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Can the Monist View Account for "What Is Life?"
self | February 27, 2005 | Alamo Girl and betty boop

Posted on 02/27/2005 12:55:27 PM PST by betty boop

Can the Monist View Explain “What Is Life?
by Alamo-Girl and betty boop

In this article we would like to address the soundness and adequacy of the monist view of reality which conceives of “all that there is” as ultimately reducible to the concept of “matter in its motions.” This view holds that there is no essential difference between living and non-living systems in nature since both ultimately are expressions of the workings of the physical laws and only the physical laws. This insight or expectation leads one to presume that the laws of physics and chemistry are entirely sufficient to explain how matter came one day to spontaneously generate Life and thus all evolving living systems. This hypothesis is called abiogenesis and, try as hard as many first-rate researchers have done thus far, the fact is it has never yet been scientifically demonstrated.

Darwin studiously avoided abiogenesis in his major works — hence the insistence on the forum that the “theory of evolution” does not include abiogenesis. Perhaps his avoidance of the issue was for political reasons, we don’t know. At any rate, Darwin was known for his speculations about a “warm little pond” though evidently he didn’t want it to be a part of his theory. http://www.evowiki.org/index.php/Abiogenesis.

And yet one readily gets the impression on following the forum debate that many, if not most, subscribers to Darwin’s theory suppose that abiogenesis did, in fact, occur in some far distant past. On this view, biological evolution takes its origin from an unvalidated event that is presumed to be wholly material in character. This materialist aspect is fully consonant with the Darwinian view; abiogenesis rounds out the cosmological view to include a “beginning,” the problem that Darwin sought to avoid.

Implicit in the monist theory is the expectation that the universe is causally closed. All causes are material causes, and what we see all around us is the present cumulative effect of a virtually infinite succession of random material events that have taken place from a virtually infinite past until now. Such causes arise only within the 3+1 dimensional “block” of space-time as we humans normally experience/conceive it.

Yet as Elitzur (1993) points out, “the most essential attribute of randomness is the absence of connection between the states of the system’s components.” Organization, by definition, means that the system’s parts are highly correlated. The converse of “organization” is “reducibility” or “separability.” Therefore, organization means non-separability, connectivity. A. Grandpierre points out that “biological organization is different from physical ordering that is accompanied by a decrease of entropy. While physical ordering (misleadingly called ‘self-organization,’ but its actual meaning is self-ordering) plays an important role in storing information, the dynamical process of government through information is a process with a quite different nature.”

And yet the monist view holds that “all that there is” is fundamentally reducible to material random events or accidents being fortuitously tamed or shaped by physical laws. Which is what you would expect if you think that only material, physical, tangible entities are real. And thus information processing in living systems is a subject that can never come up in the first place; for fundamentally it is an immaterial, intangible process.

And yet here’s the interesting situation that develops from the physicalist (i.e., monist) concept: The physical laws themselves are immaterial, non-physical, intangible entities. It is here that the monist view breaks down as a valid interpretation of nature on its own terms. You can’t at the same time say that physical matter is all that there is and then turn around and invoke an immaterial principle that conditions or determines material behavior without engaging in self-contradiction.

And what can we say about the physical laws themselves — the great laws of motion and thermodynamics? Assuming that they “tame matter” or cause it to behave in certain ways, and assuming that matter is more or less “dumb and blind” (and quite possibly “lazy!”), then the physical laws must possess an informative content. And there’s another very interesting thing about the physical laws: They are in the main all laws of conservation. It has been observed that the amount of information required for conservation of a system seems not to be high, at least in comparison with the amount of information needed for a system to organize itself, modify its behavior, develop, evolve. For matter, left to its own devices (e.g., blind, dumb, and lazy devices), will follow the principle of “least action.” To put this into perspective, Paul Davies (The Fifth Miracle, 1998) writes:

“The laws of physics … are algorithmically very simple; they contain relatively little information. Consequently they cannot on their own be responsible for creating informational macromolecules … life cannot be ‘written into’ the laws of physics…. Life works its magic not by bowing to the directionality of chemistry, but by circumventing what is chemically and thermodynamically ‘natural.’ Of course, organisms must comply with the laws of physics and chemistry, but these laws are only incidental to biology.”

For the above reasons, the present writers remain skeptical about claims issuing from the monist position with regard to the fundamental origin and nature of life in the Universe. There is a need to account for, not only the fact that life cannot be exhaustively explained in terms of what is “chemically and thermodynamically ‘natural’”; but even more importantly, that life seems to work to counter the outcomes predicted by the physical laws.

