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Agency receives nearly comments on manatee protection (kids used as tools by leftist teachers)
Naples Daily News via SW Florida Sound Off ^ | Monday, July 7, 2003 | By JOEL ESKOVITZ

Posted on 07/07/2003 6:29:31 AM PDT by AAABEST

Some letters came with pictures, a photograph of a Florida waterway or a child's drawing of an endangered manatee.

Some were form letters. Some were hand-written. Some used scientific evidence. Some detailed personal experiences.

And to the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, they all must read like a blur. The federal agency received nearly 5,700 public comments from almost every state in the union and other countries to help it decide how to protect the manatee along Florida's shores.

As part of a settlement with a consortium of environmental groups, Fish and Wildlife is considering creating three protection zones, areas in which boaters would either have to travel slowly or avoid completely. They are located on the Caloosahatchee River in Lee County, the St. Johns River in Duval and Clay counties, and the Halifax and Tomoka rivers in Volusia County.

While support for the proposed speed zones came in at a roughly 4:1 ratio, the government has essentially whittled the responses down to 150 that will determine the scope of the new rules it will implement at the end of the month.

Those comments will carry the most weight, regardless of the amount of response in favor or against new regulations, said Christine Eustis, a spokeswoman for Fish and Wildlife.

"We counted every comment that we got," she said. "But what really is going to help us in our final decision is the 150 responses where we got new information or data."

Substantive comments

The 150 substantive comments contained scientific critiques of the proposed zones, the economic effects of implementing those zones and suggestions for better ways to protect the manatee. And surprisingly, noted Chuck Underwood of the Service's Jacksonville office, almost three-fourths of those came from individuals instead of environmental or industry organizations.

Leron Adams of Naples suggested a prop guard for boats.

Rick Skrivan of Bonita Springs thought tagging manatees would make them more visible. He also questioned the unintended consequences of new speed zones.

"Has the service taken into consideration the fact that the more boaters you cram into a smaller boating space, the more likely accidents will occur?" he asked.

Rep. Porter Goss, R-Sanibel, was the only U.S. congressman to make suggestions, noting that Tarpon Bay should be included in the protection area but two other portions of the Caloosahatchee should be excluded.

Still, the meatiest responses came from the usual sides in the debate arguing between the need to protect the endangered manatee a record 95 of which died from boat accidents last year and the public's rights to work and play along the coastline.

Save The Manatee Club argued that without further protections and with the increasing number of boaters that are hitting the waters especially in Southwest Florida "it is inevitable that the human-caused take of manatees in those regions will continue to worsen."

But the Florida Marine Contractors Association which has filed a lawsuit challenging the federal government's authority over Florida waters and the Bonita Bay Group both questioned if Fish and Wildlife has enough data to create new rules.

"If you don't have the science to evaluate population trends, what science are the proposed zones based on?" Margaret Emblidge, Bonita Bay Group's director of planning, wrote in a letter.

Some argued that expediting new rules isn't the answer.

Rob Jess, a project leader at the J.N. "Ding" Darling National Wildlife Refuge in Sanibel, said "the reputation of the service is being degraded in Lee County because of the proposed zones and implementation of existing practices that are not grounded in local realities."

He suggested more time is needed to analyze the effect of current speed zones.

"We question the practicality of creating more federal zones in Lee County without a full evaluation of the success or failure of current zones," he wrote.

Environmental groups said time isn't on the side of the manatee, arguing that the continuity of the species could be severely threatened over the next century unless drastic action is taken.

Marguerite Hutchins, treasurer of the Calusa Group of the Sierra Club, also disputed the notion that recent statistics show new protections around Lee County could be leading to fewer manatee deaths. Scientists need decades of statistics to determine growth, birth and survival patterns, she said.

"Safeguards should not be decreased based on a few years of data," Hutchins wrote. "In the meantime we do not want to become the generation that extinguished or almost extinguished the manatee from Southwest Florida."

Economic concerns

The U.S. Small Business Administration also weighed in with what critics of the zones believe is one of the strongest arguments against imposing new regulations: the economic impact on those who use the waterways for work or have property on the coast.

Chief Counsel Thomas M. Sullivan and Assistant Chief Counsel Michael R. See of the agency's advocacy division said Fish and Wildlife incorrectly stated the rule would not have a "significant economic impact on a substantial number of small entities."

