Posted on 04/26/2007 6:03:35 AM PDT by Alex Murphy
Thank you, I see that you are correct. The revised addition is almost identical.
My mistake.
The problem is that polytheism connotes the worship of many gods. Often these various gods represent objects or forces in nature, such as the Sun, the Moon, and so forth.
Perhaps the word you are looking for is tritheism, defined by my dictionary as "the doctrine that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are three distinct Gods." That more accurately describes our belief.
That said, I should point out that Mormons worship one God, God the Father, in the name of the Son (D&C 18:40; 20:29). So in that sense, we are monotheists.
Theologically, Mormons would have to come up with some doctrine more similar to the Trinity in order to be monotheists.
Even if we were to do as you suggest, it would not satisfy everyone's definition of monotheism. Muslims, who are strict monotheists, often call Trinitarian Christians "polytheists." To a certain extent, polytheism is in the eye of the beholder.
Amen. If one has placed their faith in the wrong version of Jesus, that faith and that false Jesus cannot save them. It only condemns them for rejecting the genuine Christ.
If you have ever attended a Mormon Sunday worship service, what they state when they serve communion is "I believe the Church is true, etc." Their unique beliefs about Joseph Smith, their relationship to God and their Church, is far more interesting than the fact that they "believe in Jesus Christ."
In John, Jesus tells His disciples that He would be leaving them but that they should not be troubled. "If I go," He said, "I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also."
Thomas was rather puzzled over this asking how it was possible to know how to get where Christ was going. Jesus replied, "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me" (John 14:6).
Christians throughout the centuries have pointed to Jesus Christ as the only way to salvation. Too spend eternity in the presence of the Father, it is imperative to come to faith in the Jesus Christ of the Bible, preached by the Apostles and believed on by the historic Christian faith. It is also imperative to understand that, as a sinner, no one can work their way into His presence. Jesus compared salvation to passing through a narrow gate and declared that few were going to find themselves passing through it (Matthew 7:14).
In spite of Jesus' clear affirmation, Marion Romney, a former member of the LDS First Presidency, perverted the words of our Lord when he said, "This Church is the ensign on the mountain spoken of by the Old Testament prophets. It is the way, the truth, and the life"---Conference Report, April, 1961, pg. 119.
Jesus warned over and over, that there would be many false teachers and false prophets who would come preaching another jesus and another way of salvation than the salvation He and the Apostles preached, calling them "thieves and robbers".
Any individual, group, or church claiming that salvation can be found only within their little circle must be viewed with suspicion. Mormonism certainly qualifies.
While publicly, especially since the LDS church a few decades ago began it's PR campaign to improve it's public image to appear to be just another "mainline Christian denomination", the LDS church does not publicly proclaim it is the only way to salvation, it's leaders do in their writings, conferences, etc, as do LDS members when not in the public eye.
For instance, note the words of Ezra Taft Benson, the 13th LDS President;
"This is not just another Church. This is not just one of a family of Christian churches. This is the Church and kingdom of God, the only true Church upon the face of the earth..."---Teachings of Ezra Taft Benson, p.164-165.
Also note the teaching of Brigham Young;
"From the day that the priesthood was taken from the earth to the winding up things of all things, every man and woman must have the certificate of Joseph Smith, junior, as a passport to their entrance into the mansion where God and Christ are -- I with you and you with me. I cannot go there without his consent"----Journal of Discourses 7:238.
Both of those are completely contradictory to the proclamations of Christ that He is the way, the truth and the life. The LDS has set itself up as the way, through Joseph Smith.
Jesus and the Apostles warned us time after time of deceivers who would pervert the Gospel and would come in the name of Jesus, while being subversive to the faith.
No needlenose only in your mind!:)
Wrong, it's just as LDS doctrine states it.
“United in love and purpose” does not make them mono. Any three people could be united in love and purpose, so this does not distinguish it from poly.
Theologically, Mormons would have to come up with some doctrine more similar to the Trinity in order to be monotheists.
IMHO, of course.
Rational thinking is not allowed.(wink)
I am still trying to fine the Trinity Jesus in the OT!
I guess according to your Logic it is Duo in the OT being the fact you had Elohim and Jehovah.
