The Catholic Church is here to stay

Vivificat! - A Personal Catholic Blog of News, Commentary, Opinion, and Reflections ^ | 1 September 2006 | Teófilo

[Teófilo]

The Church will withstand every challenge from without and from within; for nothing will ever separate us from the love of Christ; because in Christ we have overcome the world, and because the powers of hell and death will not prevail against the Church.

Folks, according to AFP/YahooNews:

Catholic Church will survive all tests: Pope

ROME (AFP) - The Roman Catholic Church will overcome any ordeals encountered, just as it weathered Muslim invasions, Nazism, communism and Enlightenment philosophy,

Pope Benedict XVI has said.

The Church lives and will continue to live, just as it has survived "two thousand years of history ... despite its suffering and its weaknesses," he said at the papal summer residence of Castel Gandolfo outside Rome.

Speaking with priests from the nearby Albano diocese, the pope reached as far back as the first Christian communities in Asia Minor (present-day western Turkey) and North Africa, and talked of "Muslim invasions."

"The Church seemed finished then," the pope said, quoted by the ANSA news agency, adding that numerous saints had revitalised the religion.

The Roman Catholic religion also overcome 18th century philosophers of the Age of Enlightenment, such as Rousseau and Voltaire, and also Karl Marx and Adolf Hitler "who wanted to destroy Catholicism ... and had all the means to do so," the German said.

"Faith is stronger than currents that come and go," the pope stressed. "We must therefore be courageous (as the church) represents never ending hope."

Commentary. Allow me to gloat a little: we're not going anywhere, people. We've survived persecutions by every tyrants from every continent and age. We've survive an onslaught of new ideas, some religious, some philosophical, some secular, keen on burying the Church "soon." Instead, we have buried them, as we will bury those we face today and that we'll face tomorrow.

Why is this so?

First, there is a promise:

Jesus saith to them: But whom do you say that I am? Simon Peter answered and said: Thou art Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus answering, said to him: Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-Jona: because flesh and blood hath not revealed it to thee, but my Father who is in heaven. And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven.(St. Matthew 16:15-19, Douay-Rheims)

Then, there is this certainty:

For I am sure that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor might, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. (Romans 8:38-39, ibid.)

Which is also a certainty shared by St. John the Apostle, as he wrote:

You are of God, little children, and have overcome him. Because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.(1 John 4:4; ibid)

Sure, we will all be wounded in this process; some of these wounds will be self-inflicted. We will fall, but then, we will rise, like Christ on the way to Golgotha

Yet, with all her faults, the Church is the bride of Christ, and she who is "the assembly of those who have been called"--that's what "church" or ekklesia means in Greek, will be restored.

I draw great comfort from these certainties. That's why very few things faze me any more; for I confident in ultimate victory of the Lamb and of his Bride. In fact, we have already overcome the world.

So, let us glory in the Lord for his infinite love and praise and thank Him for having made us participants of His infinite bounty.

[Ottofire]

I don't hate any Catholics

Color me ... skeptical ...

I have some very close friends who are Catholic

I think we've heard that line before.

LOL. "I have even been seen TALKING to Catholics. Sat down and ATE dinner with one once. They really do smell funny up close."

As a person with at least a few dozen family members in the Catholic church, this is totally hysterical!

As a Reformed Christian, those pedophile priests are the equal to any person reading this post, for he who is without sin, cast the first stone. God shall judge, and judge with total justice.

I would be surprised that these priests are still priests. Anyone have any good Catholic news sources on what is happening on this front, or is it getting brushed under the rug? (No sarcasm, haven't heard anything...)

[Salvation]

I see that Teo didn't label this thread as a "Caucus" thread even though it is about the Catholic Church.

Shall we start labeling all the Catholic threads with a "Caucus" label??

No that would be un-American and make us sound more like dimocrats than Republicans.

As Bill O'Reilly would say "Truly the ridiculous item of the day."

[Salvation]

*8God shall judge, and judge with total justice. **

I happen to know of at least three Protestant ministers who have abused children -- two in the hundreds.

Who cast the first stone here?

Why don't you just go away?

[Ottofire]

Please, if you think I was saying anything other than we are all sinners, you misunderstand.

I am from a predominantly Catholic family. Please, I am NOT bashing Catholics.

100% of Protestants are SINNERS, as well as Catholics. I am asking an honest question, something which I have heard nothing about, and I pray to God that the Catholic church is doing something to these bastards posing as priests.

Should anyone be shown to have abused children, they should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law and after the law has put a bullet in their head God will commit the final judgement whether they are Mormons, Catholics, Baptists, or whatnot.

Please remove the chip. I am sure that you are a fine person underneath it.

[Iscool]

good article...

[wideawake]

Don't mess with Catholics, they're a little touchy.

I notice that if you call black people n******, they get all touchy too. What is their problem?