Of particular interest is the possible relation of entropy and information in living systems. By information we mean the successful communication of a message (or “informative text”) such as to cause a “reduction of uncertainty in the receiver,” as formulated in terms of Shannon information theory. Note that “reduction of uncertainty in the receiver” issues as an actual event by virtue of a “decision” made and thus is analogous to state vector collapse in quantum microsystems, and to realized intended outcomes of sentient beings in “real-world” macrosystems. In all three cases, it appears that the probability amplitude is collapsed into just one “choice,” and all other possibilities vanish into a netherworld of unrealized (at that moment at least) potentialities. In all three cases, we seem to be looking at instances of very frank “quantizations” of “the continuum.”

Thus the thought occurs to one: Perhaps it is the ubiquitous presence of “observers” making “informed” choices which constitutes the irreversible “arrow of time” of the second law of thermodynamics. For “observations” lead to events (decisions) which, in the 3+1D block, constitute a successive temporal sequence of newly produced causes or, more to the point, a history (which can be thought of as evolution in retrospect). And history — like memory — is an irreversible process.

Alternatively, in the Feynman/Everett multi-world models, history may be a sum of histories (the cat is both alive and dead). In the second case the apparent thermodynamic entropy on our particular worldline as observer (the phenomenon which suggests an arrow of time) — is only one selection — though for our worldline that path or arrow of time would likewise seem irreversible. Whether or not it is actually irreversible and whether the arrow of time itself points in one direction only depends on whether there is another temporal dimension (f-Theory, Vafa). We need to mention that we recognize the significance of other multi-world and extra temporal dimension models as competing cosmological views. A fuller treatment of this subject is beyond the scope of the present article.

Now it is controversial that thermodynamics can have anything at all to do with the propagation and transmission of information. Indeed, it is reasonable to draw the negative conclusion, provided that one’s thermodynamical model is the one espoused by Boltzmann, whose hypothesis was that the second law is a law of disorder, of chaos. That hypothesis alone would appear to make thermodynamics a problematical construct for systems that are complex and self-organizing, such as living systems seem to be. And yet living systems are ineluctibly microstates within the global macrostate so well described by the second law of thermodynamics. This problem has been well noted.

Yockey, for instance (in Information Theory and Molecular Biology, 1992), presented a mathematical proof that Shannon entropy and thermodynamic entropy are functions of probability spaces that are not isomorphic. From this mathematical fact, he draws the conclusion that these two entropies have “nothing whatever to do” with each other:

“The function for entropy in both classical statistical mechanics and the von Neumann entropy of quantum statistical mechanics has the dimensions of the Boltzmann constant k and has to do with energy and momentum, not information.”

But what if the sine qua non hallmark or signature of living organisms is that they work by converting thermodynamic entropy into Shannon entropy? This would mean that although the two entropies belong to non-isomorphic probability spaces, living organisms preeminently possess a mechanism to bring the two probability spaces into direct relations. Indeed, that may be the entire point about what it is that constitutes the difference between a living and non-living system.

This is the problem that Hungarian astrophysicist A. Grandpierre tackles straight on in a forthcoming work. It is perhaps surprising that an astrophysicist would veer into biology. It turns out that his researches into the nature of the Sun suggested that astral bodies are self-organizing systems that actively work against the setting up of thermodynamic equilibrium that would otherwise obtain given initial and boundary conditions. In other words, the Sun is not a “hot ball of gas.” And so the resemblance of the Sun’s observed behavior to anything that we normally perceive as “biological behavior” struck him as an interesting problem.

As for the criteria of “biological behavior” to be applied, Grandpierre primarily draws on Ervin Bauer, a Hungarian theoretical biologist and physicist active during the first part of the 20th century, largely under Soviet auspices. Bauer is little known today. (His work, Theoretical Biology [1935], was published only in German and Russian and, we gather, is out of print anyway.) But we think he will make a come-back. For as far as we know, it was Ervin Bauer who first drew thermodynamics into explicit connection with biological theory, and Grandpierre highly values his insights:

“Living organisms do not tend towards the physical equilibrium related to their initial and boundary conditions, but [at all times] act in order to preserve their distances from the deathly physical equilibrium” predicted by the second law.

