Posted on 11/19/2023 5:12:46 PM PST by ganeemead
Average age of ukie soldiers is now around 43
Ukie army apparently is now a sort of an old folks home...
Zelensky honors the Minsk Agreements and all those men are alive and Ukraine thrives as a European Union nation. Meanwhile, Russia has a bit of extra land, but it’s still a backward country filled with corruption. And Roman Abramovich still owns Chelsea.
BS
you have no clue
I believe I am correct.
For the sake of the repeat of the 1970’s geo political order, no more Ukraine.
The Russians tried indirect intervention in the Eastern portions of the Ukraine by supplying weapons and training and the Russophiles conducted a vicious guerilla war. Then the Russians escalated by providing artillery and antiaircraft systems, including the BuK missile system that destroyed that Dutch airliner and killed everyone on board (and the obstructed the investigation and then hid the guilty once they had been charged).
Russia didn't just invade "their" Russian-populated provinces: they went for Kiev and to capture all of Ukraine.
Russia is an imperialist thug in the original meaning of the word and the Ukrainian people are giving the world an example for the world to emulate in fighting back.
You should learn to fight back too.
And no, liberals are not libertarians: libertarians are inactive layabouts who are only interested in legalized drugs.
They are Russian ethnics who have all been born in the Ukraine. They are indigenous by any other definition. Just as you are indigenous to America, because you were born there. If they can’t be indigenous, because they are not one of the original peoples, neither can you.
The Russian ethnics in Ukraine were being abused by the Ukraine ethnics. Do you really think it’s reasonable for Putin to just watch his people get eliminated over a past they could not control?
The globalists are using your hate of the Russian government to go to war against the Russian people. You are in agreement with Hillary that the Russian should be enslaved by the globalists, because that’s the agenda. Take over Russia, steal its’ estimated $400 trillion in mineral wealth and eliminate the Russian people. Hilary was talking about this as far back as 2016. Russia was in her sights, had she won the election.
Like I said, the refusal to talk to Putin allowed him to act without restraint.
Liberals are followers of the most evil and murderous doctrine in the history of mankind. Those who are trying to maintain the old definition of the word are their enablers to their goals of worldwide socialism. A world under Satan.
“NATO has expanded in an easterly direction.
This is contrary to commitments NATO countries have given to Russia.”
not even close to true. NATO made no commitment to russia not to expand. NATO is/was always expected to expand. Finland is the newest member, soon Sweden will join
At Biden's urging.
To paraphrase what General Pickett said when asked why the South lost the Civil War,
"I always thought the Yankees (Russians) had something to do with it."
The history of Russian settlers in Ukraine is very short - particularly compared to that of my family in this country (Mom's family - 300 years, Dad's family -204 years) Russians have only lived there for 80 years or so.
Once Ukraine was independent, all they had to was learn Ukrainian and live with everybody else.
You are either the classic Russian bot - or just another unread, untraveled "expert".
“The conditions that Russia gave for peace was Ukraine neutrality. We chose to not honor that and now the Ukraine people are dead.”
BS. Russia massed troops on its border with Ukraine months before it invaded in February, 2022 (which in reality was an escalation of its 2014 invasion of Ukraine).
“The war is our fault, because of our deceptions.”
Again, BS.
You can believe what you want. Nobody is saying that Putin is a good guy. But every single Western leader is worse. What Putin believes is necessary, our Western leaders are doing with a spring in our step. Putin is doing what he believes is necessary, but our Western leaders are doing it to possess $14 trillion in mineral wealth of Ukraine.
I do trust Putin over our Western leaders, because our Western leaders wants worldwide socialism under their control.
I am familiar with the Ukrainian genocide that Stalin did, but after 80 years, the Russian ethnics are just as indigenous to the lands they possess as anybody else.
Right. All the Russian people had to do was allow themselves to be culturally genocided allow themselves to die out and there would be peace in the world.
