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Exactly what is the gay 'agenda' and 'lifestyle'?
Amarillo Globe News ^ | July 15, 2003 | Greg Sagan

Posted on 07/15/2003 10:41:28 AM PDT by gcruse

I'm with David Horsley. If there is such a thing as a "gay agenda" I must be one of its supporters by default. I've never been "recruited" for this cause; never received any political material describing the agenda, the forces opposed to it, or how it will prevail in the law and the institutions of America; and I've never attended any meetings suggesting my heterosexual predilection is a target for gay subversion. But there are people out there with whom I disagree who tell me that gays of both genders are promoting this "agenda," and the demand that gays be given equal treatment under the law is apparently the first step on a path that will soon have me dating Bruce Willis.

I am not persuaded.

There's a lot of nonsense surrounding the phenomenon of homosexuality.

There's the idea that homosexuals "recruit" heterosexuals. This is absurd because you can't change someone else's sexual orientation. If you don't believe that, try changing your own. If you can't do it to yourself, what chance does anyone else have to do it to you? My sexual orientation is not up for grabs, and I defy anyone to sweet-talk me into sleeping with men.

There's the idea that gays corrupt the young. Some may, but as science repeatedly points out, most episodes of sexual abuse involving adults and children are perpetrated by heterosexuals. I suspect someday we will see a movement to outlaw heterosexuality because of all the perversions it spawns, but for now I would rather rest my weight on the idea that acts of sexual perversion are separate and distinct from sexual orientation. That way we can sweep up offenders of both persuasions.

And there's the idea that gays "choose" the "gay lifestyle" - whatever that is. As I've pointed out before on this page, if anyone can "choose" to be gay, so can you. And if you can choose to be gay, your right of choice should be protected as long as you meet the new criteria - consenting adults, privacy of the bedroom.

But the only element of "lifestyle" common to all gays is that they prefer sex with people of their own gender. Beyond that you can find gays who are committed and gays who sleep around, just like us. You can find gays who drink wine and gays who drink beer, just like us. You can find gays who are Republicans and gays who are Democrats, just like us.

The only "agenda" gays hold that I'm aware of is to correct mistreatment under the law, and since the gays doing this are American citizens who work, pay taxes and vote, there is no reason to deny them this much of what they want. Gays should be able to form lifelong committed relationships, participate as full partners in medical decisions of their mates, pass on property to survivors as easily as the rest of us can.

And, yes, they should be able to raise children as a family unit.

This is the idea that troubles some people to distraction - what about the children? Won't kids who grow up in a homosexual-parent family turn out gay? Well, do all children who grow up in heterosexual-parent families turn out straight? Of course not. I had three children by my first wife. Two are heterosexual, one is gay. So that argument doesn't hold water.

What is important to children in any family is the quality of the relationship between the parents and between parents and children. Two heterosexual parents can make the lives of their children a living hell. Two homosexual parents can make the lives of their children an example of trust, commitment, integrity, and love.

We all ought to seek and savor the second kind of relationship, not reject one of them out of hand because we don't like the pairing.

But giving gays some minimal protection under the law is an essential first step to understanding their relationships, because nothing distorts research like criminalizing the behavior to be studied.

Besides, when gays are denied fundamental protection under the law, we are stating to the whole world that justice in America depends on your choice of sleeping partners. This is an insupportable premise for public policy.

For those who are rabidly opposed to homosexuality, I say by all means stay heterosexual. Just don't expect to see your zeal elevated to legal prohibition. Gays can be good Americans, too, and discriminating against good Americans with the law has yet to prove itself a viable long-term strategy.


TOPICS: Culture/Society
KEYWORDS: catholiclist; culturewar; denydenydeny; downourthroats; gay; gaytrolldolls; homosexual; homosexualagenda; samesexdisorder; sexualdeviance
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To: gcruse
Cite studies to you? You are so buried in invective the light of reason won't get in before the Final Days. You're a vicious hater, pram.