This says that, unlike physical systems, living systems move in just the opposite direction from that predicted by the second law: that is, living systems, for as long as possible, are devoted to evading or forestalling the eventual total loss of potential energies for the task of productive work, and thus ultimately “heat death.” But if living systems can counter the second law, then one must ask, how do they do that?

Grandpierre notes that “entropy is a somewhat subtle concept just because it connects two fundamentally different realms, of which only one is usually termed as ‘reality.’ Entropy connects the realms of possibilities with the world of manifested phenomena. If one would guess that possibilities do not exist since they do not belong to the phenomenal world, this would be conceptually confusing at the proper understanding of physical world. The central role of entropy is one of the most fundamental laws of Nature; the second law of thermodynamics tells that possibilities do belong to reality — and determine the direction of development of physical systems.”

“Realizing the possibilities” appears to depend on information. And so,

“[First we must] quantify some biologically fundamental aspects of entropy, information, order, and biological organization. Thermodynamic entropy, S and the entropic distance of the human body from its physical equilibrium at constant internal energy [must be] determined quantitatively, together with the number of microstates related to physical, chemical, and biological macrostates.

“We distinguish between physically and biologically possible states. In physical objects internal energy is redistributed by dissipative processes. In living organisms the Gibbs free energy, G is also redistributed, but not only in the individual degrees of freedom, but also by means of the consecutively coupling action of biological organization, which works on the whole set of all possible collective degrees of freedom.”

From the “here determined quantities [that] shed light on the source of biological information….our calculations show that the relatively high value of S [entropy] enhances the ability of living matter to represent information.”

And thus, by “determining the average information flow of a cell in the human body, and determining the enthalpy of a DNA molecule, we can draw quantitative consequences with regard to the static and dynamic information content of DNA. We estimated that the information necessary to govern the >105 chemical reactions sec–1 cell–1 in the 6*1013 human cells requires >1019 bits sec–1 that cannot be supplied from the static sequential information content of DNA ~109 bits for more than 10–10 sec. Physical self-ordering and biological self-organization represent opposite yet complementary tendencies that together cooperate to serve optimal balance. All these results together show that the source of biological information is ultimately to be found in the Bauer principle, in the same manner as the source of physical information is to be found in the [least-]action principle of physics.”

Elsewhere Grandpierre refers to the Bauer principle as the “life principle.” This has been alternatively termed as the fecundity principle (Swenson), or “the will to live.” It is customary to regard DNA as the information source that drives living systems. But having estimated the gigantic information flow present in the human body, and comparing that with the static information content of DNA, Grandpierre realized that there is something like a 20-orders of magnitude deficit in DNA information as compared with this number. We point out that DNA is the same in every cell of the body; and yet different cells are undergoing all kinds of different reactions, are involving themselves in collective modes (formation of macromolecules, organs, etc.) constantly. Obviously, the relatively low information content of DNA cannot explain the huge variety of functions that are taking place in the human body at every instant of time. Another interesting fact is that an organism’s DNA is exactly the same in a living cell as it is in a dead one. Thus if anything, it appears that DNA primarily works at the level of “physically-possible systems” (which are those that are still operational after death occurs), and so does not appear to be the only or even the main factor in biological self-organization, self-maintenance, etc. In order to be effective in the governance of “biologically-possible systems,” DNA itself must have access to a dynamic information source in order to compensate for the deficit of its static information in terms of driving biological behaviors.

So, where does this dynamic information come from? We are usually criticized for introducing a “pink unicorn” at this stage of the argument, for we propose that biological information is carried by a universal field. And yet the existence of fields is uncontroversial in science. We know that there are particle fields, force fields (e.g., EM, gravitation fields), and the reality of vacuum field is also uncontroversial. The main point about a field is its universal extent. Being universal, it is not an “ordinary” object of 3+1D spacetime. Rather, fields constitute matrices in which events happen, ultimately unifying all world processes into one integrated whole.

Fields apply universally to all points in space/time — every where and every when — thus they are neither time-restricted nor spatial coordinate restricted.

Grandpierre argues that, in addition to the other fields identified by science, there is also a “biofield” or an organic zero-point vacuum field that is the carrier of biological information. An analogy might help to explicate the theory. The Internet is a “universal” information field that can be accessed by anyone who has the proper equipment. There are often cases when communications are sent to us over the Internet. DNA stands for the particular “address” at which we can be successfully contacted; DNA is “smart enough” to be a router for incoming information addressed specifically to a particular receiver. And its presence as a router is necessary; otherwise, information being addressed to us would have no efficient way to reach us and, thus, to do us any good.