It lists fishing companies, ferry services, harbor facilities, a restaurant, marine construction firms and Realtors among the groups that expressed concern over the economic impact of the rules. Those groups cited longer travel time on the water, less demand for docks and lower property value as potential effects of the new regulations.

As the Marine Industries Association of the Treasure Coast caustically notes in its letter: "Supposing you slowed down 115 miles of I-75 from 70 to 15 mph (similar to slowing boats from 30 to 5 mph) because of the Florida Panther. Would that cause 'no significant economic impact?"'

Eric Glitzenstein, attorney for the 18 environmental groups that reached a settlement with the federal government to create the proposed zones, has said the industry groups are overstating the economic effect.

Other responses

The vast majority of the responses received between April 5 and June 3 came in the form of letters simply stating a stance in favor or against the regulations without providing the service any new information.

Several school projects aimed at protecting the manatee featured children writing and drawing their concerns over the endangered sea cow.

"I think you should slow down the speed limits because the manatees can't tell them to stop or tell that they are there," wrote Katy Kraft, an elementary school student in Powhatan, Va.

One Naples writer used a school analogy in his letter.

"We don't encourage people to race their cars through a school zone," wrote Steve Wright. "Why do boaters need to race their boats through backwaters?"

But John Singling of Cross Village, Mich., who owns waterfront property in Collier County didn't see it that way, chastising Fish and Wildlife from getting involved in a state matter.

"Stay out of the expansion of the manatee protection 'business'," he wrote. "You're not going to help."

The letters didn't include comments from three public meetings held around the state, estimated by Underwood as an additional 200 responses that could be used to formulate the final rule. More than 3,500 people attended the meetings, with 2,500 of those participating in a session in Fort Myers.

He said the totality of the public comments shows just how vital this issue is to Floridians.

"There is definitely a concern from the public that we do the right thing," he said.

Breakdown of responses

Total comments the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service received between April 5 and June 3 regarding three proposed protection areas for the endangered manatee: 5,688. Those comments were broken down by the agency into the following categories:

3,889: E-mails from those in favor of the proposed rules.

588: Letters from those opposed to the proposed rules.

418: E-mails from those opposed to the proposed rules.

343: Letters from those in favor of the proposed rules.

300: School projects supporting the proposed rules.

150: Substantive comments from agencies, groups and organizations (41) and individuals (109) Source: U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Extended News; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: ecowars; indoctrination; junkscience; manatee; schools; students; teachers; wildlife
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300 School projects, every single one in favor of this abomination and not a single one that supports the families and PEOPLE that are about to have their livelihoods ruined by this junk science scam job?

The author of this article conveniently leaves out a few facts such as the devestating affect that these speed zones will have on the City of Cape Coral, where a 40 minute boat ride to the gulf would be turned into a 3 hour excursion.

Not only that, the West Indies Manatee is an invasive species that devours enormous amounts of sea grass. It wouldn't even winter in the area they're talking about if the enviros didn't strike a deal with Florida Power and Light to keep pumping warm water into the river, enticing it to stay.

1 posted on 07/07/2003 6:29:32 AM PDT by AAABEST
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To: AAABEST
"I think you should slow down the speed limits because the manatees can't tell them to stop or tell that they are there," wrote Katy Kraft, an elementary school student in Powhatan, Va.

Why on earth is a Virginia Student worried about manatees?

I have lived in Portsmouth, VA for 25 years and only one Manatee has been found here, it swam the intracoastal waterway up to Hampton, where it was picked up and returned to Florida! If anything, this Intracoastal Waterway has caused more harm if the manatees are leaving thier natural habitat

2 posted on 07/07/2003 6:35:29 AM PDT by Zavien Doombringer (Ain't nothing worse than feeling obsolete....)
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To: repub32; Joe Brower; in_search_of; My Favorite Headache; TonyWojo; countrydummy; nunya bidness; ...
Ping to the South Florida and property rights folks.
3 posted on 07/07/2003 6:37:48 AM PDT by AAABEST
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To: AAABEST
I don't have a problem with the school projects. What 10 year-old doesn't care about maiming and killing a manatee? Invasive species or not, they are God's creatures, do not pose a threat of any kind to humans, and reasonable precautions should be taken to protect them from boaters.
4 posted on 07/07/2003 6:40:48 AM PDT by Trust but Verify (Will work for W)
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To: AAABEST
Save the Cute Animals (eat the rest)!

