How Mormons Saw Romney -- In wooing evangelicals, he made some fellow LDS members uneasy

Newsweek ^ | February 8, 2008 | Sally Atkinson

[Zakeet]

In his pursuit of the presidency, Mitt Romney held fast to his Mormon faith, though his religion remains controversial with evangelicals and some other Christians. But his determined (and ultimately futile) wooing of evangelicals led him to make some statements that didn't quite square with Mormon beliefs and culture. And the effort itself may have deepened the impression of him as inauthentic—even to some fellow Mormons.

Early in his presidential bid, Romney was asked what he thought of polygamy. Prompted by what they considered a divine revelation, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints discontinued the practice more than a century ago, and the church distances itself from polygamist "fundamentalists." But Romney went one step further, saying he couldn't "imagine anything more awful than polygamy." Many Mormons were privately taken aback. Mormons believe that, in its time, "plural marriage" was a commandment from God, and they are, as a group, fiercely proud of their ancestors, hundreds of whom practiced polygamy. (Romney's own great-grandfather had five wives.) LDS church members loathe the polygamy stereotypes and jokes bandied by outsiders. But hearing Romney—the most recognizable face of their faith these days—disavow it in those terms was mildly unsettling to LDS insiders.

Others were puzzled to hear Romney say he reads the Gideon Bible—a version popular with evangelicals: Mormons uniformly study the King James version, in a Salt Lake edition that is cross-referenced to all other Mormon scripture. "Seems like he just figured he had to say the safest, most Protestant thing he could think of—that was kind of annoying," says Russell Arben Fox, a Mormon professor of political science at Friends University in Wichita, Kans.

[lady lawyer]

LOL. Where on earth do you get your stuff? Google “burned over district”

[nicmarlo]

VARIOUS VERSIONS OF VISIONS

lol....that looks like an entree! So many to pick from!! : )

[Elsie]

 

 I do not need to accept all your doctrines and creeds to be a Christian.

 

You do, however, need to follow THIS creed to be an LDS member:

 

---

 

Articles of Faith

The Articles of Faith outline 13 basic points of belief of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
The Prophet Joseph Smith first wrote them in a letter to John Wentworth, a newspaper editor, in response to Mr. Wentworth's request to know what members of the Church believed.
They were subsequently published in Church periodicals.
They are now regarded as scripture and included in the Pearl of Great Price.

 

 

 

THE ARTICLES OF FAITH
OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS
History of the Church, Vol. 4, pp. 535—541

 

 

1. We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.
   
2. We believe that men will be punished for their own sins, and not for Adam's transgression.
   
3. We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.
   
4. We believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are: first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, Repentance; third, Baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost.
   
5. We believe that a man must be called of God, by prophecy, and by the laying on of hands by those who are in authority, to preach the Gospel and administer in the ordinances thereof.
   
6. We believe in the same organization that existed in the Primitive Church, namely, apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, evangelists, and so forth.
   
7. We believe in the gift of tongues, prophecy, revelation, visions, healing, interpretation of tongues, and so forth.
   
8. We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.
   
9. We believe all that God has revealed, all that He does now reveal, and we believe that He will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God.
   
10. We believe in the literal gathering of Israel and in the restoration of the Ten Tribes; that Zion (the New Jerusalem) will be built upon the American continent; that Christ will reign personally upon the earth; and, that the earth will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal glory.
    
11. We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may.
    
12. We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.
    
13. We believe in being honest, true, chaste, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men; indeed, we may say that we follow the admonition of Paul—We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things, and hope to be able to endure all things. If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things.

Joseph Smith

 

 

[Elsie]

To the Mormon's I am pinging to this, please do not start a religion debate, we've done that, I want to understand the thoughts behind these comments...

Sure you do.

[greyfoxx39]

The anti-Mormon, Romney haters at Newsweek, on FR, and elsewhere are subliminally sorry Mitt dropped out of the race ...
Bcause now they no longer have anyplace to direct their animosity and bitterness.

BITTERNESS?

[Elsie]

I think that some of the misunderstanding between Evangelicals and Mormons arises from the fact that we use different terminology to refer to the same things.

On this; we agree - almost.

I'd say that identical words are used with different definitions.

[DelphiUser]

Ah. Then you believe you are my judge? You don’t believe it is between me and Christ, but that I must accept all of your creeds and doctrines?

It's interesting that Jesus said what it took to be called by his name:
Matthew 10:32

32 Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.

I guess, he feels he can add tot he Gospel of Jesus Christ:
Galatians 1: 8-9

8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any bother gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

It's interesting to me anyway...

[lady lawyer]

The name “Mormons” is a nickname deriving from the Book of Mormon. It has never been the official name of our Church, which is, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Groups such as the RLDS and the polygamist breakaways are no longer “Mormons” because they are no longer members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Some still share some of our doctrines, I think. But since priesthood authority is the hallmark of the restored church, and since they reject that authority, I would not call them “Mormons.”

The “Reorganized” church, BTW, is no longer called that. They call themselves the Community of Christ. They seem to share our doctrines less and less, from what I can determine. They joined the World Council of Churches, for example, which I’m told means they have to accept the Nicene Creed.

[POWG]

Do any of you guys have REAL jobs or do you just spend all of your time on FR waging futile battles with people who are no more inclined to change their views than you are?

