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Israel to replace Uzi sub-machinegun, M-16 with Tavor firearm
Haaretz ^ | 10/08/2003 | Haaretz

Posted on 08/10/2003 1:33:19 PM PDT by klpt

Israel is replacing its world-famous Uzi sub-machinegun and U.S.-supplied M-16 assault rifle with a new flagship firearm.

The design of the Tavor is based largely on lessons learned during military operations in the West Bank and Gaza Strip during the 34-month-old Al Aqsa intifada.

The first Tavors, made by Israel Military Industries (IMI), have been issued to elite Israeli

infantry units, part of an order of 15,000 announced last month by the Defense Ministry.

Security sources said deals were under way to sell the weapon, retailing at $1,000, to "friendly foreign clients.". "The Tavor is probably the finest assault rifle now available. It is a matter of national pride," Moti Rosen, vice president of the small-arms division at IMI, said on Sunday.

Named after a mountain where biblical Israelites did battle, the Tavor is compact. Its commando variation weighs 2.8 kg (6.2lbs) compared with the Uzi's 3.7 kg and M-16's 3.4 kg. Bullets are loaded through its stock, allowing for a snub barrel.

"The Tavor would be useful anywhere where close quarters battle is the rule, and from vehicles," said Charles Cutshaw, firearms editor at Jane's International Defense Review Magazine.

It has large vents to prevent dust clogs and sights allowing the shooter to aim with both eyes open.

The Tavor spells the end, locally, of the M-16, a staple assault rifle supplied to Israel since the early 1970s as part of Washington's annual defense grants.

The M-16 has drawn complaints. Designed for Vietnam-style tropics, it jams frequently in the desert. Many of the rifles Israel received were from military surplus and often fatigued.

Nonetheless, Israel long allowed the M-16 to eclipse its Uzi and another IMI-made assault rifle, the Galil, which both ended up being sold to client states in Africa and South America.

Rosen said he expected no such hold-ups with the Tavor, developed over a decade at an undisclosed production cost.

"As for the Americans, I'm sorry if they lose business but that's the price of progress," he said.

Colt Manufacturing, which produces the M-16, did not comment.



TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Israel; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: arafat; bang; banglist; galil; israel
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1 posted on 08/10/2003 1:33:20 PM PDT by klpt
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To: klpt
Is this bullpup in 5.56mm?
2 posted on 08/10/2003 1:36:39 PM PDT by WorkingClassFilth (Defund NPR, PBS and the LSC.)
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To: klpt
Oh great, another bullpup.

They work just fine until you fire one standing close to a wall, then it's stovepipe city.

The Isrealis should have kept the Galil.

L

3 posted on 08/10/2003 1:37:35 PM PDT by Lurker (A 'moderate' Arab is one who carries a grudge for less than 8 generations.)
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To: klpt
Note the left-right selectable ejection ports.

4 posted on 08/10/2003 1:48:45 PM PDT by Drammach
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To: Lurker
I wouldn't mind having a Galil myself.
5 posted on 08/10/2003 1:51:44 PM PDT by LibKill (The sacred word, TANSTAAFL.)
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To: klpt
IMI Tavor TAR-21 assault rifle (Israel)
Tavor TAR-21 (basic version)


Tavor CTAR-21 (compact version)


Tavor MTAR-21 (micro version)


Tavor-2 - an updated version of the Micro-Tavor MTAR-21 (image source: isayeret.com)


Tavor-OICW drawing - a modified TAR-21 rifle fitted with electronic sighting and fire control unit and tactical data interfaces.


Civilian (semi-automatic only) version of the Tavor. Note the different shape of the butt, handguard and the trigger guard, basically similar to that of the Tavor-2. This particular rifle is fitted with Trijicon ACOG telescope sight.

Caliber: 5.56mm NATO
Action: Gas operated, rotating bolt
Overall length: 720 mm
Barrel length: 460 mm
Weight: 2.8 kg empty, 3.63 kg with loaded 30 rounds magazine & sling
Magazine capacity: 20 or 30 rounds standard
Rate of fire: 750 - 900 rounds per minute

The development of the new assault rifle, that should eventually replace in service the ageing M16A1, CAR-15 and IMI Galil assault rifles, began in Israel in the 1991. The new rifle was developed by the Israel Military Industries (IMI, now TAAS) company, in close cooperation with the Israeli Defense Forces (IDF). This new rifle received the name of "Tavor" and the designation of TAR-21 (Tavor Assault Rifle, for 21st century). The new rifle first appeared on public in the 1998, and it had been tested by the IDF during 1999-2002. At the moment of writing (spring of 2003) there were no large purchases of the Tavor by the IDF, because of low funding, but late in the 2002 India signed an US $20M contract with IMI for undisclosed number of TAR-21 assault rifles and Galatz sniper rifles. There also were some rumors that the Croatia will purchase some TAR-21 rifles, but so far I've seen no confirmation on this.

