set.
Ah...yes, Psalm 46:10. Lets see it in context (NASB):
1God is our (A)refuge and strength, [b]A very (B)present help (C)in trouble. 2Therefore we will (D)not fear, though (E)the earth should change And though (F)the mountains slip into the heart of the sea; 3Though its (G)waters roar and foam, Though the mountains quake at its swelling pride. Selah. 4There is a (H)river whose streams make glad the (I)city of God, The holy (J)dwelling places of the Most High. 5God is (K)in the midst of her, she will not be moved; God will (L)help her when morning dawns. 6The nations (M)made an uproar, the kingdoms tottered; He (N)raised His voice, the earth (O)melted. 7The LORD of hosts (P)is with us; The God of Jacob is (Q)our stronghold. Selah. 8Come, (R)behold the works of the LORD, Who has wrought (S)desolations in the earth. 9He (T)makes wars to cease to the end of the earth; He (U)breaks the bow and cuts the spear in two; He (V)burns the chariots with fire. 10"Cease striving and (W)know that I am God; I will be (X)exalted among the nations, I will be exalted in the earth." 11The LORD of hosts is with us; The God of Jacob is our stronghold. Selah.
The Hebrew is better translated "cease striving" as in put down your weapons and do not worry for God shall vanquish, or has vanquished, Israel's enemies.
This wouldn't be the "personal revelation" you criticized earlier would it?
Nope...I was referring to Scripture, itself, as the revelation.
"So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ." (Romans 10:17, NASB)
Because saving faith only comes through the hearing of the Word of Christ. (Romans 10:17, NASB)
You and I won't agree on the doctrines that divide Catholics and Protestants. The closest we will come is that I have an uncle that is a bishop and another that is a priest in the RC church. I am sure that they would agree with you.
It is the only way that salvation in Christ occurred in Scripture.
That is why in Romans 1, the Apostle Paul states that he is under obligation to give the Gospel to Greeks, non-Greeks, the wise, and the foolish. He was eager to preach the Gospel and he was not ashamed of it because: "it is the power of God for salvation of everyone who believes: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. For in the gospel a righteousness from God is revealed, a righteousness that is by faith from first to last, just as it is written: The righteous shall live by faith." (Romans 1:14-17)
Thank you for this ping! This is the church the Lord used to awaken me from the dead. Yet I have not been back there since 9 months after I was saved because it was nothing more than colostrum for me. I probably will never step foot back in there but it does my heart good that maybe they will “feed the sheep” more than they have desired to for many, many years.
To God alone be the glory!!!
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