Posted on 07/26/2004 1:57:27 PM PDT by Lasher
Would like to know if there are any other Christians out there that have not swallowed Rick Warren's version of the Gospel. I left my "seeker-friendly" Church after much prayer and ponder, and it took several months to make the split. I still must speak with my former pastor about this, so until I do, I will not name my former Church. I have noticed that most who follow the "Purpose Driven" material are emotionally attached to it, much like true Christians are emotionally tied to the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
There's different levels of seekers as you know.
What was the Scripture about stoney ground about!?
Certainly heart earnest persistent seekers shall find God regardless, imho.
Witness also Samuel Morris, THE MARCH OF FAITH around 1900.
But, there's also the Scripture about OVERCOMING being one of God's priorities. One has to make some sense of that Scripture or toss it out as meaningless.
Interesting.
I have always found that those who are so ready to deny the benefits of the King James to others have had it themselves.
I am sure the memory work was not easy but it proved to be worthwhile
I enjoy parallel versions and the Amplified a lot. And with the Bible Gateway type sites, we can examine a verse or topic in 10 translations fairly easily.
And why should I look at a other verses when the King James is the correct one?
But I will NOT use the KJV with ESL students in China or Taiwan. It would be absolutely crazy.
It is?
The King James can be read by foreign students of English, and why would you give them a corrupt version to read.
The Gospel of John is very simple English.
The King James moves in a progressive way to improve ones English.
The better modern translations--even the paraphrase FE ones--do more than adequately well with the major themes and doctrines of the faith.
So, now it is the message and not the words that matter.
Hello, neo-orthodoxy, we don't need the words, as long as we get the message right.
The only problem is that we do not know the message unless we have the words.
MORE, HOLY SPIRIT IS WELL ABLE TO LEAD ANYONE INTO ALL TRUTH WHO TRULY SEEKS GOD. GOD HIMSELF SAID--HE THAT SEEKS ME SHALL FIND ME--That was true of Samuel Morris in darkest Africa without ANY Bible or even anyone who was a Christian around for many miles. It's still true for those who truly seek God.
No one gets to know God unless he gets the word of God (Rom.10:17).
Scripture with Jesus speaking says MY SHEEP KNOW MY VOICE. Perhaps those who don't know his VOICE aren't His sheep.
Scripture?
Now, you are going to the very thing you say is unnecessary to prove that it is unnecessary?
LOL!
I love the KJV but I'm quite thankful I don't worship that particular arrangement of ink on wood pulp. Bibliolatry is not Righteousness. Bibliolatry of a particular translation is worse.
No, you don't love the King James, because you have rejected it as the final authority in your life.
You are double-minded and thus, unstable in all your ways.
The following is a good historical detailed summary of the whole topic of translations in a very balanced view. I think it's worth the reading time
Thank you, when I get some time I will read it.
Thank you.
LOL!
Here is the opinion of the great scholars of Christ's day.
Then answered them the pharisee's, are ye also deceived? Have any of the rulers or the pharisee's believed on him? But this people who knoweth not the law are cursed (Jn.7)
So the Pharisee's rejected the Lord, while the common people believed on Him.
So who got it right, the intellectuals or the common folk? (1Cor.1:26-27)
I agree that Luther did the right thing, and the most important thing he did was translate the Bible into the German language using the correct T/R texts.
That is what sparked the German Reformation, getting the right Bible into the peoples hands.
No problem.
There has to be an objective standard to which we adhere to, not a subjective one, in which every man does what is right in their own eyes.
Under the guise of reaching the lost we are losing ourselves!
ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
TRANSLATIONS
INCLUDING THE KJV
ARE SOMEWHAT
SUBjective.
Just a fact.
I encourage you to Deal with it.
More Redemptively.
It seems clear to me that you have never been an ESL teacher nor student.
Great percentages of ESL students would be innoculated
AGAINST
reading Scripture ever again with just one effort at trying to get them to read the KJV. Absolute nonsense.
I'm not about to risk turning folks
OFF
to God and His Word by using the KJV in such a context.
We are talking about a Book that is almost 400 years old and every new version has to compare itself to.
The new versions never compete against each other, it is always competing against the standard, the King James 1611.
The one that you said you adore and have memorized.
I have taught foreigners from the King James with no problem at all.
If children can learn the King James, what makes you think foreign students can't?
I am not going to give anyone a corrupt bible, no matter what excuses you conjure up.