****
I looked up the word Trinity =
Threefold; triple.
Of or relating to an astrologically favorable positioning of two celestial bodies 120° apart.
In astrology, situated 120° apart.
n.
A group of three.
In astrology, the aspect of two planets when 120° apart.
Trine Christianity. See Trinity (sense 2).
****
Thanks very much for your reply.
If I understand correctly, you are saying Mormonism does have three Gods, somewhat described as tritheism - three distinct Gods - however only one is worshiped, God the Father.
So, again if I understand you, there is a distinction drawn between having a God and worshiping a God.
I’m still not sure why tri (three) is not poly (more than one or many). The emphasis in Judeo-Christianity is strongly on monotheism, “Our God is One”, so clearly three would be verbotten.
This of course is why in orthodox Christian theology the Trinity is so central and important.
It is true that non-Christians, Muslims as you note, but also Jews, see the Trinity as insufficient monotheism; however, I would argue that Mormonism is at least one step further away. If one posits that the Trinity is insufficient monotheism, then Mormonism would have to be even more so.
I hope I’ve not misunderstood you and thanks again for your well-communicated and courteous reply.
Please explain to me D-fendr there is
1- Heavenly Father who begat his Only begotten Son
2- Jesus Christ has a resurrected body of Flesh & Bone
3- Holy Spirit who is a Ghost no body of Flesh & Bone
So you have the Heavenly Father, and His Only begotten Son, of Flesh & Bone, a Holy Spirit who is a ghost!
1- God the Father
2- Jesus who has a resurrected body
3- Holy Spirit who is a ghost
You have some here with Celestial bodies, and One that is a ghost
In the West, being more academic and rationalistic, the mystery has been more defined in terms; in the Eastern Orthodox much less so - in fact it is an area of some contention between RC and EO churches.
I could point you to the Catechism on this, or the Nicene Creed (which is the most basic formulation and requirement for belief). However, if you wish a longer more complete discussion, St. Athanasius's "On the Incarnation" is considered the best source by most:
Thanks for your reply..
I think this is a different definition/description than in Mormonism.
Celestial body means resurrected body of Flesh and Bone!
Are you saying Jesus does NOT have a resurrected body?
The definition of Trinity came after the preisthood of the Lord was removed off the earth!
It is a was arrived at the concencus of men!
There is the word Godhead in the scriptures but NO Trinity!
“I just wish there wasn’t so much bigotry against the Church of Fast Coyote. You see, I have my own planet (”it’s called “Earth”) and I am it’s God!
Thank God (that’s me) that no one is allowed to object to the religious beliefs of another person based on logical grounds, otherwise the Church of Fast Coyote would be in trouble. I have decided to run for president, please all vote for me (God) and don’t bring my religion into it.”
So, who does the Church of FastCoyote worship? I know that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints worships Jesus Christ. Let’s accept, for a moment, that the LDS Church is just something that somebody made up. Does that make it any different than the rest of Protestantism, if it worships the same Lord?
Your argument is based on the flawed premise that our worship of Jesus Christ is in any way comparable to your proposed worship of FastCoyote. We DIDN’T just make Him up.
Of course there are many terms in theology that are not in scripture; that’s somewhat the point of theology or exegesis in general.
This applies to all religions’ theology.
As far as a scriptural basis for the Trinity, there are many. A couple of quick ones:
Matthew 3:13-17
Then cometh Jesus from Galilee to Jordan unto John, to be baptized of him. But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me? And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him. And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him: And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
And the Great Commission to evangelize is clear in naming the Three Persons:
Matthew 28:19
Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.
thanks for your reply..
Jesus is the Word Incarnate, the Word become flesh. God the Father, the Holy Spirit, no.
So, I was saying the term “Celestial Bodies” for the Triune God, therefore, would be inaccurate.
thanks for your reply.
I’m sorry, I don’t understand your comment. Could you please explain what you are trying to say?
You still have NOT answered my question from Post #192-
Are you saying Jesus does NOT have a resurrected body?
So, I was saying the term “Celestial Bodies” for the Triune God, therefore, would be inaccurate.
The Holy Ghost doesn't have a body!
Isn’t the argument that mormon’s consider themselves and want others to consider them as a christian?
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