Lemme guess--the enviros have human-ized the manatees and probably have a mascot named Manny the Manatee, or some such nonsense.

5 posted on 07/07/2003 6:49:19 AM PDT by randog (Everything works great 'til the current flows.)
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To: AAABEST
I'm found it surprising that an article written about manitee safety and the need for protection didn't include the current number of manitees and how that compares to historical norms. It did mention 95 deaths last year. It didn't mention how many births there were last year.
6 posted on 07/07/2003 6:56:37 AM PDT by DoughtyOne (Brother, has your faith lapsed. Renew your conservatism today!)
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To: Trust but Verify
I don't have a problem with the school projects. What 10 year-old doesn't care about maiming and killing a manatee? Invasive species or not, they are God's creatures, do not pose a threat of any kind to humans, and reasonable precautions should be taken to protect them from boaters.

Typical know-nothing canned response.

First of all, this animal doesn't belong here and wouldn't be here if it weren't for humans manipulating God's work. Second we've taken every "reasonable precaution" known to man in regard to this pestilence. We spend more money per manatee around here than we do per child. The reason why they're getting hit by boats more is because the damn things are everywhere nowadays because we've been sucessful. IT'S NOT ENDANGERED.

You sure you're not a lefty type? They use the word "reasonable" every time they want to take unreasonable actions against others.

Of course you have no problem with with leftist teachers from Virginia using your tax dollars for political scam jobs. Given the fact that you just blurt out the first thing that comes to your mind without knowing one single thing about the issue at hand.

7 posted on 07/07/2003 6:56:46 AM PDT by AAABEST
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To: randog
Lemme guess--the enviros have human-ized the manatees and probably have a mascot named Manny the Manatee, or some such nonsense.

It's worse, we have a "Save the Manatee" license plate, and thousands of ninnies buying them thinking they're saving the earth by doing so.

8 posted on 07/07/2003 6:58:55 AM PDT by AAABEST
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To: AAABEST
BTTT!!!!!!!
9 posted on 07/07/2003 6:59:45 AM PDT by E.G.C.
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To: AAABEST
Blame for this lies squarely on the decision makers, who have failed to demonstrate that they have either the technical expertise or wisdom to recognise that a thousand people walking in the wrong direction is still the wrong direction. When a few hundred-thousandth of a percent of the population have a particular opinion and that opinion is made policy, then we ought to just scrap the Constitution and our representative form of government and just adopt a system where all policy is dictated by letters from schoolchildren. The children are without blame. They are being led and manipulated by dishonest adults who wish to circumvent the normal channels of implimentation of public policy.
10 posted on 07/07/2003 7:15:46 AM PDT by SpaceBar
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To: AAABEST
Maybe those of us from other states (like Virginia) should just stay home instead of spending our hard-earned money on over-priced hotels, restaurants and attractions in Florida, since Floridians think of these attractions as a nuisance that should be killed.

The fact is, regardless of how the manatees got there, they're there. And most people actually think that's a good thing. And if a few boaters have to go around or slow down, I don't think it's going to kill anyone or anyone's livlihood.

And yes, I am a conservative, but I refuse to have a knee-jerk negative reaction to everything viewed as pro-environment.

11 posted on 07/07/2003 7:25:06 AM PDT by Trust but Verify (Will work for W)
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To: AAABEST
Typical know-nothing canned response. First of all, this animal doesn't belong here and wouldn't be here if it weren't for humans manipulating God's work.

What a typical know-nothing canned response. Pray tell where You (capitalized as one would the all knowing God) think they belong? Hmm, kinda like You shouldn't be where ever You are if it weren't for humans manipulating God's work by trekking across Africa (or eating an apple in Eden - Your choice) to inhabit the entire world. The fact is the manatees are there. That is their home. They do not harm man. It is man who is harming them. They are on the endangered list. Slowing boaters down and having protective cages around propellers is very little to ask.

