"More Catholic Than the Pope" — New Book Responds to Arguments Raised by Extreme Traditionalists

Envoy Encore Weblog ^ | 07-30-04 | Patrick Madrid

[Patrick Madrid]

Catholic canon lawyer Peter Vere and I have co-authored a new book critiquing the claims and controversies of extreme traditionalism that will come out in September, published by Our Sunday Visitor Publishing.

Written in a popular and accessible style, More Catholic Than the Pope provides a detailed analysis of and response to common arguments raised by extreme traditionalist Catholics (in particular, adherents of the Society of St. Pius X) against the Second Vatican Council, Pope John Paul II, the fact that the late Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre committed a schismatic act by illicitly ordaining four bishops in 1988, and more. Chapters include a history of the SSPX, a background on the controversy between the SSPX and the so-called "Conciliar Church," and answers to several standard canon-law and historical arguments often raised by extreme traditionalists.

Our hope is that, by God's grace, the evidence presented in this new 224-page book will inform, encourage, and strengthen Catholics who have been shaken or confused by the misguided arguments raised against the Catholic Church by some extreme traditionalists and, with regard to those who have adopted a schismatic mindset, that this book will help them recognize the errors of extreme traditionalist groups, help them to see why they should abandon those errors, and help them come home to the Catholic Church.

Additional details on More Catholic Than the Pope will be available soon at Envoy Encore weblog.

[sinkspur]

You integrists are mirror images of the Kerry campaign: fueled by nothing but anger and foot-stomping rage.

And you'll suffer the same fate.

[pascendi]

NO THANKS, Patrick.

Bunch of holier-than-thou dividers of the Mystical Body of Christ...

[sinkspur]

That was your side's plan, wasn't it?

Plan? You make your own choices, pasci.

[ultima ratio]

The irony is this: the sedevacantists are truer Catholics than many in the Vatican. Nor have they denied the papacy per se--only that JPII is a legitimate pope, which is quite another thing, and quite understandable, given the scandalous papal behavior to which they've been exposed!

[sinkspur]

The irony is this: the sedevacantists are truer Catholics than many in the Vatican.

Of course they are, UR. You continue on your journey out of the Catholic Church, in the wrong direction.

[stop_fascism]

I don't recall him worshiping Satan, however. I find it very worrysome that someone with Vere's CV is a canon lawyer. Seems like a very good occupation for further msichief.

[sinkspur]

Yeah. Real subverters, those Canon Lawyers.

Sheesh!!!

[pascendi]

I've made my choice.

I'm staying put in the Catholic Church and fight until the bitter end until you and every one of your kind who lay to waste every sacred object of the Church LEAVE.

It'll be over eventually. I can wait it out.

[ultima ratio]

Kerry campaign?--don't insult me. I'm a Bushie, all the way. I have the same reaction to the wreckage of the Catholic Church by modernist terrorists as Bush had to the 9/11 attacks. White hot anger--and a desire to achieve justice by action--not by wimpish acceptance and business-as-usual--which is the neo-Catholic response. It's war. I want the enemy destroyed because it's evil.

[sinkspur]

Do not hold your breath.

If you guys were smart, you'd take a personal prelature, or a Tridentine Rite.

Instead, you insist on trying to suppress the Novus Ordo.

Ain't gonna happen.

[sinkspur]

You're a jihadist, UR.

You abandoned the barque of Peter, remember, when you followed Marcel out the door.

[pascendi]

We'll keep the Catholic Faith, whole and undefiled, instead.

You will lose.

[HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity]

They are against it, but I don't know a specific "excuse." Many bishops seem to approve it only as long as only older people go. They don't want any young people there. In Hawaii, the bishop allowed an indult, but he made the petitioners promise to "keep it a secret." So, even if you called the chirch,they wouldn't tell you about it. 25 posted on 07/31/2004 6:18:06 PM PDT by nickcarraway

That sounds ridiculous. And, of course, there is no sound reason for bishops or anyone else to be against the Indult Masses in Latin.

People will tend to have different ideas about what they consider extreme, whether that's Opus Dei, Regnum Christi, the LCs, charismatics, EWTN, Ave Maria College, or whatever. Taking a look at organizations or movements which call themselves "Catholic" in itself is not wrong. Being fair, accurate, and keeping things in perspective is needed though.

[sinkspur]

We'll keep the Catholic Faith, whole and undefiled

Then you and I are simpatico.

Your desire to rub out the Novus Ordo, however, is misguided and doomed to failure.

[pascendi]

And shame on the traitor Catholics in between who won't commit to making a choice for either your NewChurch or the traditional Catholic Church.

Weak.

[sinkspur]

And, of course, there is no sound reason for bishops or anyone else to be against the Indult Masses in Latin.

Most of the arch-conservative bishops don't allow the Indult (i.e., Bruskewitz and Vasa). They seem to run across the fire-breathers like those on FR and don't have any desire to battle them.

Both, however, have FSSP parishes, which are fully in union with the diocese and with Rome.

[sinkspur]

Most Catholics just want to go to Mass and take care of their families.

You and UR's "war" is something from a comic book.

[stop_fascism]

I'm glad your so confortable having a former satanist explain canon law to gullible believers such as I.

[pascendi]

"Your desire to rub out the Novus Ordo, however, is misguided and doomed to failure."

Your desire to rub out my traditional Mass has already failed miserably.

Rubbing out yours isn't my decision to make. So I'll just wait and watch it happen in it's own time.

[sinkspur]

St. Paul murdered Christians, yet I read him almost every day.