[kindred]

King James Version

Revelation 17.The Book of Revelation
Chapter 18

1 And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory.
2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.
6 Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double.
7 How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously, so much torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow.
8 Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.
9 And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning,
10 Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come.
11 And the merchants of the earth shall weep and mourn over her; for no man buyeth their merchandise any more:
12The merchandise of gold, and silver, and precious stones, and of pearls, and fine linen, and purple, and silk, and scarlet, and all thyine wood, and all manner vessels of ivory, and all manner vessels of most precious wood, and of brass, and iron, and marble,
13 And cinnamon, and odours, and ointments, and frankincense, and wine, and oil, and fine flour, and wheat, and beasts, and sheep, and horses, and chariots, and slaves, and souls of men.
14 And the fruits that thy soul lusted after are departed from thee, and all things which were dainty and goodly are departed from thee, and thou shalt find them no more at all.
15 The merchants of these things, which were made rich by her, shall stand afar off for the fear of her torment, weeping and wailing,
16 And saying, Alas, alas that great city, that was clothed in fine linen, and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious stones, and pearls!
17 For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off,
18 And cried when they saw the smoke of her burning, saying, What city is like unto this great city!
19 And they cast dust on their heads, and cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas, alas that great city, wherein were made rich all that had ships in the sea by reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made desolate.
20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged you on her.
21 And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.
22 And the voice of harpers, and musicians, and of pipers, and trumpeters, shall be heard no more at all in thee; and no craftsman, of whatsoever craft he be, shall be found any more in thee; and the sound of a millstone shall be heard no more at all in thee;
23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.
24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

Revelation 19

[Teófilo]

Outside of the Church, I can make the Bible say whatever I want it to say.

You wasted your time quoting Scripture to suit your own purpose, spinning into the private interpretation of your choice:

And we have the more firm prophetical word: whereunto you do well to attend, as to a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts: Understanding this first, that no prophecy of scripture is made by private interpretation. For prophecy came not by the will of man at any time: but the holy men of God spoke, inspired by the Holy Ghost. (2 Peter 1:19-21, DR)

So please, spare me the anti-Catholic spin.

-Theo

[Campion]

Anyone have any good Catholic news sources on what is happening on this front, or is it getting brushed under the rug?

Other than a couple of dioceses in danger of bankruptcy, you mean?

I don't think anything's getting "brushed under the rug" when there are tens of millions of dollars and the future existence of the Catholic Church in some parts of the country at stake, no.

There are also unscrupulous lawyers trolling in prisons for men who will testify that priests abused them. As one reportedly said, "Whether it's true or not doesn't matter ... there's a lot of money at stake here."

OTOH, I recently read an estimate that there may be more sexual abuse victims among students in public schools in California than there are students, period, in the Catholic school system in that state.

But you won't hear about that from the secular media.

[Campion]

A prophecy against apostate Jerusalem in the first century. We know that to be the case because it parallels Jeremiah 25 and other passages in the OT concerning Jerusalem in the days before the Babylonian conquest, and because Revelation 11:8 tells you exactly what the "great city" is ... "which is allegorically called Sodom and Egypt, where their Lord was crucified".

But of course we actually believe in the Bible and understand how to interpret it, unlike some so-called Christian traditions which misuse it as polemical tract and ignore both the literary and historical context of the Scriptures.

Oh, and ...:

And the voice of harpers, and musicians, and of pipers, and trumpeters, shall be heard no more at all in thee; and no craftsman, of whatsoever craft he be, shall be found any more in thee; and the sound of a millstone shall be heard no more at all in thee

You won't find "craftsmen" and "millstones" in Catholic churches, because this is describing a city, not a church, exactly like it says it is.

[Ottofire]

I am sure that Cali is rife with the abusers in the school system, being Cali and all.

And the media is always ready to swoop in like a vulture on anything vaguely religious to make hypocrisy charges.

I think that is why we must be on guard to defend those wrongly accused within the church vigorously, and condemn those that do wrong more so. Even the appearance of hiding wrongdoing becomes the defending of it in the eyes of the enemies of the faith.

[Campion]

I agree completely.

But this is clearly a campaign hatched in hell to damage or destroy the Catholic Church.

[Krista33]

Not to be picky here, but the Rev. Samuel Parris who put to death many innocent people accused of witchcraft in the Salem witch days, was a Protestant Christian. Oh, and the Ku Klux Klan also claims to be Protestant Christian. And what about the thousands and thousands of people put to death in Protestant Germany after the Reformation because of 'witchcraft'?

Somehow the Catholic Church is always judged by the actions of a few of its so-called members, but no other church is... I don't understand that.

Do I believe those 'Protestants' who commited horrible crimes like that to be christian? If I am permitted to judge for a moment... no way. Would protestants claim them in their 'church'? I doubt it. I am intelligent enough to understand that even if someone claims to be a Christian, their actions might not mesh with that. I do not condemn all of Protestantism for this... Why are Catholics persecuted this way?