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Iranians want the USA to invade, why they dont invade?

Posted on 06/28/2003 1:19:00 AM PDT by Khashayar

There is a big question while the protests and opposes rised in Iran last week, Why the USA which is next to Iranian borders, dont come in to support or in other words why we Iranians do not see any effective behavior from the US officials. Me, as a citizen of any other country , do not like to see my country to be invaded or collapsed but the real fact in Iran is that the mullahs will not go or over thrown with out any military intervention or support from a powerful source. This is what you can hear in Iran now, I think those men in the Pentagon or the white house should take a decision fast. Are they taking care of the fate of the Iranians? So They have to be more responsible as well. We do not need just words, we need action. The great help America can give us now is to support us more and more not just by words but by actions. Please do something!


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; War on Terror; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: iran; middleeast; usa
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To: Khashayar
I don't blame you for raising cain! Don't let all the naysaying discourage you! You build leverage for war hawks out here. We can't push for liberation from your evil regime until we have a lot more leverage, which is growing steadilly with time. Keep it up! Raise cain! It helps your cause tremendously to post here on the FR. Keep out of trouble and keep posting as much as you can. Others will certainly turn to violence. Don't join them. You are a vital resource to your cause and must not be harmed. I'll pray to my God for you and your nation to be free. Keep flooding us with info. Add a bookmark to every article you make like this. Try to post a new article here every day or twice a day if that is possible. I'll send you a private message for more tips. GOOD WORK! This is the perfect place for you to be. FReegards....
21 posted on 06/28/2003 3:44:09 AM PDT by Arthur Wildfire! March (LIBERTY or DEATH!)
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To: Arthur Wildfire! March
We could help by plastering the news outlets with more requests for news on what's going on in Iran.

I'll do anything to avoid discussing Hillrey's book or the Laci Peterson case.

22 posted on 06/28/2003 3:50:28 AM PDT by piasa (Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge.)
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To: Alamo-Girl; Lion's Cub; Miss Marple; SpookBrat
fyi
23 posted on 06/28/2003 3:52:14 AM PDT by piasa (Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge.)
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To: piasa
Thanks. Read this with interest.
24 posted on 06/28/2003 3:54:20 AM PDT by Miss Marple
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To: Khashayar
We will have to deal with Iran, and Syria as well. Those nations can't tolerate a free Iraq on their border and will continuously destabilize our reconstruction efforts there. Sadly, especially for our military forces who must deal with the sneak attacks being sponsored by Iran and Syria, new military action will have to wait until after the 2004 election. Make use of the time by studying the suicidal madness of liberalism so that Iran, if freed from tyranny, may avoid such self destructive political insanity.
25 posted on 06/28/2003 3:57:59 AM PDT by milemark
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To: Arthur Wildfire! March; Khashayar
Here's an interesting item from FrontpageMag.com :

Symposium: Whither Iran?
By Jamie Glazov
FrontPageMagazine.com | June 27, 2003

As young Iranians take to the streets to protest against tyranny and to fight for freedom, it has become clear that a revolutionary situation might be developing in the country. How much power do the ruling mullahs really have? Is it possible that the Iranian people might actually overthrow the despotic clerics in the near future? What policy should the U.S. government pursue toward this boiling situation?

To discuss these and other questions with Frontpage Symposium, we are joined by: Dariush Homayoun, ex-Minister of Iranian Information (under the Shah) and today the most prominent leader of the Iranian opposition; Kaveh Ehsani, a research director at Jomhur Research Institute in Tehran and an editor of a journal called Goft-o-Gu (Dialogue); Reza Bayegan, a commentator on Iranian politics who was born in Iran and currently works for the British Council in Paris. He contributes weekly columns to the Iran va Jahan Website and is a regular guest on Iranian radio shows in exile; Daniel Brumberg, an Associate Professor of Government at Georgetown University, a visiting scholar at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, and author of Reinventing Khomeini: The Struggle for Reform in Iran; and Jacob Heilbrunn, editoral writer and staff member of the Los Angeles Times, in Washington, DC.

Interlocutor: Welcome gentlemen. At this very moment, Iranians are protesting on the streets of Iran. Is a democratic revolution pending? Will there be a Tiananmen-type crackdown? What is your reading of the events?

Ehsani: A revolution? Probably not. Similar protests, on an even bigger scale, have take place in the past 6 years. The current student protests were spontaneous by all accounts and began with demands for maintaining tuition-free education. Chances are that protesters were provoked to come out of the campuses and give more radical political slogans as a result of provocations by agents of hardliners in Iran. This provocation limits the scale of protests as violence naturally intimidates others from joining in, as well as justifying crackdowns in the name of law and order. Also, this may have been a tactical move ahead of the expected larger student protests on the anniversary of July 9, the date that security forces cracked down on student campuses three years ago. The current skirmishes will take the wind out of that potentially larger and more universally recognized event.

