Posted on 12/15/2006 8:27:49 PM PST by Dajjal
None of the faithful Catholics are told about this vision until 1941 when Lucia becomes a nun. According to Lucia, she was told in 1917, that if the vision's "requests are heeded, Russia will be converted." Well ---- what happened for 24 years? How could the faithful pray the rosary for Russia's catholicization, unless they knew of the request by the vision? And no one knew about it until 1942 when it was released by Cardinal Schuster on the orders of Pius XII.
Why then? Why not sooner? Didn't beleaguered Russia need catholicization before 1942? How could poor Russia be helped without all those rosaries that no one knew to pray because Lucia kept it all a secret?
What was so special about the date of its release in 1942? It wouldn't have anything to do with the Vatican's hopes for prayers and rosaries on behalf of the German Wehrmacht's successful "crusade" into the heart of Russia taking place at that time, would it? Let's see, is that the third secret or the fourth secret?
Protestants waltz through life in 3/4 time, praying to God the Father in the name of God the Son inthe power of God the Holy Spirit. Our Catholic brothers keep trying to shoehorn a fourth party into this waltz and add goddess the mother to the equation.
Now, that's officially old!
officially, it's called bearing false witness and libel.
You are mis-informed. She said to pray for the conversion of Russia. Conversion means to turn to God, not to become Catholic. Catholics need conversion too.
None of the faithful Catholics are told about this vision until 1941 when Lucia becomes a nun.
You are mis-informed. Lucia became a nun long before 1941, people in the hierarchy were informed of the visions long before 1941. Catholics in Portugal knew about the visions in 1917. 70,000 of them were there to winess it, including socialist newspaper reporters who took pictures.
Did you know that there was an election in Portugal that was going to happen just after the miracle of the sun? The communists were heavily favored to win the election. The communist newspapers sent reporters to the pre-announced miracle site (Fatima) to mock the religious faithful. But when even the atheistic communist reporters saw the miracle of the sun, (and the miraculous drying of everyone's clothes) they left astounded and reported what they saw in their anti-religious socialist newspapers. The result - the communists lost the election. Thank God.
faithful pray the rosary for Russia's catholicization
No, not "catholization(?)", conversion. Conversion meaning "turning toward God". Also, Mary said to pray that Russia "not spread her errors to the rest of the world". That error is atheistic Communism. I keep praying that atheistic communism dies out completely and I hope you do too. As for 1942, world events were matching what the secrets said would happen. The hierarchy's was naturally more interested in the secrets after they started being fulfilled.
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as for this article, dear Sister Lucia said in 2000 that the secrets were properly revealed
"Wow. Cool. So, an Ecumenical Council was Satanic."
Ah, yes, we can always count on good old bornawhat? to jump in and distort anything said on the subject.
"Their hatred of the Church is visceral"
I wonder if you really believe that falsehood.
Well, I'm sure that is a surprise to most Catholics. But there weren't many in Russia, were there? There were a lot of Russian Orthodox, especially in 1917. So what would the conversion mean? Convert from what to what? Was that a conversion from Russian Orthodox to Roman Catholic? or did all those Russian Orthodox need conversion to God as well? There is quite a lot of confusion here.
None of the faithful Catholics are told about this vision until 1941 when Lucia becomes a nun.
You are mis-informed. Lucia became a nun long before 1941, people in the hierarchy were informed of the visions long before 1941.
Who is doing the misinforming here? If the hierarchy knew about it before 1941, and if rosaries were needed for that "conversion" to take place, why did the hierarchy keep it a secret until 1942? Didn't they want all of those rosaries to be said before 1942? Didn't they want Russia to be converted before 1942?
Catholics in Portugal knew about the visions in 1917. 70,000 of them were there to winess it, including socialist newspaper reporters who took pictures.
But did they report about those messages, or that there were any messages at all. Did Lucia and her siblings at that time report anything about a message? Why not? Nothing for 24 years -----
Also, Mary said to pray that Russia "not spread her errors to the rest of the world". That error is atheistic Communism.
But once again, how can people pray for Russia not to spread her errors if none of the faithful Catholics are told to pray for that until 1942? The time to have prayed was in the 1920's and 1930's when it could have been stopped before millions of those needing conversion are slaughtered and killed in the gulags. Where was the message then?
