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Martha Toogood Is Sick Now
Various | Sep. 25, 2002 | Self

Posted on 09/25/2002 12:05:15 PM PDT by A Vast RightWing Conspirator

Since the Martha Toogood's story is being dissected into the most minute details, here's one aspect not yet discussed:

- Martha gets a spanking from her mommy (some call it a savage beating). Whatever that was, it turns out that not one doctor, not even the prosecutor could find any sign of abuse such as bruises, cuts, broken bones, missing limbs or rigor mortis. In fact there are nude pictures apparently showing Martha as intact as ever.

- The state takes Martha under its own loving wing and... MARTHA IS SICK NOW!!! In fact, Martha is so sick, not even her mother can be allowed to see her.

Can anyone explain what's going on here? Is Martha better off with the authorities in charge? Or is she a victim of the authorities loving care. Perhaps too much love got Martha sick?


TOPICS: Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: toogood
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To: Tired of Taxes
I noticed that, too. That was really strange. Her kicks almost looked happy, not like strong temper tantrum kicks. But, how could she be happy if she was just brutalized? Was she convulsing? Strange, indeed.

Some kids kick their legs like that when they're crying, too.

61 posted on 09/25/2002 12:47:08 PM PDT by al_c
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To: Pete
I am just glad there were no cameras around when my Mom would chase my brother and me around the house with a wooden spoon or high heel shoe.

Good thing there were no cameras around our house, too. Times have changed, that's for sure. But, what Toogood did looked pretty bad. I got hit like that, too, but not until I was much older. A parent shouldn't get that carried away with a four year-old. Spanking - OK. Hitting the face and then grabbing her head and shaking her back and forth - NOT GOOD.

62 posted on 09/25/2002 12:50:39 PM PDT by Tired of Taxes
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To: gubamyster
Because the family appears to be a bunch of crooks that would hide the child in a heartbeat while the mother took off on bail(something Irish travelers are known for doing--jumping bail). Believe me, this time, they would find a way to hide them better too. I don't think they thought this would get the attention it did the first time around or she would have stayed underground. Pressure was on and it put focus on their less than savory organization. I think the sooner folks here realize we are not dealing with your average American family, the sooner you will understand the reasons behind why Martha is not with any family members.
63 posted on 09/25/2002 12:51:25 PM PDT by glory
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To: The FRugitive
Sorry but their lifestyle is at issue since it is a lifestyle which is predatory. Travelers are noted con artists and specialize in cheating old people and running insurance scams. This is why they travel, to escape, and how they can afford 5 cars without a permanent address.
64 posted on 09/25/2002 12:52:16 PM PDT by justshutupandtakeit
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To: OXENinFLA
Irish Travelers work the country. They move from state to state, conning and stealing from everyone in their path.

Another FReeper told the other night that he investigated a theft.... An old lady (age 90+) who had a run-in with these slimes. One Traveler knocked on her front door and when he had her in conversation, the other Traveler snuck in the back door and stole her entire $12,000 savings from its hiding place in the house.

As a result, the old lady was wiped out, the Travelers were never caught, and a couple of months later the lady's house was abandoned. The FReeper said this lady had told him she needed her money to augment her SS checks for food, and to pay her property taxes. He was outraged and told how much he hates Travelers. (I don't recall his name.)

These people think they have a right to steal and lie and cheat because THEY STOLE THE NAILS FROM JESUS' CROSS so He gave them a life-long dispensation for their theft(!!)

THIS is who we are dealing with. The scum of the earth.
65 posted on 09/25/2002 12:52:29 PM PDT by Humidston
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To: A Vast RightWing Conspirator
This whole story is sickening from start to finish. There is no excuse. Not only has this woman showed the world her poor mothering skills, people are now applauding the use of surveillance camera's on the American Public, and CPS (which has a dubiuos reputation in some states) just scored a round of applause.
Are we slowly being acclimated to public surveillance by video?
Yes, I'm glad Toogood got caught, but on the other hand, It saddens me that the child will be caught in the middle and many will applaud SPY CAMS. (aka: "security" camera's)
66 posted on 09/25/2002 12:52:33 PM PDT by two23
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To: Registered
I think he's all ready to be the next dictator for Cuba, after Castro's brother, that is.
67 posted on 09/25/2002 12:52:40 PM PDT by Tired of Taxes
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To: frnewsjunkie
BTW... does anyone know why the woman did this to the child?