Typical. You make a false statement, I ask you to prove it, and you respond with emotion, just calling names. And I don't believe in a Final Judgement any more than you do, so why drag that in?

201 posted on 07/15/2003 8:56:27 PM PDT by First Amendment
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To: missyme
You are totally mis-informed when it comes to Gays.

He's not misinformed. He just chooses to be a homosexual promoter even though it is the degraded life both you, he and I know it to be.

202 posted on 07/15/2003 8:58:43 PM PDT by First Amendment
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To: Trace21230
My only interest in posting on this thread is to argue that the government has no business making certain religious beliefs the law of the land.

Lie. Your only purpose in coming here is to promote the homosexual agenda. You never addressed the long article describing in detail the NON-RELIGIOUS reasons why sodomy/aka homosexual acts should not be promoted in society. Let's see some rebuttal of those reasons.

203 posted on 07/15/2003 9:03:18 PM PDT by First Amendment
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To: gcruse
And neither will a homosexual recruiting drive change heteros into homos for the exact same reasons.

Except for prison, eh? On the otherhand behaioral pathologies usually begin at an early age so your "recruiting" strawman is really rather silly don't you think?

204 posted on 07/15/2003 9:07:29 PM PDT by Clint N. Suhks
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To: longtermmemmory
Parents had to go to extreme measures in order to show the public the types of pervsions these SANCTIONED perverts are activly telling children to perform.

The homo-promoters here (currently EmmyLou, gcruse, and Trace) refuse to respond to any fact, reasonable argument, or statement of truth. They only want to promote their agenda (whether they are homosexuals or not I neither know nor care). They have yet to admit that they are wrong on one point, although their emotional statements are based on lies. They cannot debate facts, they only name call, whine emotionally, make bluffing statements, and repeat slogans.

205 posted on 07/15/2003 9:07:53 PM PDT by First Amendment
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To: Luis Gonzalez
Hey Louie
If you don't like it, don't read it.
206 posted on 07/15/2003 9:11:04 PM PDT by Imagine
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To: Luis Gonzalez
Actually, I'm putting my finishing touches on my "education" plan. It should be interesting reading, but, only for education geeks. Maybe you should skip that one too?

Oh, by the way, just in case you've forgotten, here's my rant on homosexuals again for you:


Homosexuality:

Homosexuality is deviant sexual behavior and a mental illness.

Homosexuals: 1) subject their body parts to uses nature did not intend, such activities often presenting immediate risk to the participants; 2) are prone to greater suicide, depression and other mental disorders and deficiencies than the heterosexual population at large; 3) are prone to far greater sexually transmitted diseases, including AIDS, than the (normal) heterosexual population; 4) molest young people (pedophilia) at a far greater rate than heterosexuals; 5) engage in degrading sexual promiscuity, oftentimes engaging in risky sex with many partners during the same event; 6) are engaged in aggressive and widespread efforts to indoctrinate our children by introducing the homosexual lifestyle using public schools as the primary indoctrination “vehicle” and likewise, through the movie/music/TV industry, with the dual goals of gaining school-age acceptance of homosexuality and encouraging sexual activity among children, especially same-sex experimentation; 7) view most everything through a mindset heavily biased in favor of the homosexual lifestyle and culture, which renders them mostly useless when asked to opine on matters that normal heterosexuals better resolve.

The mental deficiencies described herein applying to homosexuals shall not be confused with the deficiencies associated with the left wing democrat/socialist/marxist/ feminist/environmentalist minds, etc., which have their own distinct set of mental disorders.

This doesn't even touch on what the Bible has to say about homosexuality.

207 posted on 07/15/2003 9:15:40 PM PDT by Imagine
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To: GovernmentShrinker
All of the sexual practices listed in the article you posted are also engaged in by promiscuous heterosexuals, and you'll have no trouble finding publications and websites aimed at heterosexuals who like to engage in these things,

1. The study cited is not the only evidence that many homosexuals commonly engage in sick and dangerous "sex" acts.

2. People love to say that "lots" of heterosexuals also practice the same sick stuff, but I have yet to see a reasonable study that says so.