The King James Bible has been read by non-English speaking peoples for centuries.
>> Under the guise of reaching the lost we are losing ourselves!<<
Some of us, probably. Others, maybe not. It is why prayer is so important. I know you know that, but I wanted you to know that I know it too.
All we can do is all we can do. Whenever I see topics like this, I am reminded of the rift between Paul and Barnabas over Mark in Acts 15:39. Sometimes sincere, prayerful, well meaning Christians simply disagree. It does not necessarily mean someone is doing the devils work.
Loving the KJV does not render me blind to it's flaws. I'm thrilled that God blessed the KJV. I'm thrilled that my God Almighty, His Son, His Spirit--BIG ENOUGH GOD--have blessed the Message and it's use. I'm thrilled that Peterson is facilitating, working with a new Chinese version--long needed.
Magical thinking about the KJV does not make it more pure.
Your seemingly willful blindness to basic facts of translation is sad.
TRANSLATION ALWAYS involves subjective choices.
It doesn't take a linguist to realize this. It's not rocket science. Simple logic will do.
NO TWO LANGUAGES have a totally equivalent vocabulary. Even just translating from KJV to modern English does not involve two sets of totally equivalent vocabulary with only objective choices possible between them.
As was shown above, "vanity" was a poor choice--a poor subjective choice--in the KJV.
Wanting to avoid innoculating folks against God and The Bible
is NOT
an excuse.
It's an eternnal life reality issue.
OHHHHHHHHHH DEAR!!!!
THERE YOU GO AGAIN!
. . . being sensible . . . and correct!
Oh my!
You may find this a blessing:
Prayer Summary For April 14, 2005
Notice: The following information was taught and prayed about during Lynne Hammond's and Ray Kelly's early morning prayer session this morning.
Shared...
Romans 8:26—
KJV—Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities. For we know not what we should pray for as we ought:bu the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which can not be uttered.
Wuest—The Spirit lends us a helping hand with reference to our weakness for the particular thing we should pray for according to what is necessary in the nature of the case, we do not know with an absolute knowledge....
New Life—The Holy Spirit prays to God for us with sounds that cannot be put into words.
NEB—We do not even know how we ought to pray (or, what it is right to pray for). But through our inarticulate groans the Spirit himself is pleading for us.
Jer—...for when we cannot choose words in order to pray properly, the Spirit himself express our plea in a way that could never be put into words.
Prayed...
We hunger for more of You
We decrease that you may increase
So much more; there's so much at stake
Change, change transformation
Go out beyond, into the realms of God, help from heaven
A furtherance; we contend for the furtherance
Shake it, shake it, shake it loose now; open
Move it over
Amend the breach through the blood of Jesus
Everyone see, signs, signs that reveal change, the right way
Signs that say go, turn
The rhema of the Word, move it
There's more in that place; there's a great application
Angelic forces, manifest the will, the manifested plan
Time to step over, over the threshold; the yoke is light
We esteem all the parts; shake loose of every weight, freedom
A showing and revealing; doorways are turning in the right direction
A recharging; a surge of power
Spirit of God, manifest yourself
Endurance to press forward; move, enter, enter, repair
open; eyes can see
Our ears can hear; we will not go back
We will stay steadfast
Holy Ghost connection
Taste it; we can taste it; motion; freedom
Internationally, a light
The message shaking every deterrent, shaking the enemy
Daylight—we can see the breakthrough now
It's out beyond our mind, beyond our eyes, it's the way of the Holy Ghost power
The free way has been made
Tongues With Interpretation...
So see, there is an easy way. It's called the Holy Ghost way. It's yielding yourself over to the Spirit fully, completely yielded to My Spirit. It's the way your walk will be. Easy. You will be able to choose the door to go through, or go around, or over if you need to, bouncing like a spring you will go and flow up over into my plan.
Entrance will come to you. Endurance will come to you and you will not move in your own strength but you will move in My power.
Bonhoeffer's writing indicts Warren without question.
What are you, a black is white kinda person?
How appropriate a tagline for you!
I don't compare modern versions to the King James. It's the other way around for me. My favorite is still the one on Bible.org.
The King James is the Model T. It isn't better, it's just first. And I have grown accustomed to power windows, 17" wheels and 300 horsepower, thank you very much.
>>What are you, a black is white kinda person?<<
Don't know about him, but I most DEFINITELY am a black and white type person.
Bonhoeffer only attempts to indict Warren.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.