Mixed Premises: A Critique of Murray Rothbard’s “Sociology of the Ayn Rand Cult”

The Rational Argumentator ^ | June 18, 2003 | G. Stolyarov II

[Charles H. (The_r0nin)]

The frightening thing is that we've agreed on the last two threads we've been on today (this one about the Randroids and earlier about the Harry Potter/Paganism/Libertarian-hedonism thing). Spooky!

[u-89]

Moral-Liberal pledge to turn a blind eye to evil.

So you think the governments job is to fight sin? There is a big difference between liberals and libertarians which you refuse to recognize. Liberals wish to push their beliefs on the rest of the us through government action. With libertarians in charge of government the liberals would be all bark and no teeth - even their bark would be greatly diminished as they use government funding for many of their blow horns. While conservatives are not as pernicious as liberals many tend to have plans for government that do not respect liberty and are therefore much closer to the liberal mindset than libertarians are.

[Cultural Jihad]

Liberals wish to push their beliefs on the rest of the us through government action.

Case in point: Drug legalization and homosexuality legalization and perversion legalization and prostitution legalization and adultery legalization and pornography legalization and obscenity legalization and abortion legalization.

[LiteKeeper]

Sociology SITREP

[OWK]

objunktivism <== schlock - taut - ology - Atheism - Reason -- KNOWLEDGE // philosphy -- technology // science ==> TRUTH !

firehat <== norm - froot- ology - schism - noReason -- antiKNOWLEDGE // philodough -- luddite // scared of science ==> TRUTH !

[f.Christian]

To: firehat
It has been said that in the early days of his too-brief career as a guitarist, when Jimi Hendrix entered a bar to entertain other guitarists would pack up and leave in embarrassment.
For me, Norm, you have become the Jimi Hendrix of the political word. May you live long, and prosper!
From: The Duke () *
01/10/98 02:37:40 PST

---

To: The Duke
Re: Jimi Hendrix; the mechanism of death:
Newsflash: After writing the song Foxy Lady, for Janet Reno, a fan in Coral Springs, FL, Janet thanked him with a note and a photo of herself at the beach. This afternoon, in his hotel room, while eating a tuna fish sandwich in bed Jimi read the note and checked out the photo. Sadly we report that he choked to death !

Bet Jimi wishes "they all could be California girls...."
From: tommyboy mailto:tommyboy_52@hotmail.com *
01/10/98 04:12:05 PST

---

To: The Duke
The Duke - Before I was a writer I was a musician. I and most of the musicians I knew, no matter how accomplished they were, found our instruments unconquerable. Jimi Hendrix was a glorious exception to any such limitation. You do me great honor and I am mindful of it. Thank you.
Best, Norm (firehat)

[theKing]

How is evolution antithetical to conservatism? I don't see it attached to any particular ideology. Lots of the liberal professors here at my particular college are creationist, whereas lots of posters on FreeRepublic Do think that evolution is the explainiation of the presence of current life-forms.

Oh, and by the way, A republic is not a different kind of government from a democracy. A republic is a kind of democracy; one that has no monarch, a federal system of government, a written constitution, and representitives elected by the people to run the government.

[f.Christian]

The constitution is anti evolution ... caps on growth (( power )) - change (( structure )) --- but pro science - technology (( freedom - markets - elections ) !

Evolution via a left wing bolshevik monopoly reversed everthing into a technocracy -- cabal orchestrated by the media and schools !

Ebolution is an insidious conspiracy of brainwashing - indoctrination - manipulation - control --- tyranny !

Main Entry: in·sid·i·ous
Pronunciation: in-'si-dE-&s
Function: adjective
Etymology: Latin insidiosus, from insidiae ambush, from insidEre to sit in, sit on, from in- + sedEre to sit -- more at SIT
Date: 1545
1 a : awaiting a chance to entrap : TREACHEROUS b : harmful but enticing : SEDUCTIVE < insidious drugs >
2 a : having a gradual and cumulative effect : SUBTLE < the insidious pressures of modern life > b of a disease : developing so gradually as to be well established before becoming apparent
- in·sid·i·ous·ly adverb
- in·sid·i·ous·ness noun

[A_perfect_lady]

What do you have to do to be a member of this Ayn Rand cult? Do you have to pay dues or what?