One might speculate that the physical laws, being also universal in extent and application, may similarly be field-carried phenomena in this sense.

In any case, when we speak of a “netherworld of yet-unrealized possibilities” occasioned by a re-imagined second law, are we not speaking of potentially real things that have to reside somewhere, because they represent states of potentiality that may become actualized? If this “netherworld” is of universal extent, then it would need a field to carry it.

In the space of a short article, we can only briefly touch on the arguments advanced by Dr. Grandpierre and his associates. If you have an interest in looking at his research, the Journal of Theoretical Biology may soon publish an article of his (working title: “Thermodynamic Entropy and Biological Information”) which richly details the merest sketch of certain key points given above, and a wealth of others besides.


TOPICS: Religion & Science
KEYWORDS: abiogenesis; darwinisttheory; davies; elitzur; entropy; evolution; grandpierre; information; thermodynamics; vacuumfield
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To: betty boop

The 2nd Law of thermo does not contain the arrow of time. Like all laws of physics, it has no time preference.


41 posted on 02/28/2005 8:59:03 AM PST by RightWhale (Please correct if cosmic balance requires.)
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To: RightWhale; betty boop
IOW, molecular happiness.

LOLOL! Thanks for the chuckle.

I do have a remark wrt your reply to betty boop. You said:

The 2nd Law of thermo does not contain the arrow of time. Like all laws of physics, it has no time preference.

Observed thermodynamic entropy suggests (but does not prove) an arrow of time:

Time before Time


42 posted on 02/28/2005 9:21:20 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: betty boop
What a beautiful essay-post! Thank you!
43 posted on 02/28/2005 9:22:31 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: betty boop
It's no more meaningful after the revision.

The argument would hold water if the metabolism of each individual cell were entirely independent. On the contrary; the vast majority of metabolic steps are regulated in the same way in all cells.

The tradition of gross misuse of probability theory in the name of religion lives on.

44 posted on 02/28/2005 9:42:01 AM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: Alamo-Girl

Nothing in the observed laws of physics suggests the arrow of time.


45 posted on 02/28/2005 12:17:50 PM PST by RightWhale (Please correct if cosmic balance requires.)
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To: RightWhale
Nothing in the observed laws of physics suggests the arrow of time.

Try the Second Law of Thermodynamics.

46 posted on 02/28/2005 12:19:01 PM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: Right Wing Professor

It's not there. Time can increase either positively or negatively. Physics has no preference for direction on the time axis.


47 posted on 02/28/2005 12:21:13 PM PST by RightWhale (Please correct if cosmic balance requires.)
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To: RightWhale
It's not there. Time can increase either positively or negatively. Physics has no preference for direction on the time axis.

Eddington thought different. Hawking thinks different.

Given dS/dT > 0, replace dT with -dT and show me the result is the same.

48 posted on 02/28/2005 12:27:08 PM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: Right Wing Professor

There is no reason for dS/dT to be greater than zero. The equations work either way. Look forward, look back, all the same. The time axis is a dimension sort of like spatial dimensions. The universe works just as well forward as backward.


49 posted on 02/28/2005 12:31:09 PM PST by RightWhale (Please correct if cosmic balance requires.)
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To: RightWhale; Right Wing Professor; betty boop
I'm with RWP on this, RightWhale. If you scoot down to about page 11 on the link provided at post 42 there is a series of graphics which helps to illustrate the point.

However, quantum cosmology offers another way of looking at space/time; that is why I linked the whole article to put the classic physics view into perspective with the various theories.

In sum, thermodynamic entropy suggests an arrow of time at the level of classic physics, but it doesn't "prove" an arrow of time in the quantum or multi-verse geometry.

50 posted on 02/28/2005 12:40:17 PM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: Alamo-Girl
quantum cosmology offers another way of looking at space/time

Quantum interactions may show the arrow of time, it is possible. But it has not yet been demonstrated. As to entropy, you may choose a sign that fits your observations, but you may not modify the law to make it permanent. Entropy could increase going back in time as well as forward. Physical law in itself does not recognize the arrow of time, but that is okay because it doesn't matter to our particular circumstances.

51 posted on 02/28/2005 12:47:25 PM PST by RightWhale (Please correct if cosmic balance requires.)
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To: RightWhale; betty boop; Right Wing Professor
Thank you for your reply!

