Posted on 03/16/2006 7:42:26 AM PST by Gamecock
I see what you mean.
Yes, an "explosion" of reason, fact and levelheadedness. It must be excruciating to watch.
SD
And your point is?
I'm sure I could Google up some ex-priests who are now Proddies, wouldn't you agree?
I'm not a baptist, but the reason why our government is a representative democracy is to lessen the chance that it will be easily corruptible as hiearchial governments surely are.
Roman Catholics need to admit that the reason Protestants (and even baptists) exist at all is chiefly due to the corruption in the renaissance Roman Catholic church and secondly, due to our freedom of religion (directly coming from Protestant's fear of the tyranny of centralized religion).
On Calvinists burning things: In England (and Scotland) the Monarch seized Church lands (25% of the land, and therefore in those days, the wealth), which were usually under the supervision of monasteries. Did their cloisters and chapels get destroyed? You bet, but it wasn't a bunch of religious fanatics doing it...more often than not it was the nobility to whom Henry VIII gave those lands... As to the murders at the Somerville Convent--being in the (overwelmingly Baptist) South, I'll attribute that to Yankee barbarism.
I do have serious issues with the Calvinist iconoclasm though...indeed many of these were fanatic.
Currently I am studying (and have studied) Reformation history, and its fascinating (and seems a common human trait) that it was the 2nd Generation from the Reformation times which seem the most extreme. John Calvin for example is, as a rule quite a bit more mild theologically, than the Calvinists of the early 1600s. (and please don't dredge up Servatus....as Roman Catholicism was instigating the burning of thousands of Protestants at the time Calvin executed one (already twice condemned by the Catholic courts) heretic). It seems the children of reformers tend to go too far, before the pendulum swings back.
Didn't have much of one, except (a) his BJU connection is a source of amusement to me (and I think, to him); the "Association of Devoutly Catholic BJU Alumni" isn't one of the world's biggest clubs; and (b) he's not exactly ignorant of the other side of the Reformational polemic.
It was so important to them that most of them didn't practice it or believe in it, at least not early on.
Religious tolerance in America started out at St. Mary's Towne, Maryland, a Catholic settlement. A few months later, Roger Williams founded Rhode Island and Providence Plantations, as a refuge from the religious intolerance of, not Roman Catholics, but Massachusetts Puritans. The experiment in tolerance at St. Mary's Towne ended when the Anglicans paid a friendly visit ... and torched the place.
I doubt there is a Catholic on this thread who would debate the first point. The Church was in need of a cleansing, but not to be tossed aside.
On the second point, the idea of freedom of religion is a backlash against religous coercion and violence from either side. It's not unilateral. You can't tell an Irishman that on St. Paddy's eve.
SD
I am not however surprised that many Evangelicals are crossing the Tiber. They have so diluted their doctrine that when they do crave some depth they think they find it in Rome as opposed to even considering Orthodox Protestantism. I told someone else this just a couple of weeks ago: a RC acquaintance told me that Traditional protestant worship looks more Catholic than mass lately.
An interesting observation, wouldn't you say?
BTW, I was in Rome a couple of weeks ago. It was quite intersting.
I don't understand this comment at all. Nobody speaks for "Roman Catholicism as a whole" except the Vatican. It's like a foreign diplomat demanding an apology from "the USA as a whole, not just the Federal Government".
It's not Calvinist at all, is it?
I'm suprised an Episcopal come out of it.
I think his conversion to CofE came about later, but the ball started rolling at BJU.
They have so diluted their doctrine that when they do crave some depth they think they find it in Rome as opposed to even considering Orthodox Protestantism.
Many of the converts we're getting are coming from what, by any reasonable standard, would have to be considered "orthodox Protestantism". (A friend of mine is ex-PCA, for example.) Their doctrine isn't "watered down" at all; quite the contrary.
a RC acquaintance told me that Traditional protestant worship looks more Catholic than mass lately.
Given the tacky garbage that goes on at some Catholic parishes (too many), that doesn't surprise me in the slightest. It's getting better, though, just ... very ... slowly.
I took up your offer and did a quick check on "google" as to the burning of the Somerville convent. I had never heard or read about it. Apparently it was attacked and burned in 1834, but there is no reference to the several hundred nuns who you believe were were killed in the assault. Is there another reference that I can consult? It seems strange that they include an article, but omit the deaths of so many people.
And I made no such claim. My forefather was a Huguenot.
Where does one find this Orthodox Protestantism? From what I can see, Protestantism is divided into two broad categories: traditional/liturgical/candle-lighting/vestment wearing liberal compromisers, and Evangelical rock concerts (where, at least, high moral standards are generally upheld). Is there a "third way"?
Sure!
Tradtional Reformed
If not for books like this, history would be erased and the 100,000 Protestant men, women and children who were slaughtered for their faith would be forgotten.
An excellent link is found here:
Know what this is?
This is a minor point, but....The term "Roman Catholic" was NOT used before the Reformation in english. You are referring to it in what could only be a Latin form that was more grammatical error than expression of anything. You would be hard pressed to come up with more than three times it was ever used in Latin before the Reformation. As we use it today, it is an English language term, created in the sixteenth century by Anglicans.
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