Bayegan: The clerical regime has exhausted all its possibilities for survival. It no longer makes any bones about its total disregard for the nation's wishes and aspirations. Mr Khameini unabashedly threatens the students with further vigilante attacks should they continue their protests. The shouts of the young and old denouncing the regime and its custodians are heard everyday and are gathering strength by the minute. People have recognized that Khameini and Khatami are only variations on the same sordid theme of tyranny and repression. The Islamic Republic never was, and never will become, compatible with democratic principles.

The student movement in Iran is acting in a disciplined manner and its behavior is in total accordance with the tenets of a non-violent movement to bring about political change in the country. As the regime feels more and more threatened and takes further drastic measures to crush this peaceful protest, it makes itself uglier and uglier in the eyes of the population.

In Iran, the students have traditionally symbolized innocence and intelligence. These two qualities make them appear saintly in the eyes of a population who will not forgive anyone who dares to harm them under any pretext whatsoever.

The veneration and love the Iranians bestow on their Shia Imams comes from their belief that these great religious characters stood up for their convictions and died in the service of truth and justice. They were martyred by their accursed opponents who only thought of their own immediate political survival. Mr Khamenei cannot pretend to preserve the Shia faith by shedding the innocent blood of the Iranian youth. He is seen more and more as the cruel, unprincipled man who is really the antitheses of what he pretends to be. He is increasingly seen as the enemy of justice and the persecutor of the people. The students shouting “Death to Khamenei!” in the streets during the past seven days are clearly demonstrating what they think of the man who calls himself the leader of all Muslims and the protector of the underprivileged.

The comparison with Tiananmen Square is correct in so as far as the Iranian regime will act with the same cruelty if not worse to repress the student movement. What we have to realize however is that the Iranian government poses a far greater danger to world security than the Chinese government did in 1989. The Chinese government, although qualifying as a brutal dictatorship, did not harbor members of international assassins that were responsible for blowing up almost 3,000 people in New York in a single day and did not fund terrorist groups that were carrying out daily acts of violence in the Middle East in order to undermine peace and stability. The success of the freedom movement in Iran will not only serve to save the Iranian nation from a repressive regime, but needs full international support to put an end to a major menace facing the whole world and endangering the cause of freedom and democracy.

Ehsani: The situation in Iran is disturbing enough by itself and we should refrain from making hyperbolic statements of this kind that only serve to further confuse the picture: Iran is not ''the major menace facing the whole world''. The world has just witnessed the de-facto illegal invasion and occupation of Iraq, based on the same kind of rhetoric. Although the reviled Baath regime is no longer there the consequences of that invasion and occupation for regional and world stability, for the functionality of multilateral institutions, and for the long-suffering Iraqi people are at best uncertain and quite disturbing.

As for Al Qaeda 'destroying peace and stability in the Middle East' I am sure very few informed and intelligent reader, no matter what their political persuasion, would label the pre-9/11 situation in the Middle East as 'peaceful and stable'!

Even the comparison with China is problematic: What if in 1989 several of China's neighbours had been invaded militarily, and there were hundreds of thousands of hostile troops on its borders, and the US administration and Congress were allocating substantial amounts of money and openly calling for the overthrow of the Chinese regime? Would China have become a greater menace to ''world security'' under such circumstances?

After half a century of flawed politics in the Middle East, most of which has been based on a simplistic and reductionist rhetoric of defining ''the evil enemy'', it is high time for insisting on more nuanced and insightful political analysis. Iran is certainly such a case, so let us avoid resorting to reductionist and apocalyptic rhetoric which will only hinder our understanding of a complex situation.

Currently, and for the past few years, any and all social gatherings and collective actions, no matter how apolitical and innocuous, (like people celebrating a soccer match, or New Year, or accompanying the funeral of a public figure, etc.) are harassed by groups of thugs and provoked into violent confrontations.

The logic is clear: Once any small gathering can be provoked into violence and crackdown it will prevent other sympathizers from joining in. This was definitely the case with these demonstrations. I sympathize with and fully share the emotional outrage of Mr Bayegan against the attacks on student demonstrations. But the fact of the matter is that the demonstrations did start spontaneously, over tuition demands, a highly important issue especially for provincial students. The unorganized students were then attacked by quickly assembled bands of thugs. And since the hardliners have encouraged a culture of public violence by attacking any legitimate public gathering, the disorganized students responded by counter-attacking, thus opening the way for large scale repression of the campuses. All of us who want to see democracy proceed and succeed in Iran need to keep our head, and avoid emotionalism, and analyze the political situation for what it is. The adoption of disciplined and appropriate tactics by the democratic movement are vital now.