It is the quantum, not the classic, which I suggest disputes an arrow of time - more specifically, non-locality and superposition. The classic, the physical laws, on the other hand, are causally imposed - the universe tends to physical entropy, equilibrium, least action and therefore suggests an advancing arrow of time to that end.

Geometric physics, on the other hand, may dispute this. IOW, under f-Theory, if there is an additional temporal dimension, then our timeline is actually a plane and thus reality does not include an arrow of time - but rather the perception of an arrow of time is based on our particular worldline within the hypercube.

But at the classic level of physics, thermodynamic entropy clearly suggests an arrow of time.

I reckon we must agree to disagree...

52 posted on 02/28/2005 1:16:50 PM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: betty boop

2 issues arise.
Firstly, the monist assertion of only a physical world fails to recognize a metaphysical significance in the rules of inference and 'laws of logic'. Just as there are skew lines, parallel and perpendicular lines in space, there would seem to be just as many rules of inference which aren't inutitive nor dependent upon the ones we might recognize intuitively. Our ability to perceive their correlation with a physical world seems to imply a wider domain of logic beyond our mere understanding.

Secondly, although we may have a wealth of technology and advanced science of the physical world around us today, the philosophy has been pondered for millenia by minds as equally as fervant, possibly more honed and focused than our own. When we read Scripture, an amazing volume of God's Word is dedicated to the topic. Scripture also speaks of miracles in greater and lessor cases. To deny such miracles or confine them to misperception is as( or moreso) ignorant of clues to truth than the supposition that those who wrote such things in Scripture spoke from a lack of knowledge.


53 posted on 02/28/2005 1:18:05 PM PST by Cvengr (<;^))
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To: Alamo-Girl
thermodynamic entropy clearly suggests an arrow of time

Yes, but two-headed. It points into the future equally as into the past.

An additional time dimension will eliminate causality.

54 posted on 02/28/2005 1:18:51 PM PST by RightWhale (Please correct if cosmic balance requires.)
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To: RightWhale
There is no reason for dS/dT to be greater than zero. The equations work either way.

No, they don't. The Second Law explicitly states that for a real process, dS/dt is greater than zero. It doesn't work either way. It most definitely works only one way.

55 posted on 02/28/2005 2:09:34 PM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: Alamo-Girl
It is the quantum, not the classic, which I suggest disputes an arrow of time - more specifically, non-locality and superposition. The classic, the physical laws, on the other hand, are causally imposed - the universe tends to physical entropy, equilibrium, least action and therefore suggests an advancing arrow of time to that end.

Quantum statistical thermodynamics does not create any exceptions to the second law.

Show me the indeterminacy in the Schrödinger equation.

56 posted on 02/28/2005 2:13:33 PM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: Right Wing Professor; Alamo-Girl; xzins; MHGinTN; marron; cornelis; PatrickHenry; furball4paws; ...
The argument would hold water if the metabolism of each individual cell were entirely independent. On the contrary; the vast majority of metabolic steps are regulated in the same way in all cells.

Then one of us is misunderstanding the argument, Professor. Obviously, metabolism is a collective phenomenon, not merely a matter of what 6*1013 cells (the estimated number for a 70-kilogram human body) are doing individually. It may be there is a minimal need for “biological information” for metabolism. At that level, the physico-chemical laws seem quite adequate. But biology is more than metabolism. The biological information an organism needs would be precisely that which would pertain to the organization of the cells in biologically useful ways (i.e., ways that support dynamic, coordinated, integrated biological functions within the total system); e.g., the formation of macromolecules, organs, etc.; their maintenance/repair; and so forth.

The tradition of gross misuse of probability theory in the name of religion lives on.

I really do wish I could understand what you mean by this, Professor. Are you (implicitly) suggesting that a person who thinks there are very good reasons why biology may well be irreducible to physics is expressing a “religious” view? The passage that you thought was so underwhelming was written by a person — that would be Dr. Grandpierre — who wants to “keep God out of it,” and is trying just as hard as he can to ensure that outcome. To my mind, if he has any religious tendency at all, it is mainly Buddhist, probably Zen. He accepts Big Bang cosmology, but follows Alan Guth and his disciples in holding that there was a “pre-time” in which a random fluctuation in the “false vacuum” was the triggering event for the Big Bang. I.e., there is no “ex nihilo” creation, for even a “false vacuum” is a something. Hardly Genesis 1–5 here, guy. In short, on these points he and I could not disagree more. And yet I find that doesn’t matter, for the science speaks for itself. That is, the validity of the work does not depend on what cosmological model was loaded in “at the beginning.” That to me argues in favor of the integrity of the work as a work of science. FWIW.