In general, the TAR-21 represents the mainstream of the present assault rifle developments. It shares all the "modern" features, already tried and proved successful by previous designs, like the bullpup layout, polymer housing, optical sights as a prime sighting equipment, modular design with several different configurations (from very short submachine gun and up to standard assault rifle and a para-sniper accurized rifle with heavy barrel). So far it seen not much real action, and it is hard to judge if it is really a success, and only time will show that.

Despite the unclear prospects for the future of the TAR-21 family of weapons, the IMI continues the development of the Tavor into the Tavor OICW project, that will combine the modified Tavor rifle with the most modern electronic sighting, fire control and tactical technology. This, in the case of success, will create a soldier system generally similar to ones, developed in the USA under the OICW / Land Warrior project or in the France as the FAMAS-FELIN system. At the same time, according to the ISAYERET.COM website, the IMI also developed a new, less futuristic modification, called the Tavor-2. This rifle is a heavy modified MTAR-21 assault rifle, with its short, 250 mm (10 inches) barrel and modified stock layout and controls. The sight equipment rail is raised above the rifle housing and the standard scope now is a more affordable Meprolight reflex scope, with no built-in laser pointer. This version, unlike the original TAR-21 family of weapons, also will be available in the "true" submachine gun variant, which will fire either 9x19mm Luger or .40S&W ammunition.

The IMI also developed a civilian, semi-automatic only version of the Tavor rifle, which looks much like the Tavor-2 rifle with longer barrel.

Technical description.
The Tavor TAR-21 is a gas operated, selective fire, magazine fed assault rifle of bullpup configuration. It is available in several configurations, which differ in the barrel lengths and accessories. The basic configuration is the TAR-21 assault rifle with the 460mm (18.1 in) barrel. Next are the compact assault rifle, called CTAR-21, with the barrel 380 mm (15 in) long, and the micro assault rifle, with the barrel of only 250 mm (10 in) long, called MTAR-21. The latter rifle also featured a redesigned front part of the housing, for a more comfortable hold of the short weapon.

TAR-21 utilizes a now-common long piston stroke, rotating bolt action, with the gas piston rigidly attached to the bolt carrier. Gas cylinder is located above the barrel and is completely enclosed by the gun housing. The rotating bolt is similar to one found in the M16 rifle and has seven lugs. The ejection ports are made on both sides of the weapon, and the right or the left side ejection can be selected by installing the bolt with the ejector mounted on the right or on the left, respectively (and, of cause, this change requires the gun to be partially disassembled). The bolt carrier rides on the single guide rod, with the return spring unit located above it, behind and inside the hollow gas piston rod. The charging handle is located at the front left side of the gun and does not reciprocate when gun is fired. The charging handle slots are cut on the both sides of the gun housing, so it can be installed on either side of the weapon, as required. The trigger unit is more or less conventional, with the ambidextrous fire mode selector / safety switch located above the pistol grip.

The TAR-21 has no separate receiver. Instead, all parts are mounted within the high impact-resistant plastic housing, reinforced with steel inserts where appropriate. The access to all the internal parts is controlled by the hinged buttplate, which can be swung down for internal inspection and disassembly.

TAR-21 has no open sights. It is fitted with the standard Picatinny-type accessory rail on the top of the gun. At the present time the standard sighting equipment for the TAR-21 series rifles (except for the STAR-21 sniper rifle) is the Israeli-made ITL MARS, a complicated and expensive reflex-type sight with the built-in laser pointer. For the night time operations the MARS could be complemented with the ITL Mini N/SEAS compact night vision device.

The TAR-21 utilizes the STANAG-compliant, M16 type magazines, with standard capacity of 30 rounds.

TAR-21 in its basic configuration can be fitted with 40mm M203 underbarrel grenade launcher.

6 posted on 08/10/2003 2:00:54 PM PDT by ThePythonicCow (Mooo !!!!)
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To: ThePythonicCow
That's great. Now let's see somebody get in a bayonnet fight with one of these versus an FN/FAL, G3, or even an M-16. Oops - better save one round in the end if things get really close. For yourself. Unless you like being a POW.

They could've just saved all of that development money and bought the new bullpup from FN.


7 posted on 08/10/2003 2:11:43 PM PDT by 11B3 (We cannot rest until the Left is destroyed. Then we'll have Liberty.)
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To: klpt
My first reaction to bullpup military rifles is that smoke gets in your eyes. It is easy to hold your breath, but my sighting eye tears. Much easier to handle from a vehicle, though.
8 posted on 08/10/2003 2:15:47 PM PDT by Iris7 ("..the Eternal Thompson Gunner.." - Zevon)
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To: klpt
Let's just wait see what the go fast boys opt to use....
9 posted on 08/10/2003 2:41:41 PM PDT by joesnuffy (Moderate Islam Is For Dilettantes)
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To: klpt
These aren't far from the Steyr assault line.

http://world.guns.ru/assault/as20-e.htm
10 posted on 08/10/2003 2:44:53 PM PDT by NewRomeTacitus (Like Jim Scouten says, "Keep 'em in the ten ring.")
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To: klpt
(to nobody in particular)
Right. Big improvement. Sure.