Instead the message is released in 1942 when Russia is then an ally of the United States, when the German Wehrmacht is under the Russian guns in Leningrad, and Germany's illustrious crusade to conquer Russia is in need of divine intervention of those prayers and rosaries for Russia to finally get religion. The timing is so suspicious. You do understand.
as for this article, dear Sister Lucia said in 2000 that the secrets were properly revealed
Well, knowing that she will be facing an uncertain duration in that Catholic purgatory, with her release from such dependent upon all those masses, rosaries, and petitions from the RCC hierarchy, would you expect her to say anything different?
Did anyone believe otherwise?
Conversion means turning towards God. If you did not know, Russia was at the brink of the atheistic communistic revolution throughout 1917. Look up the "February Revolution" and Lenin's "April Theses". You will see that Russia certainly needed a turning towards God.
None of the faithful Catholics are told about this vision until 1941 when Lucia becomes a nun.
Lucia became a nun in 1928, not 1941. She wrote the secrets in 1933, following a vision she had of Jesus in 1931. She was told to give the message to the Pope, not the general public.
Didn't they want all of those rosaries to be said before 1942? Didn't they want Russia to be converted before 1942?
The pope in 1917 had already called for the rosary to be prayed for peace and for an end to the war. Praying the rosary for peace and conversion was no secret at all; the rosary had been prayed for that purpose for over 600 years.
The "secret" was that the pope should consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. Mary said that if Russia was not consecrated to her heart, "Russia will spread its errors around the world".
Up until the '80's, Communism WAS spreading all over the world. Pope John Paul II made the consecration in 1984. Soon after, Communism in Europe collapsed without a shot being fired. That's pretty miraculous in my opinion. (some here may question whether or not the consecration was valid, but Sister Lucia said it was acceptable, and that is good enough for me.)
would you expect her to say anything different?
I expect her to faithfully and humbly serve the Truth, Christ Jesus, as she always did.
The impassioned desire to shoe-horn a goddess into the Christian pantheon is, I regret to say, the primary obstacle to Christian unity between protestants and catholics. The lust to elevate a mortal human woman to near-parity with Deity is an ongoing rock of offense, a scandal, a stumbling block to Biblical Christians.
In the cult of the BVM, we encounter one who has most of the attributes of deity: she hears prayers, provides an alternate means of salvation, grants visions and mystical experiences, and is the fount of new revelations. And, something in fallen human nature prefers a goddess to the God of the Bible.
We all know there are
334!
I say cover up!
Who do you work for,
the Freemasons, the Mormons,
Mel Gibson's people?!?!?!
Could this be the apostacty that the Blessed Virgin feared? Those at the top of the Church refused to do as Mary wished and thought they knew best.
"In the cult of the BVM"
You are hugely misinformed, and it seems that previous attempts to offer you the truth have fallen on deaf ears. I wish there were something that could be done about that, but until you're ready to listen, I don't know what it could be.
"Up until the '80's, Communism WAS spreading all over the world. Pope John Paul II made the consecration in 1984. Soon after, Communism in Europe collapsed without a shot being fired."
It ain't dead yet. China, Viet Nam, our own Demonrat Party, and now South America...it's too soon to declare victory.
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Repetition is, well, repetitious.
You mean that all those Russian Orthodox going to church every week and doing their religious things were still atheists?
Russia was at the brink of the atheistic communistic revolution throughout 1917. Look up the "February Revolution" and Lenin's "April Theses".
Lenin and the Bolsheviks needed conversion, most definitely. So why not say the rosary for them to turn to God.?
The pope in 1917 had already called for the rosary to be prayed for peace and for an end to the war. Praying the rosary for peace and conversion was no secret at all; the rosary had been prayed for that purpose for over 600 years. The "secret" was that the pope should consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. Mary said that if Russia was not consecrated to her heart, "Russia will spread its errors around the world".
So then the Catholic faithful were all lied to in 1942. I remember praying the rosary every Friday in Catholic gradeschool in the 1950's for the conversion of Russia. Was it just some big con job? We were told that enough rosaries would do it? Now we find out that all they had to do was this consecration thing and that would have done it. Amazing and it could have all ended in 1917, 1933, 1942, but this isn't done until 1984.
Didn't I just read where America has been consecrated to the Immaculate Heart of Mary as well? What is that for? to bring an end to Communism here? or bring an end to something else?
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