Look, instead of just yelling at each other as usual, why don’t we try to do something useful for a change? What I have in mind is a categorization of the physicalist and physical + biological views, first by giving definitions, and then citing the eminent proponents that stand for one or the other view. The ontological reduction of biology to physics is said to be one of the oldest and most significant problems in science. Not only has the issue never been resolved, but it continues to inspire much heated controversy right up to the present time, as we shall see in what follows.

But first some descriptions/definitions: Under the citation for “The Development of Human Behaviour” in the New Encyclopedia Britannica (1988) we find the following admirable descriptions:

The Physicalist View
“Some scientists advocate the view that human beings do not differ qualitatively from other natural phenomena and that human beings are therefore controlled by the same forces that control nature. Since all natural phenomena are composed of the same units (i.e. atoms and molecules), the mechanical laws of chemistry and physics that explain the actions of these basic units provide information about how human beings act as well. The basic model of this mechanistic metatheory is the machine, in which complex phenomena are ultimately reducible to the workings of elementary parts and their relations. Movement of the parts is initiated by an application of forces outside the unit and results in a chainlike sequence of events. Applied to the study of human development, the mechanistic model postulates human beings who are essentially passive and only reactive to outside forces. The individual is at rest until activity is caused by external forces (stimuli) that bring about change (responses). Complex human activities, such as the mental act of problem solving or even the feeling of emotions, can be measured quantitatively (at least in theory) as the action of a multitude of stimulus-response connections.”

The Physical + Biological View
“A contrasting organismic metatheory holds that mechanism is inapplicable to the study of human beings because atoms and molecules within humans fuse to create characteristics that do not exist in isolated parts. A proper knowledge of human beings is lost if parts or elements are studied by themselves; hence, human development must be apprehended in a holistic rather than mechanistic manner. This organismic view applied to the study of human development yields an active model in which individuals are constantly active and in which qualitative change is evident in the individual’s action on the environment…. A third metatheory postulates that human development arises from continuous interaction among different levels of organization, including inner physical and biological phenomena as well as cultural and historical events.”

Now we let the proponents of the two views speak for themselves:

The Physicalists
Grandpierre writes, “The views prevailing today in the universities and in textbooks on physics, as well as in such influential best-sellers as Stephen Hawking’s A Brief History of Time, express the one-sided materialistic view that human beings are mere material objects, the behavior of which will be exactly calculated and predicted by the soon-coming Grand Unified Theory of physics.”

As Hawking himself puts it, “…if there really is a complete unified theory, it would also presumably determine our actions.”

Roger Penrose: “…as I am suggesting, the phenomenon of consciousness depends upon this putative CQG (Correct Quantum Gravity theory).”

But not just eminent physicists entertain such views. As Grandpierre points out, “… [G. C.] Williams (Adaptation and Natural Selection, 1966) articulated the common belief among biologists, expressed both in current teaching and in research, that ‘the theory of selection is based on the assumption that the laws of physical science plus natural selection can furnish a complete explanation for any biological phenomenon, and that these principles can explain adaptation in general and in the abstract and in any particular example of an adaptation.’”

Jacques Monod (Nobel Prize Winner): “Anything can be reduced to simple, obvious, mechanical interactions. The cell is a machine; the animal is a machine; man is a machine.”

As Daniel Stoljar notes, “Physicalism is the thesis that everything is physical, or as contemporary philosophers sometimes put it, that everything supervenes on the physical…. Of course, physicalists don’t deny that the world might contain many items that at first glance don’t seem physical — items of a biological, or psychological, or moral, or social nature. But they insist nevertheless that at the end of the day such items are wholly physical.”

Which gets us into the really “good stuff”:

Richard Lewontin: “We take the side of [materialist] science in spite of the patent absurdity of some of its constructs, in spite of its failure to fulfill many of its extravagant promises of health and life, in spite of the tolerance of the scientific community for unsubstantiated just-so stories, because we have a prior commitment, a commitment to materialism. It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world, but, on the contrary, that we are forced by our a priori adherence to material causes to create an apparatus of investigation and a set of concepts that produce material explanations, no matter how counterintuitive, no matter how mystifying to the uninitiated. Moreover, that materialism is absolute….”