3. And even IF it were true that many heterosexuals practiced such acts, then they would be sick perverts too, also in need of a change in their lives.

208 posted on 07/15/2003 9:16:41 PM PDT by First Amendment
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To: pram
Trace has been banned!!!

Its about time too. Nothing more than a DU fudge packing meathead troll.

209 posted on 07/15/2003 9:23:33 PM PDT by Archie Bunker on steroids
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To: gcruse; GatorGirl; maryz; *Catholic_list; afraidfortherepublic; Antoninus; Aquinasfan; Askel5; ...
Ping!
210 posted on 07/15/2003 9:24:46 PM PDT by narses ("The do-it-yourself Mass is ended. Go in peace" Francis Carindal Arinze of Nigeria)
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To: gcruse
You are pro homosexual, pro drugs and pro abortion, are you sure you are on the right forum?
211 posted on 07/15/2003 9:25:19 PM PDT by redangus
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To: Emmylou
Emmylou try another website to argue for sodomy.

I don't have anything against your sexual orientation....we have alot in common. If I woke up and discovered I was suddenly a woman, I'd make a beeline to the very same dyke bars you hang out at. You'd need a team of horses to pull me out of those places if I were a woman.

So, you see, we have a lot in common.

212 posted on 07/15/2003 9:31:05 PM PDT by Archie Bunker on steroids
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To: redangus
You are pro homosexual, pro drugs and
pro abortion, are you sure you are on the right forum?


I am pro individual freedom.  Have I been on the
wrong forum going on six years?
213 posted on 07/15/2003 9:32:08 PM PDT by gcruse (There is no such thing as society: there are individual men and women[.] --Margaret Thatcher)
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To: gcruse
So what about Bi-Sexuals? do you think they should have the same rights as Gay people?

Men and Women should have the same human rights and for the most part do. But that does not give them a free ticket to exhibit any type of behaviour they feel like.

Not to be blunt but no matter if your a man or woman having rectal sex is physically unhealthy and can cause numerous diseases and infections which was reported in the Havard Medical Journal.


214 posted on 07/15/2003 10:02:02 PM PDT by missyme
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To: missyme
So what about Bi-Sexuals? do you think they
should have the same rights as Gay people?


Americans should have the same rights without
regard to their sexual inclinations, don't you think?
And lots of things we do are unhealthy. It's called freedom.
215 posted on 07/15/2003 10:10:50 PM PDT by gcruse (There is no such thing as society: there are individual men and women[.] --Margaret Thatcher)
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To: Trace21230
Dispute this:
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5205a2.htm
216 posted on 07/15/2003 10:14:11 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: I got the rope
Trace won't be disputing anything as long as he remains banned.
217 posted on 07/15/2003 10:15:55 PM PDT by gcruse (There is no such thing as society: there are individual men and women[.] --Margaret Thatcher)
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To: gcruse
Americans should have the same rights without regard to their sexual inclinations, don't you think?

Yepppers, bring on the consensual incest, bestiality and consensual pedophilia, Liberaltarian social experiment UNITE'

218 posted on 07/15/2003 10:16:45 PM PDT by Clint N. Suhks
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To: austinTparty
http://www.narth.com/docs/arguecase.html

I guess if you tell yourself over and over again that this is not happening...then it must not be happening? Hmmm.
219 posted on 07/15/2003 10:27:39 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: gcruse
This one is scarey. This is what it says on page 146:
"75% of homosexual men are currently carrying one or more pathogens."

http://www.jrsm.org/cgi/gca?gca=86%2F3%2F144&sendit=Get+All+Checked+Abstract%28s%29
220 posted on 07/15/2003 10:40:10 PM PDT by I got the rope
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