A big part of the confusion, I've thought for decades is like this: Moses says, wonderfully, "The Lord will fight for you and you have only to be still."
Mad Dawg says, "Learning how to be still could take a lifetime. (And even after that lifetime of struggle, it'll still be Grace that taught and Grace that let you learn."
And so it's at that area of thinking about pastroral care and "moral theology" (as distinct from ethics and morality) naturally lends itself to language that focusses on the subjective. And it SOUNDS like we're talking about works, works considered as somehow autonomous.
There IS some kind of effort, or subjective perception of effort, in, say, paying attention when I read the Bible. I mean I can think about, Oh, I don't know, my new kitty, Clint, and the local sheriff's election, both of which fascinate and divert me, or I can kind of gather myself, do a mini act of penitence (just plain "Sorrow", would be a better term) for being so labile and unfocussed and, once again, turn to my reading, asking God to steer my alertness and thought and such.
But, at the end it will be God's Spirit in me reading God's word, and at the end I simply cannot say,"Wow, I'm a good little boy, I read my bobble!"
Still there was that, as I say, subjective perception of effort.
Go ahead: Try to stop trying .....
heh heh heh
Have I given my "doing an original proof in geometry" analogy? How important is it (and how is it important) to build the altar HERE before the fire falls over there?
Thanx! My system seems to breeze through the chemo... soon as I realized my worst symptoms were coming from stuff that was given to me to deal with symptoms, I quit taking any of the "cures" & started eating candy that covered the yucky taste in my mouth. First kinda chemo needed peppermint patties & the one that I'm on now needs gummy orange slices.
We'll have to get back to Aquinas later.
A big part of the confusion, I've thought for decades is like this: Moses says, wonderfully, "The Lord will fight for you and you have only to be still."
This reminds me of Don Juan's teachings to Carlos Castanada. Our doings confirm our preconceived notions about the universe, tie us to it. Don Juan tried many different strategies to teach Carlos how to be still. After Don Juan finally convinced Carlos that his note taking (a doing) was hindering Carlos' understanding, he got Carlos to stop taking notes, but then Don Juan realized that not taking notes was an even worse hindrance.
Mad Dawg says, "Learning how to be still could take a lifetime. (And even after that lifetime of struggle, it'll still be Grace that taught and Grace that let you learn."
Yes, true. As long as we think "it" is about our "doings", it is.
And so it's at that area of thinking about pastroral care and "moral theology" (as distinct from ethics and morality) naturally lends itself to language that focusses on the subjective. And it SOUNDS like we're talking about works, works considered as somehow autonomous.
I have to confess, I read through the rest of this response of yours & am caught up in your use of "doing an original proof in geometry" analogy?. A portion of my previous response to you involved something like , "Grace is a plane", but because of the time limits I was dealing with, that part got sent to the cutting room floor.
Our free will places us above or below the plane. I think I'm going out on a limb when I say your position would be equivalent to man having an ability to pierce the plane as he moves from above the plane to below it and visa versa, while mine says that it is God that causes every single piercing of the plane. We might delude ourselves into thinking we're the ones doing it, but in truth, if we're using free will, we're not on that plane.
There IS some kind of effort, or subjective perception of effort, in, say, paying attention when I read the Bible. I mean I can think about, Oh, I don't know, my new kitty, Clint, and the local sheriff's election, both of which fascinate and divert me, or I can kind of gather myself, do a mini act of penitence (just plain "Sorrow", would be a better term) for being so labile and unfocussed and, once again, turn to my reading, asking God to steer my alertness and thought and such.
I ask for the steering, without the guilt.
As a mom who occasionally used the phrase, "you can help by watching", while my sons were growing up, I think most of my attempts to "help" are probably seen by our Father in much the same way.
But, at the end it will be God's Spirit in me reading God's word, and at the end I simply cannot say,"Wow, I'm a good little boy, I read my bobble!"
Correct.
Still there was that, as I say, subjective perception of effort.
You try to do more than help by watching, you might end up with cake batter all over the ceiling, floor, the walls, the table and yourself.
Go ahead: Try to stop trying ..... Try to stop trying to stop trying. It's sumpin like trying to breath at a normal rate while thinking about it.
Have I given my Have I given my "doing an original proof in geometry" analogy?
I don't think I've heard that one. Do I have to remember any theorems? Will I find myself stuck in circular thinking with no way out?
How important is it (and how is it important) to build the altar HERE before the fire falls over there?
I dunno, cuz I've no idea where HERE or there are.