[Elsie]

I do think, however, that the complete rejection of the necessity of works is an abominable doctrine. If people think they can break the commandments with impunity just by shouting “Jesus,” they are more likely to do it.

Your argument is NOT with Christians...

 

 

  John 6:24-30
 24.  Once the crowd realized that neither Jesus nor his disciples were there, they got into the boats and went to Capernaum in search of Jesus.
 25.  When they found him on the other side of the lake, they asked him, "Rabbi, when did you get here?"
 26.  Jesus answered, "I tell you the truth, you are looking for me, not because you saw miraculous signs but because you ate the loaves and had your fill.
 27.  Do not work for food that spoils, but for food that endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give you. On him God the Father has placed his seal of approval."
 28.  Then they asked him, "What must we do to do the works God requires?"
 29.  Jesus answered, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent."
 

[DelphiUser]

Our 'lay pastors' are spokemen for THEIR religion!

So you accept Fred Phelps as a spokesman for Christians?

(Just an example, I don't expect anyone who knows anything about him to accept him as a spokesman. which makes me wonder, is he a Christian, I mean you guys are judging us ion tenets he agrees with you on...)

[Elsie]

‘Gideon’ isn’t a version, it’s a... well, a non-profit publisher, I guess. And as far as I know, it’s only “popular” with hotel furniture.

http://www.gideons.org/Tgi.web/TGI.Web.PublicWebSite/Default.htm

[Elsie]

How do you deal with Romans 4:1-5 and Ephesians 2:8, 9 ???

BY ignoring them?

[Elsie]

I realize you are saying we started it...

Obviously; you do not believe it.

[greyfoxx39]

But since priesthood authority is the hallmark of the restored church, and since they reject that authority, I would not call them “Mormons.”

Since the LDS reject the hallmark of the Trinity, some would not call them Christian.

[Syncro]

I was glad to see your comments referring to Jesus:

Believe in Him. Worship Him. Love Him. Acknowledge Him as the Creator of this world. Be grateful for His sacrifice for me. Look to Him as an example of how I should live and try, in my very imperfect way, to emulate Him. Try to keep His commandments and teach my children and grandchildren to do likewise. Bear witness of His gospel. I was glad to see this comment by you, showing your love for and belief in Jesus

Jesus Christ.

Noticing that Mormon Prophets mention Christ quite a lot, what is your take on this from Mormon teaching:

In bearing testimony of Jesus Christ, President Hinckley spoke of those outside the Church who say Latter-day Saints "do not believe in the traditional Christ.”No, I don't. The traditional Christ of whom they speak is not the Christ of whom I speak. – Prophet Gordon B. Hinckley, LDS Church News, June 20, 1998, p.7

Do you believe in the Mormon "Christ" or Jesus Christ of the mainsteam Christian denominations?

A Prophet of LDS and the last President said this in 1998.

[greyfoxx39]

Do any of you guys have REAL jobs or do you just spend all of your time on FR waging futile battles with people who are no more inclined to change their views than you are?

Care to define what is more "real" than an immortal soul?

[Elsie]

This brings forth another question - was there a revival going on in 1820? Records indicate that the answer was no. If this was not happening, then did Smith really have a visitation at all? Why, after this alledged visitation, three years later Smith sought to join one of these apostate churches?

Hey!!

How DARE you use historical fact to bring suspicion on the motives of our Glorious Founder, Joseph Smith (pbuh)?

Haven't we WARNED you before about this?

--MormonDude(Do NOT get me started!)

[Zakeet]

Re: This brings forth another question - was there a revival going on in 1820? Records indicate that the answer was no. If this was not happening, then did Smith really have a visitation at all? Why, after this alleged visitation, three years later Smith sought to join one of these apostate churches?

WHICH FIRST VISION ACCOUNT SHOULD WE BELIEVE?

LDS faithful believe it all began when 14-year-old Joseph Smith, the church's founder, had a vision of God and Jesus Christ in a grove of trees in 1820.

Our whole strength rests on the validity of that vision. It either occurred or it did not occur. If it did not, then this work is a fraud. If it did, then it is the most wonderful and important work under the heavens. - LDS President Gordon B. Hinckley, Salt Lake Tribune, Oct. 7, 2002, pages A1 & A6

You might find the above linked article and the embedded video interesting.

[nicmarlo]

Jesus was the “only begotten” in the flesh.

In addition to being the only Begotten Son of God, Jesus is the Word of God, and IS God. He is the CREATOR, not the CREATURE. Jesus is above ALL, including the angels. The Catholics as well as Martin Luther, as well as ALL Christian sects believe this to be true.

John 1:1

In the beginning was the Word,
and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Hebrews 1:

1 In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the
prophets at many times and in various ways,
2 but in these last days He has spoken to us by His Son,
whom He appointed Heir of all things, and through whom He
made the universe.
3 The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the
exact representation of His being, sustaining all things by
His powerful word. After He had provided purification for
sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.
4 So He became as much superior to the angels as the name He
has inherited is superior to theirs.

5 For to which of the angels did God ever say,
"You are My Son;
today I have become your Father"? Or again,
"I will be his Father,
and he will be My Son"?

6 And again, when God brings His firstborn into the world,
He says, "Let all God's angels worship him."
7 In speaking of the angels He says,
"He makes his angels winds,
His servants flames of fire."
8 But about the Son He says,
"Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever,
and righteousness will be the scepter of Your kingdom.