Just admit that some of her ideas seem quite valid to you and the Christians on Free Republic will grant you cult-member status immediately, with all the perks: insults, sneers, accusations, and dire warnings about how you're going to hell. If you're lucky, you'll even get an f.Christian post full of incoherent phrases, dots, and arrows, thus signifying gold member status.

[f.Christian]

Evolution is an insidious conspiracy of brainwashing - indoctrination - manipulation - control --- tyranny // RAPE !

[A_perfect_lady]

Evolution is an insidious conspiracy of brainwashing - indoctrination - manipulation - control --- tyranny // RAPE !

See? I'm a Gold Member.

[Prodigal Son]

LOL! I guess since I've read all her books- fiction and nonfiction- at one time or another, that makes me a card carrying member as well. We ought to have a secret handshake or something.

I still haven't found time to read this article but I am meaning to ;-)

[f.Christian]

The secret libertarian hand shake (( knuckles to knuckles )) ... YAH MAhn !

[f.Christian]

I was watching on O'Reilly about the conservative teacher ... Miller --- who wrote a book on game theory ---why the faculty won't give him tenure because basically the mind sets of liberals are opposite of conservatism !

Rev.13

[1] And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
[2] And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
[3] And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
[4] And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
[5] And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

[6] And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name ((Creator )), and his tabernacle (( creation )) , and them that dwell in heaven.


[7] And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
[8] And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
[9] If any man have an ear, let him hear.
[10] He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

[11] And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb (( republic )), and he spake as a dragon (( nazi )).

[12] And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship (( inquisition )) the first beast, whose deadly wound (( religious tyranny // reformation )) was healed.

[13] And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
[14] And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
[15] And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
[16] And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
[17] And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
[18] Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six (( 666 )) !

[RightWhale]

What do you have to do to be a member of this Ayn Rand cult?

Join the Libertarian Party and talk about setting up a commune on a deserted island where you can scrounge for driftwood to make crafts objects to sell to tourists. Don't actually move to the deserted island.

[Prodigal Son]

You know, my own theory about you f.Christian is that you're a Pierson's Puppeteer.

[Prodigal Son]

Interesing. Ayn Rand wasn't a libertarian. She hated 'em.

[RightWhale]

Ayn Rand wasn't a libertarian.

No, but in the beginning Libertarians talked endlessly about Ayn Rand. Maybe they thought a mysterious person would drop a brick of gold at their feet to bribe them to drop out.

[rattrap]

Ayn Rand on Libertarianism:

5. Does Objectivism support Libertarianism?


“For the record, I shall repeat what I have said many times before: I do not join or endorse any political group or movement. More specifically, I disapprove of, disagree with and have no connection with, the latest aberration of some conservatives, the so-called ‘hippies of the right,’ who attempt to snare the younger or more careless ones of my readers by claiming simultaneously to be followers of my philosophy and advocates of anarchism. Anyone offering such a combination confesses his inability to understand either. Anarchism is the most irrational, anti-intellectual notion ever spun by the concrete-bound, context-dropping, whim-worshiping fringe of the collectivist movement, where it properly belongs.”
[Ayn Rand, “Brief Summary,” The Objectivist, September 1971]

“Above all, do not join the wrong ideological groups or movements, in order to ‘do something.’ By ‘ideological’ (in this context), I mean groups or movements proclaiming some vaguely generalized, undefined (and, usually, contradictory) political goals. (E.g., the Conservative Party, which subordinates reason to faith, and substitutes theocracy for capitalism; or the ‘libertarian’ hippies, who subordinate reason to whims, and substitute anarchism for capitalism.) To join such groups means to reverse the philosophical hierarchy and to sell out fundamental principles for the sake of some superficial political action which is bound to fail. It means that you help the defeat of your ideas and the victory of your enemies.”
[Ayn Rand, “What Can One Do?,” Philosophy: Who Needs It]

See also: “Libertarianism: The Perversion of Liberty,” by Peter Schwartz in the Ayn Rand collection The Voice of Reason.

from the Ayn Rand Institue FAQ www.aynrand.org

[G. Stolyarov II]

Cultural Jihad, for the second time, seems to be seeking to bar my freedom of speech in the face of much interest in my work from other parties. He is a censoring fundamentalist of the worst sort. Cultural Jihad, either lay off, or I shall invert your strategy