The mother was trying to return two pairs of pants to Kohl's for which she did not have a receipt. (Draw your own conclusions.) Kohl's would not accept them and she became "frustrated".

Meanwhile the child was wandering away and taking things off the shelves. (Possibly preventing the mother from wandering around and taking things off the shelves.) This added to the mother's frustration level.

When she reached the car she "lost it" and hit the child with a closed fist, by her own admission.

68 posted on 09/25/2002 12:52:49 PM PDT by PBRSTREETGANG
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To: OXENinFLA
I would like to know how she affords them

Why?

69 posted on 09/25/2002 12:53:08 PM PDT by A Vast RightWing Conspirator
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To: Roy Anderson
Martha's sickness is for her own good. The State does much that is very good for the children (but not TOO good).

Bite your tongue!! Only in the most EXTREME cases should the state ever take a child! In case you didn't know this, 50% of all child abuse resulting in the death of a child occurs with the child in state custody/foster care. And most of the children in foster care were taken by various CPS agencies on UNSUBSTANTIATED charges of abuse.

I will admit that Martha Toogood is probably in better hands right now - but this is a RARE case.

70 posted on 09/25/2002 12:53:20 PM PDT by Spiff
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To: johnny7
Hillary! hates "packages" - even Democrap packages, LOL!!
71 posted on 09/25/2002 12:53:32 PM PDT by Humidston
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To: Humidston
In fact there are nude pictures apparently showing Martha as intact as ever.
NUDE pictures of the child's genitals?? Mommy Dearest had to take pictures of the child's GENITALS??

Mommy Dearest is a petty thief, a liar, and a transient who beats her child and you think the state is out of line by putting Martha in protective custody?

Not taking either side on this issue as I have not seen the video, nor have I heard this woman speak on any television shows. That said, your statement is absolutely ridiculous.

First of all, the first poster made no mention of genitilia. That seems to be something which you are a bit hung up on given the SHOUTING. Most healthy people have nude photos of their children, although in today's PC world, that may endanger their right to parenting. The only people who would find a parent having a nude photo of a 4 year old as remarkable would be someone who has a deep seated psychological issue with child nudity. I suggest you seek help.

Regardless of that fact, the article, as stated herein, makes no indication that the photos were taken by, or even in the possession of, the mother. A clear reading of the article actually suggests the opposite, that some authority figures took those photos and are in possession of them. While there is no way to know for certain by what is posted, given that it is stated directly after stating that the child was found perfectly healthy by doctors, one would be led to conclude that it was the doctors who took the nude photos. (Something that would be done to record the clean bill of health for legal purposes.)

Your next statement is equally distressing. Without knowing otherwise, one would get the impression from your post that petty thievery, lying and moving around are all perfectly legitimate reasons for the state to take custody of a child. Two of the three are not even legal issues. The only illegal act stated, petty theivery, has well established punishments none of which in any state of the union include loss of parenting rights. The only other issue is beating the child. Given that it is the ONLY issue in the entire post that has ANY relevancy to the case, the "Oh pulllease." that you close with seems a bit inappropriate to say the least.

Innocent until proven guilty is a founding principal of free society. The day that a video shown on national television becomes judge, jury and executioner is the day that the first dictator of the United States takes power with a little help from his friends in the digital video editing field.

Child abuse is absolutely reprehensible and deserving of strong punishment. But putting a child in state custody is far from a healthy solution as is illustrated in this case. The question of the child's health is not only valid, it should be the central issue of the case. The best policy would be to place the child in custody of close relatives. While there may be cases when that would be inappropriate, it should be sought as the first alternative. "The state" may be a fabulous nanny for your average welfare bum, but it has repeatedly proven itself terribly inadequate as a parent for young children.

72 posted on 09/25/2002 12:53:47 PM PDT by thedugal
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To: Tired of Taxes
I think he's all ready to be the next dictator for Cuba, after Castro's brother, that is.

After Castro's demise he'll probably re-emerge as the Cuban version of Ricky Martin.

73 posted on 09/25/2002 12:54:16 PM PDT by PBRSTREETGANG
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To: frnewsjunkie
It appears that the mom was trying to exchange pants for cash (probably stolen) and was refused. The child wandered away from her twice and she had to be called over the P.A. to come get her. (This causes other questions to arise but not here.)

