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Property rights group seeks positives after election defeats
Naples Daily News ^ | November 9, 2002 | ERIC STAATS

Posted on 11/09/2002 5:42:57 PM PST by farmfriend

Property rights group seeks positives after election defeats

By ERIC STAATS, Saturday, November 9, 2002

Picking through the pieces of this week's election, Bill Lhota says he has found signs of life for property rights advocates.

Lhota, president of the Property Rights Action Committee, was among a slate of three losing candidates for the Collier Soil and Water Conservation District that ran on a platform of killing the agency's proposal for a mitigation bank in Golden Gate Estates.

And a greenspace tax that had attracted opposition from property rights advocates went on to victory, passing with almost 60 percent of the vote.

Lhota, a construction consultant, said Friday he had hoped for better but that precinct results from rural parts of the county prove that a property rights movement has taken root in Golden Gate Estates.

"I don't think that when you consider this was a countywide race that we did that badly," Lhota said.

Florida Wildlife Federation field representative Nancy Payton, who pushed for the greenspace tax, said she considered Tuesday's election to be a litmus test for PRAC — and it failed.

"Clearly the community doesn't like their message," Payton said.

The election was not a total loss for PRAC, an analysis of precinct results shows.

Not including absentee votes, Lhota won eight of the county's 90 precincts against East Naples resident John Cochrane, and PRAC Treasurer Lynda Hittinger came out on top in 28 precincts in her race against Marco Island resident Michael Urbanik.

TaxWatch of Collier County founder Ty Agoston lost every precinct to incumbent Michael Ramsey.

Seven of Lhota's winning precincts are east of Collier Boulevard in Golden Gate Estates. The eighth precinct contains Estates-zoned land off of Oakes Boulevard between Immokalee Road and Vanderbilt Beach Road.

Hittinger won the same precincts as Lhota plus more precincts in the Estates and around Immokalee and precincts along U.S. 41 East, in Golden Gate and in North Naples.

Both Lhota and Hittinger won the precinct that contains the area in the Estates north of Interstate 75 that is targeted for a Regional Offsite Mitigation Area by the Collier Soil and Water District.

The ROMA would be preserved with money that landowners in the Estates pay to meet their mitigation requirement for destroying wetlands. Opponents say the plan's cost estimates are out of whack and that the plan will flood 291 homes already built in the ROMA areas.

Lhota's home and acreage in the ROMA area was the site of the Sawgrass Rebellion last month. Hundreds of people attended the rally against government mistreatment of landowners affected by Everglades restoration.

That event and the anti-ROMA slate of candidates were a regular feature of local talk radio in the weeks running up to the election. The exposure was not enough but it served a purpose, Lhota said.

"Between the Sawgrass Rebellion and the election, we've got people thinking about this stuff," Lhota said. "That's good; at least it opens up some dialogue."

Lhota said PRAC would stay on top of the ROMA proposal, which is undergoing review by the state Department of Environmental Protection. A second draft is in the works.

"We'll try to convince (Soil and Water District) board members that their study is flawed," Lhota said.

The same voters who put Golden Gate Estates precincts in PRAC candidates' column also voted against the greenspace measure on Tuesday's ballot, precinct results show.

The measure authorizes county commissioners to issue up to $75 million in bonds to buy green space for preservation and public access. The bonds are payable from an annual quarter-mill property tax for 10 years. The tax amounts to $25 per $100,000 of taxable property value.

Not including absentee votes, nine of the county's 90 precincts voted against the measure — and every one of them is east of Collier Boulevard in the Estates out to Immokalee or southeast of State Road 92, including Port of the Islands and Everglades City.

When all the counting was done, though, the measure won with 46,192 votes, or 59.2 percent, in favor and 31,864 votes, or 40.8 percent, opposed.

An ordinance that would set out the rules for the how the money would be spent is working its way toward a Dec. 3 vote by county commissioners. A draft version of the law won easy approval from commissioners in October.

