Posted on 01/04/2005 6:06:26 AM PST by Catholic54321
The Asian tsunami disaster should make all Christians question the existence of God, Dr Rowan Williams, the Archbishop of Canterbury, writes in The Telegraph today.
In a deeply personal and candid article, he says "it would be wrong" if faith were not "upset" by the catastrophe which has already claimed more than 150,000 lives.
Dr Rowan Williams: Prayer provides no 'magical solutions' Prayer, he admits, provides no "magical solutions" and most of the stock Christian answers to human suffering do not "go very far in helping us, one week on, with the intolerable grief and devastation in front of us".
Dr Williams, who, as head of the Church of England, represents 70 million Anglicans around the world, writes: "Every single random, accidental death is something that should upset a faith bound up in comfort and ready answers. Faced with the paralysing magnitude of a disaster like this, we naturally feel more deeply outraged - and also more deeply helpless."
He adds: "The question, 'How can you believe in a God who permits suffering on this scale?' is therefore very much around at the moment, and it would be surprising if it weren't - indeed it would be wrong if it weren't."
Dr Williams concludes that, faced with such a terrible challenge to their faith, Christians must focus on "passionate engagement with the lives that are left".
His comments came as Tony Blair finally broke his silence on the tragedy, branding it a "global catastrophe" that would take the world "years" to deal with. The Prime Minister, who has faced criticism for not cutting short a family holiday in the Egyptian resort of Sharm El Sheikh, also insisted that the United Nations should lead the international aid effort. He praised the "extraordinary generosity" of the British people, whose donations topped £60 million last night. The Government has thus far pledged £50 million.
Interviewed by Channel 4 News, Mr Blair said: "At first it seemed a terrible disaster. But I think as the days have gone on people have recognised it as a global catastrophe.
"It is not simply the absolute horror of what has happened and how many people's lives have been touched in different ways, it is also the fact that the consequences are not just short-term and immediate but long-term and will require a great deal of work by the international community for months, if not years, to come.
"We've got millions of people displaced, we've got the potential of disease coming from this and we've got whole areas of that region that will have to be rebuilt."
He shrugged off claims that he should have come home to take charge of Britain's aid effort, adding that he had been in touch "practically hourly" with Downing Street.
Mr Blair said that one of his key tasks during Britain's year-long presidency of the G8 group of leading industrial nations, which started yesterday, was to liaise with other leaders. His faith in the UN seemed undimmed despite the international rows in the months prior to the war in Iraq and he dismissed as a "misunderstanding" claims that President George W. Bush had tried to snub the organisation by setting up a four-country task force with Australia, India and Japan.
"When I spoke to President Bush a short time ago he made it very clear that he wanted the UN to be in the lead and that he sees the work that the US is doing as very much supportive of that," he said.
Mr Blair's intervention was made as it was disclosed that Gordon Brown, the Chancellor, would lead Britain's international anti-poverty drive by going on a three-nation trip to east and southern Africa later this month.
Meanwhile, a 10-man British military reconnaissance team arrived in Sri Lanka to assess how British Armed Forces could best assist the stricken country which, with Thailand, Indonesia and southern India, has borne the brunt of the disaster.
The team will report back to the Permanent Joint Headquarters in Northwood, Middlesex, in the next 72 hours. The main focus of Britain's effort is likely to be directed towards Sri Lanka and the Maldives.
Two Royal Navy ships, the frigate Chatham, currently on patrol in the Gulf, and the Royal Fleet Auxiliary vessel Diligence, already in the Indian Ocean, are heading for Sri Lanka. A C-17 Globe Master transport aircraft, which can carry 100,000lbs of cargo, has also been allocated to supply aid.
The Pope in his New Year message yesterday led prayers for victims at St Peter's Basilica in Rome, and a prayer vigil for victims, survivors and families was being held at Central Hall, Westminster, last night.
On Wednesday, a nationwide three-minute silence will be observed across Britain.
You make my point than you . They do not "blame " their god, because they do not EXPECT him to love them or care for them.
The point is that Christians can not understand coming it from a God "of love" , so they question.
I can understand why the bishop might question God's existence in the wake of the tsunami - it's a natural reaction. but to tell his flock that they SHOULD question God's existence is just irresponsible and quite arrogant too.
True, but often even we Christians fail to accept that we are chastened, sometimes even to the point of death. Like children we often to not see temporal judgement and chastening as being God's will for us, but rather events that were reluctantly allowed to happen and "hurt Him more than it hurt us." And that's just as it relates to tragedies which befall us believers.
What I see from Dr Rowan is what I see from a lot of other Christians I talk to...the struggle to comprehend how a "God of love" can allow such "horrible tragedies" to occur to "innocent people."
I understand. ;-)
Often times, people forget, that while God is a God of Love, He is also as much a God of Justice and Righteousness.
When what God allows or brings to pass does not compute with his intellectual understanding of the way God ought to act, then he loses what he would consider is his "faith." But I suggest his faith is in his own intellectual understanding and not in God.
I doubt that any of us can truly understand what it was that prompted God to either cause this calamity or to allow it to come to pass, but we must all recognize that "all things work together for good." And whether it was directly caused by God's hand or whether God simply did not prevent it, we must understand that his Holy purpose will be served in it. Frankly I see it already in the outpouring of generosity and kindness that is being expressed by those who call Christ their Lord.
Very true, but unlike the gods of the world he ordained a plan to save his people .
Advice from an old Indian carpenter: Keep both hands on the hammer and you will never smash your fingers. If you have to hold the nail, get a friend or your wife to hold the nail for you.
The Daily Telegraph has identified one of Anglicanism's most serious weaknesses, its inability to communicate in English.