Unfortunately, I believe the recent protests were a clear short-term victory for the hardliners. My guess is that the attacks on student demonstrations were orchestrated to radicalize the situation ahead of July 9, the anniversary of the crackdown on university uprisings in 1999. Once university gatherings become politicized and controlled by riot police the chance of the public at large practically supporting these actions become very remote.

....continued.... see source for more

26 posted on 06/28/2003 4:06:08 AM PDT by piasa (Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge.)
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To: LibWhacker; Khashayar
LibWhacker, ease up on the poor guy. Do you really think he was overthrowing the Shaw while in diapers? I'm not even sure that Kashayar was even born when the Shaw was toppled. Even if he was running around in a toddler-walker with grenades in his tiny hands, the only reason the Iranians overthrew the Shaw was due to ignorance. Now they regret their actions.

I would love nothing better than to take down an evil regime that funds international terror groups and liberating the Iranian people at the same time. God willing, we will deal with Iran in time.
27 posted on 06/28/2003 4:09:30 AM PDT by Arthur Wildfire! March (LIBERTY or DEATH!)
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from Reuters via MSNBC:

Iran Says 4,000 Arrested During Recent Protests

Analysts said the new number from Iran's Prosecutor General Ayatollah Abdonnabi Namazi suggested the protests had been larger than authorities had previously acknowledged.

''That's a lot of (arrested) people. It just shows that these protests were actually quite large and widespread,'' said one local analyst who declined to be named.

The demonstrations started in Tehran about three weeks ago. Hundreds of university students were joined by a few thousand ordinary people each night who chanted slogans against Iran's clerical rulers and called for greater democracy and freedom.

The protests, which included harsh criticism of moderate President Mohammad Khatami as well as the conservative clerics who have blocked his attempts at reform, spread to more than half a dozen other cities.

But they were soon stamped out by a large security response involving riot police and hardline vigilantes armed with batons and chains who are fiercely loyal to conservative clerics.

Namazi told the ISNA students news agency more than 4,000 people had been detained. He said about 40 percent of those had been released quickly. The remainder, including 800 students in Tehran alone, remained in custody.

Scores of student activists have been arrested in recent days, even after the protests had fizzled out, in an apparent attempt to prevent students marking the July 9 anniversary of a violent 1999 attack on a Tehran University dormitory by Islamic vigilantes.

Officials say they will prevent students holding any events to commemorate the 1999 attack which sparked the worst street unrest seen in Iran since the 1979 Islamic revolution.

''The high-ranking security officials believe July 9 is an event that does not need an anniversary. An incident which happened some years ago does not require an event to be held to commemorate it,'' Namazi said.

Reformist legislators this week criticised Khatami for not taking a firmer stand against the wave of recent arrests. Many families have not been informed where their arrested relatives are being held.

Tehran's Prosecutor General Saeed Mortazavi said 50 of those being held in Tehran were ready for trial. He said the judiciary was also investigating whether some MPs had encouraged students to go out and protest.

''We are investigating the issue and if we come to the conclusion that the parliamentarians encouraged the students, we will undoubtedly summon them and confront them,'' ISNA quoted Mortazavi as saying.

28 posted on 06/28/2003 4:13:51 AM PDT by piasa (Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge.)
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To: Khashayar
...the real fact in Iran is that the mullahs will not go or over thrown with out any military intervention or support from a powerful source.

Iranians do not have a leader.

Give Me Liberty or Give Me Death

Power from the people.
29 posted on 06/28/2003 4:18:09 AM PDT by non-anonymous
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To: piasa
This is interesting.

''We are investigating the issue and if we come to the conclusion that the parliamentarians encouraged the students, we will undoubtedly summon them and confront them,'' ISNA quoted Mortazavi as saying

30 posted on 06/28/2003 4:19:11 AM PDT by piasa (Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge.)
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To: piasa; Khashayar
TY for that. I analyze it this way: there are always two kinds of leaders during domestic discord-- hawks and doves. The leader being interviewed is a dove. Doves pave the way. But if the evil regime is unwilling to bend, such as in this case, the hawks get the job done.

It's always difficult to decide when leadership should shift. Here in America, we had a similar struggle over Clinton. We had hawks and doves. Hawks wanted to begin fighting with guns. I took them on here in the FR. In the end, we rode out the Clinton nighmare without violence being the deciding factor. If we had turned to violence, I believe we would have had martial law, an executive order banning guns, and a crackdown on the internet and 'hate-radio'. Militias could have given Clinton an excuse to crush all opposition with the full might of the US military.

Then there is the example of Texas: Houston and Austin. One wanted to negotiate with Mexico peacefully. The other wanted to confront Mexico violently. The time for peace, at some point, had to end. It is always difficult to know when that should occur.