Commission Chairman Jim Coletta said he expects a "whole new level of interest" from the public now that the tax measure has passed muster with voters.

Coletta, whose district includes Golden Gate Estates, said he thinks the draft law is "pretty close to where we need to be" but that he is eager to hear from the public.

"This is a considerable sum of money and it's something that will affect the county for 10 years," Coletta said. "We want to be sure we do it right the first time. We want to make sure the public is heard on this."

Coletta raised the possibility of a special workshop session to take public input before a final vote.

PRAC president Lhota called Friday for his group to have a seat on the nine-member advisory board that will recommend land to be purchased with the greenspace money.

"I think that should be something we pursue," Lhota said.


TOPICS: Activism/Chapters; Breaking News; Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events; US: California; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: government; landgrab; propertyrights; rebellion; reuters; sawgrass
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And you thought Sawgrass was over.
1 posted on 11/09/2002 5:42:57 PM PST by farmfriend
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To: Carry_Okie; Grampa Dave; forester; sasquatch; B4Ranch; SierraWasp; hedgetrimmer; christie; ...
ping
2 posted on 11/09/2002 5:43:44 PM PST by farmfriend
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To: farmfriend
What does "Property Rights" mean to Americans?
3 posted on 11/09/2002 7:02:20 PM PST by shetlan
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To: farmfriend
Bump.
4 posted on 11/09/2002 8:27:16 PM PST by hedgetrimmer
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To: farmfriend
I wonder if it will EVER be over. I'd like to live long enough to see this nonsense end, but who the heck wants to be 150 years old!
5 posted on 11/09/2002 8:27:41 PM PST by AuntB
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To: farmfriend
And you thought Sawgrass was over.

To those who thought that.....Not Hardly! "We have only just begun to fight".

6 posted on 11/09/2002 9:33:22 PM PST by Madcelt
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To: AuntB
I wonder if it will EVER be over.

It makes the fight hard but the need is great.

7 posted on 11/09/2002 11:35:12 PM PST by farmfriend
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To: shetlan
It amazes me that, until women got the vote, they were generally not able to own property. They were considered chatel of their fathers and husbands. That is half the population of the United States and it was not that long ago, and yet, we forget how important the right to own property is.

The ownership of "property" is a fundamental cornerstone of freedom. It is the right to own ones own body and the labor of that body. As an extension, ownership translates into a natural relationship one has with the objects that one mixes with his labor.

There are several property rights - these include the right to own and possess, the right to dispose of, the right to use and enjoy (and to chose how to use and enjoy.) Under the American system, the right to use one's own property is supposedly subject only to the maxim that one may not use one's property in a manner that substantially injures or endangers the health, safety or property of others.

Property is the basis for economic self-determination, economic and social mobility, community economic stability. It is a keystone for personal incentive and economic investment.

To the extent that the collective community encroaches upon individual property rights by regulating use beyond prevention of public injury, it diminishes the economic value of the property. It also impresses the labor of the individual into service of the whole.

This is my basic understanding of a fundamental difference in the beliefs of the Conservative and the Liberal. The Conservative believes in the Conservation of individual property rights and protection of those rights from encroachment by the public. The Liberal believes that property must be redistributed on an equitable basis. The Liberal believes that the public has the dominate right to determine how property should be used, that it must serve the general public's needs first and that individual use is only a subordinate privilege as suffered by the community. The Liberal believes that the community actually collectively owns all resources and that individual ownership is a privilege conditional upon community desires and needs.
8 posted on 11/10/2002 2:15:32 AM PST by marsh2
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To: marsh2; Carry_Okie
You understand correctly.

Liberals believe that man does NOT have a right to live for his own sake, but must serve the wishes of society.

9 posted on 11/10/2002 3:17:38 AM PST by snopercod
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To: AuntB; farmfriend; TonyWojo; Madcelt; Joe Brower; Fearless Flyers; Seeking the truth; ...
wonder if it will EVER be over.