It is commonly referred to as "Episcobabble," the ability to render circuitous and pious sounding speeches without actually saying anything. It hides the fact that the vast majority of Anglican clergy are almost totally ignorant of the meaning of the Scriptures or of traditional orthodox Christianity. Why refer to something so old-fashioned when you can base your sermon on the sayings of Sufi Rumi instead.
As a lifelong (former) Episcopalian, I got fed up with Episcobabble a number of years ago. I now go to a church where they express the Gospel in clear English.
If on Dec 26th, 150,000 people, spread evenly around the world, had died in their sleep, we wouldn't have heard about it.
People die everyday.
People die without Christ everyday.
Is that any less a tragedy than the tsunami deaths?
I read somewhere that 1.8 people die every second. That's 150,000 a day. Earthly life is short, folks.
So, 300,000 die that day instead of the usual 150,000 and people start questioning God?
This may sound crass but if doubling the death rate for a single day puts God on someone's radar screen, something good will come out of this. God uses all things for good, even that meant for evil.
I might have beat my wife, but it's her fault, she asked for it!
....
31 For men are not cast off
by the Lord forever.
32 Though he brings grief, he will show compassion,
so great is his unfailing love.
33 For he does not willingly bring affliction
or grief to the children of men.
34 To crush underfoot
all prisoners in the land,
35 to deny a man his rights
before the Most High,
36 to deprive a man of justice-
would not the Lord see such things?
37 Who can speak and have it happen
if the Lord has not decreed it?
38 Is it not from the mouth of the Most High
that both calamities and good things come?
39 Why should any living man complain
when punished for his sins?
40 Let us examine our ways and test them,
and let us return to the LORD .
41 Let us lift up our hearts and our hands
to God in heaven, and say:
42 "We have sinned and rebelled
and you have not forgiven.
43 "You have covered yourself with anger and pursued us;
you have slain without pity.
44 You have covered yourself with a cloud
so that no prayer can get through.
45 You have made us scum and refuse
among the nations.
46 "All our enemies have opened their mouths
wide against us.
47 We have suffered terror and pitfalls,
ruin and destruction."
48 Streams of tears flow from my eyes
because my people are destroyed.
49 My eyes will flow unceasingly,
without relief,
50 until the LORD looks down
from heaven and sees.
51 What I see brings grief to my soul
because of all the women of my city.
52 Those who were my enemies without cause
hunted me like a bird.
53 They tried to end my life in a pit
and threw stones at me;
54 the waters closed over my head,
and I thought I was about to be cut off.
55 I called on your name, O LORD ,
from the depths of the pit.
56 You heard my plea: "Do not close your ears
to my cry for relief."
57 You came near when I called you,
and you said, "Do not fear."
Lamentations 3
Cordially,
The fundamental error is the assumption that we are good, deserving of good. We so take for granted the goodness and forbearance of God that when He sends judgments upon us we see it as an injustice. A matter of bias, really...
May God use this terrible judgment for His glory and our profit. He knows more than we.
Thank you, Diamond. That passage is beautiful and gives all who love Him comfort.
Human beings are much more of a threat to one another than natural disasters are. People deliberately kill other human beings in far greater numbers than this tidal wave did.
While the images of lost victims and decimated villages are horrific and heartbreaking, it's worth wondering where all the photos and news coverage and lamenting theologian/poseurs were 10 years ago when over 800,000 men, women and children were hacked to death in Rwanda in 90 days. Did anyone ask where God was then? I don't recall this Druid (or the Druid who preceded him) offering any solace to the world after this genocide.
I remember reading on some FR thread a few years ago that "people just didn't know what was happening to Jews in Europe during WW-2." Or else had people known the extent of the slaughter, certainly someone somewhere would have acted sooner.
I accepted that until one night when I was watching "Casablanca" for the 20th time and I heard lines I'd apparently missed before. A young Jewish couple from Bulgaria are desperate to leave Morocco and begs Rick for the Letters of Transit to allow them safe passage to avoid "death in the concentration camps."
Victor Laszlo (Paul Henreid) has recently escaped from "a German concentration camp."
And even Bogart makes reference to the reality in Europe: "Now you've got to listen to me. Do you have any idea what you'd have to look forward to if you stayed here? Nine chances out of ten we'd both wind up in a concentration camp."
"Casablanca" was written as a successful NY play in 1940, "Everybody Comes to Rick's." The movie was filmed in 1942 and released November, 1942. Anyone who saw the play or film knew the words "concentration camp" and just what went on there.
Human beings have a very selective memory, conditioned by eons of our baser instincts. For the fallen creature to deny God because His actions appear "heartless" is nonsensical. We out-kill God any time we want.
And apparently we want to all the time.
The only solace in the temporal world is Jesus Christ.
"These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world." -- John 16:33
lol, thanks for succinct and pointed analysis
lol, thanks for succinct and pointed analysis
This guy is pathetic. Salvation doesn't promise us a bed of roses in this lifetime. It rains upon the just and the unjust equally. Bad things happen to good people-good things happen to bad people, only TV evangelist and false profits in general, preach that God will make you a millionaire if you pay your tithes and mail in a special donation to keep them on the air.
God is God, not Santa Claus. God answers our prayers, just as he has promised, but granting three wishes regardless of what they may be, is not God's way of answering prayer. He knows what is best for us and answers accordingly.
Any man of the Cloth who admits to doubting God because of this tsunami, is confessing to possing little faith before.
We all are aware that it is appointed unto man once to die, whether we die by ourselves or along with 150,000 other people-each dies only once.
The clean up horrifies those left living, but all the dead are resting peacefully.
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