Another junky plastic bullpup like the AUG.

It's first flaw is using M16 mags. The second flaw is that the trigger isn't more enclosed. Ask the Aussies about negligent discharges with their junky AUGs. The third flaw is with the mag catch. One just can't make a bullpup that can change mags as fast as an M16. This is also a shortcoming with the AK variants but not to the extent that it's arguably a flaw.

The Galil was supposed to be the uber-AK. If it's so great why do so many Israeli SF types prefer the M16 pattern weapons over it? What? It's too damned heavy, not as accurate and you can't change mags fast enough? Can't mount anything on it?

I'm going to go out on a limb here and speculate that the Tavor won't be as controllable as conventional rifles like the M16 or AK. I'm saying that based on my own experience firing an AUG, several M16s including my own and quite a few AK variants including post-sample Galils and a Valmet in 5.56mm. The last AUG I shot was a real handfull to control on auto compared to those. That thing flat out wanted to move around. Firing doubles seemed to always leave the second round way high at 25 meters.

Now, before the peanut gallery gets going with "you can't hit anything on full auto" let me say BS.

Oh yeah, if anyone is going to argue that there's nothing wrong with M16 mags then I'll refer you to the Brits and THEIR costly bullpup abortion. Ask yourself why there are so many steel Brit M16 mags around right now.

It looks like a much better weapon than the AUG but I'd rather have Colt 653 (that's a 14.5" M16A1 for you non-auto types) or Commando.

One last thing. Why black? It gets way too damned hot. I hope they at least make their plastic junk in grey or tan.
11 posted on 08/10/2003 2:51:18 PM PDT by nerdwithamachinegun (All generalizations are wrong.)
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To: joesnuffy
Why wait?

See what the go fast boys use now and expect to use in the future
12 posted on 08/10/2003 2:53:23 PM PDT by nerdwithamachinegun (All generalizations are wrong.)
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To: klpt
Wish I had one or two or three or four, etc.
13 posted on 08/10/2003 3:53:05 PM PDT by lilylangtree
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To: Lurker
please explain the "stove pipe city".
14 posted on 08/10/2003 3:54:36 PM PDT by longtermmemmory (Vote!)
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To: klpt
bump
15 posted on 08/10/2003 4:02:23 PM PDT by RippleFire
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To: longtermmemmory
"Stove pipe" is the term given to a failure to feed "jam". In semi and full auto weapons, the empty case sticking out of the action looks like a cartoon stove pipe. All the more reason to learn shot placement and carry a revolver. 'Tho that might not be practical for a military operation.
16 posted on 08/10/2003 4:49:17 PM PDT by chadwimc
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To: longtermmemmory
A "stove pipe" is a type of malfunction where a spent round is left in the action, preventing it from closing, sticking straight out like a pipe from a stove or a flue from a house. It can occur from one of three things, failure to extract adequately, failure to eject and in the virtually impossible circumstance of brass bouncing back into the action. In the case of an ejection failure it's usually due to cleaning or ejector spring fatigue. My M16 experienced this using a Vietnam era bolt carrier assembly.

The scenario described by Lurker (post #3) just isn't going to happen. It would require a combination of circumstances that is improbable to the point of silliness. If it were to happen the problem wouldn't be bullpup vs. standard rifle, the problem would be having an ejection port within 2" of a wall. The Tavor's large ejection port, in my estimation, isn't going to act like a spent brass funnel.

I'm ambidexterous so my biggest problem with bullpup junk is hot brass flying across my face when I switch shoulders.
AUG fanboys will argue that you can reverse ejection. Great. In a firefight? When you switch sides of a road on a patrol? As mentioned before, from in a car? Hell no.
I say bullpup is fine for very special purpose stuff. As a general purpose all-around rifle I think the Brits might be a good source of feedback about that.

Post #7 mentioned bayonets. Name the last time bayonets figured prominently into an Israeli mission.
17 posted on 08/10/2003 4:56:49 PM PDT by nerdwithamachinegun (All generalizations are wrong.)
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To: 11B3
Have you fired one of those junky P90s?
They're fine if you like a 22MAG.
I've fired one. I got to put about 400 rounds through it and was alternatively impressed by the controllability and unimpressed by the power. They're definately a head-turner at the range. You may have a point that Israel would be better off with an FN product.

I think that Israel would be better served by continued use of the M4A1.
18 posted on 08/10/2003 5:02:38 PM PDT by nerdwithamachinegun (All generalizations are wrong.)
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To: klpt
Colt Manufacturing, which produces the M-16, did not comment.

Actually Colt only makes the M-4 and other special varients. Fabrique Nationale has the main contract for the M-16A2 version. (They are made, not just assembled, in Columbia, SC. Along with a couple of kinds of machine gun and other stuff for the US military)

19 posted on 08/10/2003 6:21:14 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: klpt
Security sources said deals were under way to sell the weapon, retailing at $1,000, to "friendly foreign clients.".

Hey, I'm friendly!

20 posted on 08/10/2003 6:25:45 PM PDT by Billthedrill
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