Thus, it appears frustration was behind the outbreak.

I must say I never let a 4 yr. old wander away from me in a large store once much less twice.
74 posted on 09/25/2002 12:55:37 PM PDT by justshutupandtakeit
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To: PBRSTREETGANG
Haha... Picture an adult Elian singing love songs and shaking his booty with American girls screaming for him. Maybe the U.S. gov't did him a good service, after all...
75 posted on 09/25/2002 12:57:02 PM PDT by Tired of Taxes
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To: A Vast RightWing Conspirator
She probably has an infected hand -- cellulitis from the soft tissue injuries and tooth-related cuts she received when she pummeled her daughter's head........
76 posted on 09/25/2002 12:57:53 PM PDT by tracer
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To: A Vast RightWing Conspirator
I read your numerous comments the other day, as well. Seems to me, based on repeated viewing of the tape, that reasonable peoeple could differ on the authorities' getting involved -- but you seem so strident. Do you want to put your cards on the table?
77 posted on 09/25/2002 12:58:55 PM PDT by j.havenfarm
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To: thedugal
The poster mentioned nude pictures and I responded. Re-read the opening and please don't put words in my mouth.

In fact there are nude pictures apparently showing Martha as intact as ever.

If the story I heard on MSNBC is accurate, I see absolutely no reason for the Toogood family to take pictures of the child's genitals. None.

78 posted on 09/25/2002 1:00:38 PM PDT by Humidston
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To: A Vast RightWing Conspirator
Are you a slave or are you a free person.

Slaves are of course free to some extent. They are free to do what ever their masters tell them to do.

In the plantation days slaves were free to hoe and pick cotton and any work assigned. If a slave got up before daylight to do the work for the master before he was required to do so, no Planation Slave master forbid him from doing so. No master cursed the blatent overworking and accused the slave of misbehavior. If a slave continued to do the massa's work after the work day was through he was not punished for it. He might very well be praised. Dlaves that do as the master dictates ore even more are good slaves. Such slaves feel no yoke or no srap of beating. Those slaves are said to be free slaves. They feel no pain of punishment. They are free of punishment. They are free Slaves.

When a slave does what is forbidden for slaves to do, that is the behaviour of a bad slave. Slaves that do what is forbiden are punished. That is what happens to bad slaves.

But slavery is more than having to do work for others as orderd. Slaves have other limitations that free men do no have. Slaves do not own their person. A free person can do with himself what he wishes. A slave's own person is controlled by the slave's master. The slave master may move the slave to any location or totally restrict his movements. Where a slave can go and what he can do is in the perview of the slave master.

An other aspect of slaveery is a slave can not own his own offspring. The Master owns the children. If the slave does anything with or to those born of the slave the slaves children can be removed. It is the sole responsiblity of the slave master. The master may take the children and place them with others any time the slave master so desires.

Slavery requires just two things. Individual behavior must be controlled, approved, or punhised by the slave owner.

Secondly a slave can not be allowed to have title to his chlidren. NO one can e a slave who owns his own children. A slave master to be slave master, must be able to assign control of his slave's chilren to whom ever the slave master choses.

The Unites States has never been totally free of slavery, because the state owns each persons children. Slave parents are allowed to raise the chldren they bear as long as what they do pleases the state. Just as any slave master in the south could take a slaves children away from its slave parent, out government can take children away from us.

If your child reports to the slave masters that you are not following the states rules for child raising, the state will take your children away. The state takes its property and does with it as it sees fit. Just as any good slave master would do.

So by any definition of slavery all children are slaves. For slaves are childrn owned by a master not their parent and all children in the united states are owned by the state.

So at what level are the parents of slaves. Are they slaves too? When if ever does a slave child become a free adult?

When you refer to your children as YOURS, you lie. They are not yours. They are the property of the state. Your chilren are no more yours than the public library is yours. You just get to use it as long as you follow the states rules for being in the library.

Remember even Uncle Tom got to call it Uncle Tom's Cabin... but it was the slave masters cabin and both Uncle Tom and the Slave master knew it.


79 posted on 09/25/2002 1:01:21 PM PDT by Common Tator
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To: AppyPappy
Pappy...

I respect your opinon. From this far away and on such little information, I would not judge what is best. I do know from experience that the "state" is not a panacea.

80 posted on 09/25/2002 1:05:07 PM PDT by cynicom
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