It makes the fight hard but the need is great.

The need is great and the fight is hard. Which is why we have to kick it up a notch.

PRAC is taking a short rest now that the rebellion and the elections are over. After the holidays we plan on few surprises.

10 posted on 11/10/2002 5:06:38 AM PST by AAABEST
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To: marsh2
Your #8 was so right on and succinct. Keep preaching.
11 posted on 11/10/2002 5:08:01 AM PST by AAABEST
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To: marsh2
It's always good to read your musings, marsh2. I'm thinking of moving down your way. We should just take over the county.:<)
12 posted on 11/10/2002 9:12:14 AM PST by AuntB
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To: *landgrab; madfly
http://www.freerepublic.com/perl/bump-list
13 posted on 11/10/2002 9:32:37 AM PST by Free the USA
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To: AAABEST; AuntB
If you look at how few people really voted in the past elections, you understand that a determinate group of people with a focussed intent CAN make a difference if they get out and vote en block.

I have been a professional property rights advocate for more than a decade. Soon, I will be carrying the massage in a different political capacity. It was a group of active supporters that supported those beliefs through their vote that were able to make that happen.

AuntB - come on down - lol. I have just been told by someone in the know that the enviros have actually assigned the northern California area around Hornbrook to an advocate to set the stage for designation as Wilderness. I have so much territory under seige - need all the help I can get!
14 posted on 11/10/2002 9:55:08 AM PST by marsh2
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To: farmfriend; LibertyInOR; isasis
Big Ping!
15 posted on 11/10/2002 12:16:59 PM PST by Issaquahking
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To: marsh2
"I have so much territory under seige - need all the help I can get!"

Speaking from experience... Even if you trump them politically in the "court of public opinion," they will sue your political subdivision to a total standstill!!! Most times it's the only court that liberals/enviros/NIMBY's can win in. They've been packing the courts for years and those they haven't packed they avoid by switching jurisdictions at every opportunity.

Yes... you're in for a siege, alright!!!

16 posted on 11/10/2002 2:13:36 PM PST by SierraWasp
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To: AuntB
I'm thinking of moving down your way.

Keep on coming. We can use a few good "activists" here in Sac.

17 posted on 11/10/2002 3:42:28 PM PST by farmfriend
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To: marsh2
I have just been told by someone in the know that the enviros have actually assigned the northern California area around Hornbrook to an advocate to set the stage for designation as Wilderness.

Hornbrook Grange might have something to say about that.

18 posted on 11/10/2002 3:44:27 PM PST by farmfriend
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To: marsh2
They are just damn intent on tying up EVERYTHING around the Klamath River, aren't they? What next?? Don't answer.....
19 posted on 11/10/2002 4:16:19 PM PST by AuntB
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To: marsh2
This is my basic understanding of a fundamental difference in the beliefs of the Conservative and the Liberal. The Conservative believes in the Conservation of individual property rights and protection of those rights from encroachment by the public. The Liberal believes that property must be redistributed on an equitable basis. The Liberal believes that the public has the dominate right to determine how property should be used, that it must serve the general public's needs first and that individual use is only a subordinate privilege as suffered by the community. The Liberal believes that the community actually collectively owns all resources and that individual ownership is a privilege conditional upon community desires and needs.

That pretty well sums up my Property Law professor's basic premise, that Property Rights are not Natural rights, and can be limited and/or regulated by the government at will, with only a few Constitutional limitations (the Takings Clause inclusion of "just compensation", basically). I dared to comment that this seems rather antithetical to the notion of limited government and the Framers' ideals of the promotion of individual rights to unprecendented heights. I haven't been called on in class since then.

(Actually, I found this thread since I'm searching FR for some good Property Rights Movement news articles to post on the class discussion forum, since she brought up the topic today.)

20 posted on 11/13/2002 7:50:47 AM PST by Teacher317
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