A Little Secret About the Nazis (They were left-wing socialists like the modern left of today)

russp ^ | 1/2002 | Richard Poe

[The Right Stuff]

Hey! Congrats on the book deal! Keep us posted on your progress.

[Slyfox]

Yeah-but, did Jimmy Buffet score within the top six, along with Hitler,
in a poll of the most evil people who lived in the last 1,000 years?

[UCANSEE2]

Hey, best of luck Todd, with your new endeavors ! ! ! !

[IRtorqued]

Their program called for the nationalization of education, health care, transportation, and other major industries.

and these social programs are being stopped by the republiscams, nope, they picked up where the demoncrats left off.

[xm177e2]

Good fortune too you, TLBSHOW with your new book!

TLB is NOT Richard Poe. LOL...

[My Identity]

BTTT

[Asclepius]

... Hitler put Marx's theory to work in the death camps ...

This is a risible misreading of Marx's essay. Marx was a Jew. He never advocated liquidating the Jews. And Marx never linked Jews to capital because it Marx's era they weren't linked; they were linked to usury, not capitalist commodity production. In Marx's era most of Europe's Jews were poor and confined to ghettos; they lived in the margins. The "Jewish question"--and many authors of the era addressed the so-called "Jewish question"--was how would the newly founded nation states of Europe integrate the Jews into political life? Assimilation would buy the Jews equality, but it might also mean extinction for the Jews as a unique people. Etc., etc.

I am no Marxist. And I have no intention of defending Marx. But we do ourselves no service as conservatives when we get our facts wrong or misrepresent our adversaries.

[kstewskis]

Yeah-but, did Jimmy Buffet score within the top six, along with Hitler, in a poll of the most evil people who lived in the last 1,000 years?

Perhaps not (I never worked for him), but he has used Hitler's suggestions in his book as to how to get the crowd behind him and "energized".

[xm177e2]

Here's the end of Marx's essay "On the Jewish Question"

In its perfected practice, Christian egoism of heavenly bliss is necessarily transformed into the corporal egoism of the Jew, heavenly need is turned into world need, subjectivism into self-interest. We explain the tenacity of the Jew not by his religion, but, on the contrary, by the human basis of his religion -- practical need, egoism.

Since in civil society the real nature of the Jew has been universally realized and secularized, civil society could not convince the Jew of the unreality of his religious nature, which is indeed only the ideal aspect of practical need. Consequently, not only in the Pentateuch and the Talmud, but in present-day society we find the nature of the modern Jew, and not as an abstract nature but as one that is in the highest degree empirical, not merely as a narrowness of the Jew, but as the Jewish narrowness of society.

Once society has succeeded in abolishing the empirical essence of Judaism -- huckstering and its preconditions -- the Jew will have become impossible, because his consciousness no longer has an object, because the subjective basis of Judaism, practical need, has been humanized, nd because the conflict between man's individual-sensuous existence and his species-existence has been abolished.

The social emancipation of the Jew is the emancipation of society from Judaism.

(emphasis was in the original)

[xm177e2]

See my post #29.

[Southack]

The whole reason that "left wing" and "right wing" entered into our vocabulary was to differentiate between the various flavors of Socialism (e.g. Communists on one side and Fascists on the other).

After the Fascists were defeated in World War 2, however, the phrase Left Wing remained in our lexicon to describe the Communists. Popular useage of the phrase "right wing" then began to be used by those trying to identify people opposed to Communism (in particular, Joeseph McCarthy), and was intended as an insult. Americans, being a ballsy sort of people, shrugged off the insult and generally began to equate "right wing" with Conservative, being that most Americans then and now were and are Conservative (i.e., not in favor of the great New World Order socialist Revolution favored by both Communists and Fascists).

"They say you want a Revolution, well, you know, we all want to change the world" isn't just lyrics in a song, it's also how Conservatives mock the starry-eyed socialist radical elitists. They want a Revolution, at gunpoint, to force the world to redistribute wealth and labor. Conservatives don't.

So now we're "right wing" because we oppose such socialistic folly. So be it. Just don't let anyone confuse our opposition to Socialistic Revolution with being on the same side as National Socialists (i.e. NAZIs). That's just silly, and it's just wrong.

[Dqban22]

While as a high school student at the Jesuit "Colegio de Belen" in Havana, Castro worshiped Hitler and the "Mein Kamp" had a strong influence in his political formation. From Mussolini, Castro, took the mannerisms and carefully studied all the movies about the Duce. Pius XI in his Encyclical letter "Divinis Redemptoris" rightly called socialism in all its forms as "intrinsically evil." You might call it Nazism, Fascism, Communism or Socialism; in essence they all degrade the human being to the condition of a mere slave of the state.

[ValenB4]

I suspect Marx, were he alive today, would cringe at what has been done in his name. Seeing how the more negative aspects of unrestrained capitalism have been checked, and that the middle class is basically productive and happy, I doubt that he would even be a Marxist.

[Asclepius]

... The social emancipation of the Jew is the emancipation of society from Judaism ...

Precisely. Marx was arguing for assimilation, the assimilation of the Jews into civil society. The price of admission, however, was to be their Jewishness. But Marx demanded the same price of everyone. We were all to be relieved of our illusions, those illusions we call religion.

To in any way equate or relate this to the NAZI program is simply ridiculous.

[Ditto]

bump

[rohry]

Ooops, rookie mistake. At least I got someone to laugh!

[xm177e2]

To in any way equate or relate this to the NAZI program is simply ridiculous.

But Marx refers very specifically to "the emancipation of society from Judaism."

To Marx, Jews are not just misguided victims like the Christians, but Judaism is an EVIL, CAPITALIST religion which must be wiped out.

[gcruse]

Nazism was inspired by Italian Fascism, an
invention of hardline Communist Benito
Mussolini.

So, if Nazism is leftist, and Facism is
a communist invention, what form of
government lies to the extreme right?

[Asclepius]

... I doubt that he would even be a Marxist ...

I think you're absolutely correct. I think Marx had enough integrity as a philosopher and as a revolutionary to review and even revise his findings in light of new facts. He did it all the time throughout his career.

If only those who claim his name in our own dark era had as much integrity. Or would treat Marx's writings not as dogma, but as hypotheses.

[Asclepius]

To Marx, Jews are not just misguided victims like the Christians, but Judaism is an EVIL, CAPITALIST religion which must be wiped out.

Give me a quote, please.