12 posted on 07/07/2003 7:27:58 AM PDT by mtbopfuyn
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To: AAABEST
Manatee Meat Cuts **** Manatee Recipes
13 posted on 07/07/2003 7:32:24 AM PDT by joesnuffy (Moderate Islam Is For Dilettantes)
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To: joesnuffy
Hey I didnt steal it ...I wuz just borrowing it...
14 posted on 07/07/2003 7:35:29 AM PDT by joesnuffy (Moderate Islam Is For Dilettantes)
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To: Trust but Verify
The fact is, regardless of how the manatees got there, they're there. And most people actually think that's a good thing. And if a few boaters have to go around or slow down, I don't think it's going to kill anyone or anyone's livlihood.

Fire Ants - look there here. Dont fight them - invite them! Bring them into your home and embrace them.

Any other pearls for us Trust?

I say KILL EM AND GRILL EM!

15 posted on 07/07/2003 7:37:19 AM PDT by corkoman (did someone say cheese?)
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To: AAABEST
While you are technically correct that the manatee is an alien to that stream, I am not sure that putting the word "invasive" on it will stick. It just doesn't fit the image of a sea cow. It might do more to discredit you than to get what you want. Try, "non-indigenous," "alien," or "stray population."

I am certain that there is a bucketload of environmentalist wailing about "thermal pollution' from proposed power plants elsewhere. It would certainly be entertaining to trot that out while reviling its complete lack in your area as evidence of a hidden aganda to sequester an isolated population of manatees contrary to their nature.

Then there are those species that depend upon that seagrass the manatees overgraze. Does Sean have any quantitative data on what the effects on those popoulations are? He could do counts in a similar estuary without a power plant and infer harm to those species where the manatees have taken up residence.

Accuse the environmentalists of holding the manatees hostage in a hostile environment that is incapable of sustaining the manatee population in its natural state. Demand that the power plant install the extra cooling towers (if they haven't already).

OR... compensate all the folks who have to slow their boats down and the business that depend upon them to the point where they don't bitch about it. That's the real price of a manatee refuge. Else it's a taking.
16 posted on 07/07/2003 7:37:50 AM PDT by Carry_Okie (The environment is too complex and too important to be managed by politics.)
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To: mtbopfuyn
May you be so lucky as to have an endangered species placed in your neighborhood (through the Grace of God). Even if the species is invasive. I wish on you an endangered species in your yard. to create havock in your life, and to give you the opportunity to pray your situation away. Environmental zealot
17 posted on 07/07/2003 7:43:58 AM PDT by TonyWojo
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To: Trust but Verify
Maybe those of us from other states (like Virginia) should just stay home......

If you're an example of the type of people who want to come here, PLEASE DO stay home. You and your money is neither needed nor wanted.

And if a few boaters have to go around or slow down, I don't think it's going to kill anyone or anyone's livlihood.

I know you "don't think", neither do the gazillions of other people who hear platitudes such as "save the manatee" and come running when called, cash in hand, like hapless useful dopes. Buying license plate and enriching power hungry environmental orgs.

They've already harmed a great many people, and intend to harm a great many more.

FYI, Cape Coral is a marine city that depends on charter fishing, dock building, river and gulf tours etc. in order to SURVIVE. They're recieving a constant trashing by enviros and the FWS who've taken such measures as imposing idiotic dock building restrictions because somehow they've decided (with no scientific evidence) that docks hurt manatees. Yes, the dock builders and merchants who rely on water access are really being hurt badly, the property values of anyone living waterfront really does plummet.

Then to add insult to injury, we have uninformed dingbats come along and making comments like "I don't think it's going to kill anyone or anyone's livlihood."

Well you think wrong, your type of misplaced compassion is harmful. If you want to be warm, fuzzy and compassionate, start caring about the families and their children, not some fat assed sea cow who's main purpose in life is to make enviros wealthy. If nothing else, at least try to know what you're talking about before weighing in on such matters.

18 posted on 07/07/2003 7:49:59 AM PDT by AAABEST
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To: mtbopfuyn
LOL!!!!!

You need to take some troll lessons from some others who've invaded this board. Lesson #1 is "Don't be an obvious troll by defending leftist ideals when you're a newb who just signed up".

19 posted on 07/07/2003 7:53:51 AM PDT by AAABEST
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To: corkoman
I say KILL EM AND GRILL EM!

Any other pearls for us, Corky?

20 posted on 07/07/2003 8:01:46 AM PDT by Trust but Verify (Will work for W)
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