Iranians want the USA to invade, why they dont invade?

There is a big question while the protests and opposes rised in Iran last week, Why the USA which is next to Iranian borders, dont come in to support or in other words why we Iranians do not see any effective behavior from the US officials. Me, as a citizen of any other country , do not like to see my country to be invaded or collapsed but the real fact in Iran is that the mullahs will not go or over thrown with out any military intervention or support from a powerful source. This is what you can hear in Iran now, I think those men in the Pentagon or the white house should take a decision fast. Are they taking care of the fate of the Iranians? So They have to be more responsible as well. We do not need just words, we need action. The great help America can give us now is to support us more and more not just by words but by actions. Please do something!

One thing we certainly can do: opposition research of their religious leadership. I bet their religious leaders are a bunch of sleazy, hedonistic, embezzling hypocrites. We need our intelligence people to get that info out to the Iranian people, smuggle it out there covertly and subtly.

This is all so much BS. A population can't be freed. They MUST free themselves.

What we did in Iraq was remove a dictator with ideas of world domination. The iraqies want the same government put back with a new improved Saddamless dictator. Without our persistant prodding and occupation, iraq will not emmulate Japan or even Gernmany in reorganization. But an Iraqi government will eventually control it's own population with our help because we took away their last one.

Iranians are no different as far as a populace in need of a government "for the people". We have no reason to topple the government of Iran except to do so as a partisan police action. And history won't even burp if one mullah was replaced with another.

Now as far as supplying weapons, we don't need our government to do that. There are enough floating around the mideast to do the job nicely.

PS..France, Germany, Japan, even Kuwait, said thanks, now get out and leave us alone.
We don't need permission to snuff out terrorists after being attacked and hearing daily threats of future attacks, but we will be nice guys and ask first.

Now on the other hand, dictator deposing is fun! :-)

Well, All people are against the regime now, except a few!
in the case of turmoil in Iran, the ARMY ( not REVOLUTIONARY GUARDS) will take control of the streets and cities because they have been trained in the states, they have been hated for 25 years because they are still pro-shah.
and the things happened in Iraq, wont happen here.
In the time of turmoil, Iranian can control themselves, but I think the time to start this movement is important.
This is a right time that the USA can help by any means.
Hope you understand that we need these supports.
I will try to report more on this case and I will be happy to give you much more info you may need.
What people want now, is a heavy powerful back up from the states.
It is possible and we expect it.
Without a great support, you can not expect a real change here and moreover you wanted me to say the truth.
True things are these : WE NEED SUPPORT TO CHANGE THIS REGIME.

"Of course they have significant support. Who raised these kids" And that's a start, but certainly not 70% of the population. As for smuggling information, hey, the more the better. That's the stuff that needs to be released to the media, not only their own people. We are talking about a whole country (though not gigantic). Not just the capitol city. It's a BIG undertaking and I think they need to be sure of a large percentage of the population behind them, before they start a coup, in order to be successful.

Not so much world opinion as support.

Well, what is support exactly? The UN had been on Saddam's case for over a decade. Sanctions didn't work. I doubt if these mullahs in Iran care very much about world opinion as long as it doesn't look like there's going to be a bottom line (forceable overthrow). The Taliban certainly weren't phased by world opinion. China doesn't care about it. Giving the Iranian opposition guns would seem to fit the bill of support to me. Pressure for the mullahs is having our military camped out next door or having an armed insurrection in Tehran, not a high school demo in Brussels.

No, the mullahs don't care about world opinion. But as word FINALLY started reaching "the outside" about what was happpening under Taliban rule, the idea of going in a getting rid of them, grew in support. Unfortunately, it took a long time before the media saw fit to air the plight of those people also. As for Saddam, if we were seeing every night, the torture and horror that that those people endured, I believe we might have stepped in a bit quicker, due to pressure from US citizens. I believe visuals are much more effective than then UN and sanctions. That's how you gain support. Yes, we can have an army camped out next door. But let's find out first what the people of Iran want. I believe they're in favor of secular democracy, but are their political wishes the same as the students? Maybe the Iraninans as a whole, don't want the students as their new govenment. Then what? You've armed them all...now it's civil war part2. Can't just rush in there with shipments of guns and start handing them out.

Oh, Arthur is right somehow,
I have never walked on your flag, I have never burnt it.
I said once, they painted your sacred flag on the entry of the campus I go! I swear I have never walked on it, I jumped over in winter on ice, in fall in rainy days, in summer.
What or who forced me to jump? you? your government? your movies? your culture? I doubt, it was me, my mind!
The respect you pay to your flag forced me to do so.
I hung one flag of the USA and one former flag of Iran on the wall of my room.
I just hoped that you understand this kind of feeling and I should say, this is not inside me only, I know many people here who act the same as I do.
We respect your country for its values and when we see a bad scene,we ask each other: Is it America?
Be real please and think of what you say.

I don't think anyone needs to tell the Iranians that their leadership is sleazy; they have first hand knowledge.

With so many years in power and (one assumes) a lot of money to toss around, the government WILL have some form of praetorian guard to back it up against the rabble. Since its whole purpose is to hold down internal dissent, much like Iraq, it would melt away in front of the 3d herd and probably in front of a Spec Ops trained local force.

However,

Unfortunately, what is probably necessary is for enough common folk in Iran to rise up so that the mullahs MUST take excessive measures. People have to get hurt and the world has got to know about it (belief might be another thing entirely).

We could only go in as either a stabilizing force to stop that violence, or as an interdiction force to get the Baathist Iraqi's out of the border area...THAT I'd support in an instant.