Steven Pinker: “Ethical theory requires idealizations like free, sentient, rational, equivalent agents whose behavior is uncaused” … and yet, “the world, as seen by science, does not really have uncaused events.”

N. Pearcy: “Moral reasoning assumes the existence of things that science tells us are unreal.”

The Physical + Biological View
As Grandpierre points out, other eminent thinkers argue against the physicalist (materialist) view, notably Ervin Bauer and Michael Polanyi. These are people who insist that the “decisive point” at issue is the regulative mechanism of biology on the boundary conditions of physics.

Augros and Stanciu: “All the properties of the organism we have discussed so far — its astonishing unity, its capacity to build its own parts, its increasing differentiation through time, its power of self-repair and self-regeneration, its ability to transform other materials into itself, and its incessant activity — all these not only distinguish the living being from the machine but also demonstrate its uniqueness amid the whole of nature…The organism is sui generis, in a class by itself.”

Bertalanffy: “For these features we have no analogue in inorganic systems…mechanistic modes of explanation are in principle unsuitable for dealing with certain features of the organic; and it is just these features which make up the essential peculiarities of the organisms.”

Pattee: “We find in none of the present theories of replication and protein synthesis any interpretation of the origin of the genetic text which is being replicated, translated and expressed in functional proteins, nor do they lead to any understanding of the relation between particular linear sequences or distributions of subunits in nucleic acid and proteins, and the specific structural and functional properties which are assumed to result entirely from these linear sequences.”

Bertalanffy remarked that “According to Pattee (1961), the order of biological macromolecules is not adequately explained as an accumulation of genetic restrictions via selection, but replication presupposes well-ordered rather than random sequences. Thus there are principles of “self-organization” at various levels that require no genetic control. Immanent laws run through the gamut of biological organizations.”

Polyani draws attention to the fact that “machines seem obviously irreducible…. They do not come into being by physical-chemical equilibration, but are shaped by man. They are shaped and designed for a specific purpose…. Only the principles underlying the operations of the watch in telling the time could specify your invention of the watch effectively, and these cannot be expressed in terms of physical-chemical variables…. Nothing is said about the content of a book by its physical-chemical topography. All objects conveying information are irreducible to the terms of physics and chemistry…. The laws of inanimate nature operate in a machine under the control of operational principles that constitute (or determine) its boundaries. Such a system is clearly under a dual control…. Any chemical or physical study of living things that is irrelevant to the working of the organism is no part of biology, just as the chemical and physical studies of a machine must bear on the way the machine works, if it is to serve engineering…. Biological principles are seen then to control the boundary conditions within which the forces of physics and chemistry carry on the business of life. This dual action of a system is said to work by the principle of boundary control ... such shaping of boundaries may be said to go beyond a mere “fixing of boundaries” and establishes a “controlling principle” … [that] puts the system under the control of a non-physical-chemical principle by a profoundly informative intervention…. The question is whether or not the logical range of random mutations includes the formation of novel principles not definable in terms of physics and chemistry. It seems very unlikely that it does include it.” [bolds added]

Well, there’s some “grist for the mill.” People who wish to entertain the idea that one or the other side of this debate must be right are free to do so, and may draw their own conclusions. I just meant to suggest to you dear RWP that this is not at all a situation in which the “case has been closed.”

Thank you so very much for writing!

57 posted on 02/28/2005 2:41:40 PM PST by betty boop
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To: Cvengr; Alamo-Girl; xzins; MHGinTN; marron; cornelis; PatrickHenry; furball4paws; RightWhale; ...
Two most excellent points, Cvengr, so worthy of deep pondering! The monist assertion leaves no room for "metaphysical things" -- such as (say) laws, principles, logic, rules of inference, etc. [I'm tempted to toss mathematics and especially geometry down the same rat hole. :^)] All are wiped out!!!

Matter rules all the same!

58 posted on 02/28/2005 2:55:28 PM PST by betty boop
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To: All

In that post above I wanted to demonstrate by means of Diagram Feynmanian that time is irreversible BECUASE we have to make sense of it.


59 posted on 02/28/2005 3:05:09 PM PST by bvw
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To: betty boop

"I just meant to suggest to you dear RWP that this is not at all a situation in which the “case has been closed.” "

Suggest all you want. Evolution is a fact.


60 posted on 02/28/2005 3:05:57 PM PST by shubi (Peace through superior firepower.)
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