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1 posted on 01/27/2007 6:12:37 AM PST by NYer
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To: Lady In Blue; Salvation; narses; SMEDLEYBUTLER; redhead; Notwithstanding; nickcarraway; Romulus; ...
In keeping with guidelines posted by the Religion Moderator, I am posting this thread (and future ones) a series on the Early Church Fathers, as a Catholic Caucus. Protestants are welcome to post comments but restraint from attacks, would be appreciated. This thread is posted to inform, support and defend the historic orgins of the Catholic Church.

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2 posted on 01/27/2007 6:16:13 AM PST by NYer (Apart from the cross, there is no other ladder by which we may get to Heaven. St. Rose of Lima)
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To: NYer

Good article, with my usual caveat that "Catholic" means The Church as we ALL, Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, "Eastern Catholics" and Latins can and do define it in the Creed.


3 posted on 01/27/2007 6:16:52 AM PST by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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To: NYer

"Protestantism is based on the allegation that the Catholic Church became corrupt shortly after 312 AD. That’s when the emperor Constantine converted and made Christianity the state religion. It is alleged that pagan converts came into the Church bringing with them many of their pagan beliefs and practices. According to Protestant historians the pagan practices that were brought into the Church became the distinctive doctrines of Catholicism. Thus the Catholic Church was born and true Christianity was lost until the Reformation. But history tells us a different story."

I don't know that this paragraph is accurate. I think it might be more genuine to say that Protestants believe(d) that the Catholic Church was corrupted over time, leading to the Reformation. The 1200 years between Constantine and Luther is a period of many movements, changes, tendancies and events in the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church at the time of Luther was not something that today's Catholics would be happy with either. There were real, actual, serious problems, and they didn't appear overnight with Constantine. The Reformation didn't just happen because some people went loco 500 years ago. The Counter-Reformation was apparently a non-event to this author.

As is all to common, this author sets up a Protestant straw-man, and proceeds to pound it. Not to say that Protestants don't do the same thing when making the contra-argument.


7 posted on 01/27/2007 6:38:18 AM PST by cdcdawg
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To: NYer
Jesus gave us a guarantee. He said: "I will build my Church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it." If the Protestant hypothesis is correct, the gates of hell did some serious prevailing and Jesus Christ is a liar. But of course such is not the case

I'm not aware of any Protestant hypothesis that states Hell prevailed against the church that Jesus founded...There was however, tremendous persecution thru-out the Dark Ages for Jesus' church as Foxes Book of Martyrs does attest to...

13 posted on 01/27/2007 7:11:43 AM PST by Iscool (There will be NO peace on earth, NOR good will toward men UNTIL there is Glory to God in the Highest)
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To: NYer; Religion Moderator; P-Marlowe; xzins; Dr. Eckleburg; HarleyD

RM:

Objection. This thread is protected by being ID'd as a Caucus, but even a cursory reading of shows that is a anti-Protestant polemic rather than a RC devotion.

Furthermore many of the posts are a discussion of alleged Protestant error.

I move this thread be opened to general discussion.

I will go back into lurk and while I await your ruling


18 posted on 01/27/2007 7:40:47 AM PST by Gamecock (Ecclesia reformata, semper reformanda secundum verbum Dei)
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To: NYer

Well, NYer, I've now read 59 posts on this thread. The reaction of some of the Protestants to it is exactly why I have in the past remarked about the use of the term "Catholic" on these threads when the subject is the theology of The Church, especially if one is going to discuss the Fathers. It ALWAYS leads to some attack on the Roman Church when an otherwise interesting and potentially valuable discussion of patristics, from an era long before the Reformation and having little or nothing to do with the excesses of the Medieval Latin Church against which the Protestants revolted, could have occurred.


64 posted on 01/27/2007 9:14:23 AM PST by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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To: NYer
Protestantism is based on the allegation that the Catholic Church became corrupt shortly after 312 AD. That’s when the emperor Constantine converted and made Christianity the state religion.

Interestingly, that is what Dante (who was Catholic) felt as well. He has several popes in hell in his book. As it is, when you bring a huge amounts of pagans into a different religion, they are bound to integrate some of their customs into the new faith. Nothing wrong with it.

99 posted on 01/27/2007 11:38:47 AM PST by Hacksaw (Appalachian by the grace of God!)
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To: NYer; nickcarraway; sandyeggo; Lady In Blue; american colleen; ELS; Pyro7480; livius; ...
Catholic Discussion Ping!

Please notify me via FReepmail if you would like to be added to or taken off the Catholic Discussion Ping List.

How many times have we wanted to discuss the Early Church Fathers?

This is your chance!

143 posted on 01/27/2007 4:40:10 PM PST by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: 2ndMostConservativeBrdMember; afraidfortherepublic; Alas; al_c; american colleen; annalex; ...


146 posted on 01/27/2007 5:50:57 PM PST by Coleus (Roe v. Wade and Endangered Species Act both passed in 1973, Murder Babies/save trees, birds, insects)
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To: NYer
Naturally we would expect that those who were taught directly by the Apostles would themselves believe and teach correctly.

This is quite laughable when one considers the many admonitions Paul gave the early churches in the New Testament.

147 posted on 01/27/2007 6:33:54 PM PST by Between the Lines (I am very cognizant of my fallibility, sinfulness, and other limitations. So should you.)
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To: NYer
The Early Church Fathers

The Early Church Fathers on The Church (Catholic Caucus)

Early Church Fathers on (Oral) Tradition - Catholic/Orthodox Caucus

154 posted on 01/28/2007 6:08:03 AM PST by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: NYer

Reading all posts with interest.


172 posted on 03/06/2007 7:47:48 PM PST by Ciexyz (Is the American voter smarter than a fifth grader?)
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