PS: I've always believed that the big reason Tienanmin (sp?) Square didn't cause any counter action from the west was that we were in on it ... outside provocation would have been proven. We don't want that in Iran - again.

Khashayar,
I am watching the situation in your country with great interest. Please keep us posted on news as we aren't hearing much lately in the media. Let the good people of your country know that our hearts and best wishes are with them. I wish you success in the ouster of the current regime.

But as word FINALLY started reaching "the outside" about what was happpening under Taliban rule, the idea of going in a getting rid of them, grew in support.

Uhh... This wasn't even on the table before 9/11. I wouldn't have supported it myself. Maybe I would've supported nuking them for general purposes but I don't recall an invasion of Afghanistan ever having popular support before 9/11. Can you seriously imagine Clinton asking for that? Maybe Amnesty International was mad about the burkhas and the "intellectual circles" were upset about the Buddhas being dynamited, but these would've been the same groups protesting the invasion had it indeed been proposed.

Can't just rush in there with shipments of guns and start handing them out.

Sure we can. Hell yeah. Why not?

Your method would only take about another 18 or 20 years to work. We see this differently. It's that simple. Basically, nothing to discuss. By the time we get "visuals" on television and have a debate in the UN and group hugs in the street- many of these students who wish to bring the mullahs down will likely be dead.

Because the Iranian people CAN do this themselves. We believe in them, we believe they can do this, they CAN overthrow the mad mullahs, they CAN turn the military to their side, they WILL have a better future if they do this themselves.

If they do it themselves, they have a much better chance of democracy thriving. Look, democracy is hard, there's no two ways about it, but it's the most superior idiology in the world because it's totally about the people. If they people are incapable of sustaining it, it devolves into majority rules and that's a recipe for disaster. We want Iran to be a strong, prosperous, thriving democracy where everyone has a chance to get ahead. We believe the Persian people have an extraordinary headstart because of their history, they are a natural for democracy. The first requirement of a thriving democracy is a belief in the individual. The "I can do this" attitude is the biggest step toward REAL democracy.

Is it hard? Yes. Do you have to pay the price in blood? Yes. Is it worth it? Yes. We know, we did it, and we know the Iranians can too.

"Unfortunately, what is probably necessary is for enough common folk in Iran to rise up so that the mullahs MUST take excessive measures. People have to get hurt and the world has got to know about it"
The students need the backing of the people, for sure. With enough, the mullahs might back off. They don't seem to enjoy "bad press". Certainly, if "excessive measures" are taken, the world must know.

Bush seems to think that Iranians can overthrow the Mullahs on their own. Invasions aren't easy, they cost money, they cost lives, they distract us from other things.

I personally think the Mullahs need to be toppled by any means necessary and I'd support an invasion. But we went out on a limb to liberate Iraq, another war would be politically difficult. But there are a lot of us here who take this very seriously and won't let our government forget about the Iranian people.

This is the second thoughtful post you made that I've read in a row. You make interesting points. Realistic and thoughtful. I never considered that we couldn't intervene over Tienimen [sic?-- me either, LOL!] Squre because we might have been in on the uproar? Is that what you were suspected? [Not sure I fully understand.] So it's possible that China had the goods on us? I always thought it was because we were intimidated by the sheer size of their army and our government was corrupted by bribes, illegal contributions, along with drug-and-orgy bashes with secret cameras for blackmail.

Regardless, rumors about sleaze are one thing. But when you have agents get the goods on their clergy, [which wouldn't really expect us to bother with matters that might seem petty-- they are likely pretty sloppy about keeping it secret], they get tape recordings, recorded wire taps, video footage, secretly help out a few witnesses or operatives who want to defect-- with them thinking some benign businessman from Australia helped them or some former Iranian citizen living in Singapore helped them, etc, [but even that is supposed to be a secret that the defector keeps from the public], then you get that stuff smuggled into Iran, the result is a severe public reaction for a few million dollars, and your fingerprints aren't even on it.

Smart protesters know where the eye of tolas' henchmen live and gather - in greater and greater numbers. Brownshirts by other name...or hat.

Each protester is but a number for the "knock on the door" for the neo-Stalinists of Islam.

The eye of tolas' filled graveyards with these protesters' older siblings when child minesweepers and gas sniffing "canaries" went to the front against Sodamn.

Wars for liberty are fought on door steps and in hallways just as they are fought in city squares. The not-yet free understand the value of personal arms far more than not-for-long free in temporary utopia.

We're too busy squandering on money for food to North Korea, which gets funnelled to the black market, to Mugabe, who funnels, food back to the black market, and to getting our senior citizens 'free drugs', paying the IRS billions of dollars that 'vanish', pumping billions into our useless Department of Energy, shovelling billions to sugar farmers, paying the NEA to make perversions of Our Lord and Savior perfoming homosexual acts, and increasing the budget of our incredibly 'wonderful' public school system [that probably does less for more than the school system in Iran], and buying million-dollar outhouses, than to waste our precious money on helping Iranians. We have to pinch our pennies, don't you know?

No more Mr. Nice Guy, we need to conserve our cash.

[Just being sarcastic. I'm afraid we have not done a very good job with our government spending, which now causes others to suffer longer in a very real and dangerous way, doesn't it?]

"Your method would only take about another 18 or 20 years to work."

LOL! 18 to 20 years? Good grief. Seven years, tops. Perhaps we could do it in little over a year. Two and a half years is probably a good guess, especially if we help undermine public loyalty toward the regime for the next six months and tread very lightly with Green Baret starting off. I believe in overkill when it comes to exposing enemy sleaze.

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