Where does Iran stand? It's perpetual martial law out there, and you must be Islam-approved by their fanatic clergy before you can run for political office. On the other hand, there is a relative level of free speech. We have a student posting here on the FR. They have protests-- BUT, it is obvious to me that free speech is being supressed through violence. So, there you have it. We need to send in the Green Baret [Special Forces] and train up some spies and freedom fighters. I've read somewhere, not sure of the source, that has already happened.
31 posted on 06/28/2003 4:35:27 AM PDT by Arthur Wildfire! March (LIBERTY or DEATH!)
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To: ChrisCoolC; Arthur Wildfire! March; piasa
Oh, You are all correct and thinking of the true things, but it doesnt mean to forget who we were and who you are,
A little active support wont get your money and your energy.
If I were a guy, man or whatever in the 1979 crisis, I would help Shah to win.
It was a real tragedy, a real mistake made by people.
Hope you understand us more and more!
32 posted on 06/28/2003 4:36:03 AM PDT by Khashayar
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To: Khashayar
Unfortunately, we can't fight everyones battles. They are going to have to take care of it. I wouldn't mind training and providing some weapons though...
33 posted on 06/28/2003 4:36:55 AM PDT by ItisaReligionofPeace ((the original))
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To: backhoe
Here we have an Iranian student posting in our forum, begging us to liberate his country. Violence is breaking out in Iran. A few freepers are simply blowing off his request. While I knew there should be a calming period after Iraq, I didn't expect freepers to go this far to calm things down. Also, I vaguely recall reading somewhere that we had already sent the Green Baret into Iran. Thought you might be interested. God bless you and your wonderful mother-- who is watching down on you and the Free World. FReegards....
34 posted on 06/28/2003 4:45:15 AM PDT by Arthur Wildfire! March (LIBERTY or DEATH!)
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To: Khashayar
"Hope you understand us more and more!"

That is the key. Help us understand. Describe examples of what is going on out there. Mention injuries and suffering in detail. What I'm saying is, the best way you can help your nation is to be like a reporter.

Please be patient. So long as you are not in any trouble, be a reporter. Some of your friends will die before it's over. You might as well realise that. It will get worse before it gets better.
35 posted on 06/28/2003 4:53:14 AM PDT by Arthur Wildfire! March (LIBERTY or DEATH!)
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To: Arthur Wildfire! March
Thanks, Arthur!
36 posted on 06/28/2003 4:56:16 AM PDT by backhoe (Just an old keyboard cowboy, ridin' the trackball into the sunset...)
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To: Khashayar
You tell me why American son's and daughter's should place their lives on the line for you??

Make it good. Your countrymen have spit on us to many times for us to bother. We are not the world's police force, and just because we CAN overthrow your government, does not mean we will or should.

What about the people of Zimbabwe, Cuba, North Korea, China and even the lousy french, they all need new leadership too.

Your best bet is Jimmy Carter. He eats this stuff up. although, he never accomplishes anything, he is a pawn of the UN and does have a nice history with Iran. And if you're lucky Sean Penn will come and visit.
37 posted on 06/28/2003 5:07:08 AM PDT by JoeSixPack1 (POW/MIA - Bring 'em home, or send us back! Semper Fi)
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To: JoeSixPack1
JoeSixPack
This is not what I have expected from you and I think it takes a long long time to work on your mind to change it and to teach you true from untrue.
The most important thing, you should know is that you elected Jimmy carter not us, I dislike him as much as I dislike Khomeini.
I guess, you have no information about Iran and middle-east.
I am ready to give you whatever you need to know.
I am here to be a voice of real things.It is good that you know, THE USA is not world police but it acts as a police.
So when it takes the role to be police, it should help.
otherwise no one will trust him.
Take the responsibility and do what you can
Thanks alot.
38 posted on 06/28/2003 5:29:06 AM PDT by Khashayar
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To: Travis McGee
Holy crap. I thought the demonstrators were trying to do this in a non-violent way. Showing the world how they were being bullied and beaten just for speaking out. They won't get much sympathy from the rest of the world if they start shooting!
39 posted on 06/28/2003 5:30:18 AM PDT by nuconvert
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To: Khashayar
You are correct. We elected Jimmy Carter. Everyone makes mistakes. But we didn't elect him twice. We made that mistake with Clinton. That is the difference in our countries.

We have elections. Carter on the other hand, after being snubed in his reelection bid, can't keep his nose out of everyone else's business. He even accepted a Nobel Peace Prize as a snub to our current President.

You still have not explained why American's should risk the lives of our children to change your legal government's rule?

I should send my kids to get shot at by YOUR Leaders? WHY?????

I don't need mind changing, I need to fear your government, which I don't. You do.
40 posted on 06/28/2003 5:40:22 AM PDT by JoeSixPack1 (POW/MIA - Bring 'em home, or send us back! Semper Fi)
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