I’m against the globablist agenda and understand that there is only the choice of lesser evil. Allowing Russia to control lands that are dominated by ethnic Russians was the lesser evil. But you seem to believe that worldwide fascism/socialism is the lesser evil.
Yes it did, because the West was surreptitiously trying to take the Ukraine from Russia.
The war was our fault.
“Yes it did, because the West was surreptitiously trying to take the Ukraine from Russia.”
Good grief; are you that ignorant? Ukraine has been an independent sovereign nation since 1991. How in hell can it be taken FROM Russia when it was not part OF Russia?
Whether or not Ukraine was a sovereign, which is debatable, Russia gave the conditions for peace. We chose to ignore that because we wanted the wealth of Ukraine for ourselves.
The US has gone to war lots of times because of nations choosing communism freely, so give me a break on that point. Your point is insincere.
Russia relinquished its claim to the Soviet states and the Warsaw Pact countries in the Belovezha Accords.
Putin is rewriting history by denying it happened.
Don’t take my word for it... This is Russia’s presidential library.
https://www.prlib.ru/en/history/619792
Quote:
The preamble of the document stated that “the USSR as a subject of international law and a geopolitical reality no longer exists.”
The Accords and other signed documents were ratified by the Supreme Soviet of the RSFSR on Dec. 12, 1991. At the same time Russia dissolved the Union Treaty of 1922.
Russia signed away all claim to any part of Ukraine. Nobody forced them to do it.
So maybe you should ask yourself where Putin gets his ideas from. He’s got no more right to the Donbas than the British have a right to USA states.
The James Baker promise to Ed Sheverdnaze was that NATO would not expand into the Warsaw Pact region much less into the Soviet Union. By abolishing the USSR and abolishing the Warsaw Pact, the independent Russia itself tore up the promise in front of over a dozen other countries.
It then pledged to respect the independence, self sovereignty and territorial integrity of all new independent states.
Putin and Medvedev regard that as a tragedy. They’re like a pair of divorcees who think they still are the boss of their ex wives.
Whether he is re-writing it, his concern are for the Russian ethnics that are being abused by the local inhabitants, despite having an equal claim to the land they inhabit.
Russia considered the pact still enforceable. For the sake of peace, we should have also considered it enforceable. The globalists engineered this war to bring down Russia and you are in agreement with the globalists.
Talking with Russia would have been better than surreptitiously trying to take Ukraine, and allow Russian ethnic genocide to take place in Ukraine for the sake of the $14 trillion in mineral wealth.
But that’s just me.
“Whether or not Ukraine was a sovereign, which is debatable...”
Even Russia recognized Ukraine as a sovereign and independent country until just recently (which is one of the reasons Russia refuses to admit it invaded or that the war is actually a war; and why it calls its actions a “special military operation” instead of the invasion and the war it started).
Ukraine is a member NATION of the UN, and is recognized as such internationally. You can trot out your little games to try to cover up your BS (as you’ve done several times on this thread already), but the fact remains you are simply full of @#$%, and remain so.
That was still the conditions. We didn’t deal with Russia in good faith, so Russia responded as it promised to do so.
Something could have been worked out if we had chosen to talk to Russia instead of being sneaks.
I don’t what your interest is in aiding and abetting the globalist desire to own the world. Do you expect a cut?
My position is good faith peace. Yours seems to be a continuance of the cold war, even if it means the elimination of every Ukrainian.
There you go again: You make statements and claims and when you are called out on them you segue into “what-ifs” and strawmen.
And, what PACT does Russia still consider enforceable? A PACT is a signed and ratified agreement between or among nations; for instance, the Warsaw Pact. So, what PACT are you claiming Russia still considers enforceable?
I don’t consider the Ukraine war that has wiped out the Ukranian people because some of us thought that Putin’s concerns about Russians ethnics to be what-if. I think the war is a matter of fact.
Do you expect a one world government that is based in fascism to be a positive?
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