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To: ought-six

Whether or not Ukraine was a sovereign, which is debatable, Russia gave the conditions for peace. We chose to ignore that because we wanted the wealth of Ukraine for ourselves.

The US has gone to war lots of times because of nations choosing communism freely, so give me a break on that point. Your point is insincere.


154 posted on 11/20/2023 2:29:34 PM PST by Jonty30 (It turns out that I did not buy my cell phone for all the calls I might be missing at home.)
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To: Jonty30

Russia relinquished its claim to the Soviet states and the Warsaw Pact countries in the Belovezha Accords.

Putin is rewriting history by denying it happened.

Don’t take my word for it... This is Russia’s presidential library.

https://www.prlib.ru/en/history/619792

Quote:

The preamble of the document stated that “the USSR as a subject of international law and a geopolitical reality no longer exists.”

The Accords and other signed documents were ratified by the Supreme Soviet of the RSFSR on Dec. 12, 1991. At the same time Russia dissolved the Union Treaty of 1922.

Russia signed away all claim to any part of Ukraine. Nobody forced them to do it.

So maybe you should ask yourself where Putin gets his ideas from. He’s got no more right to the Donbas than the British have a right to USA states.

The James Baker promise to Ed Sheverdnaze was that NATO would not expand into the Warsaw Pact region much less into the Soviet Union. By abolishing the USSR and abolishing the Warsaw Pact, the independent Russia itself tore up the promise in front of over a dozen other countries.

It then pledged to respect the independence, self sovereignty and territorial integrity of all new independent states.

Putin and Medvedev regard that as a tragedy. They’re like a pair of divorcees who think they still are the boss of their ex wives.


155 posted on 11/20/2023 3:10:46 PM PST by MalPearce ("You see, but you do not observe" - Holmes to Watson, A Scandal in Bohemia)
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To: Jonty30

“Whether or not Ukraine was a sovereign, which is debatable...”

Even Russia recognized Ukraine as a sovereign and independent country until just recently (which is one of the reasons Russia refuses to admit it invaded or that the war is actually a war; and why it calls its actions a “special military operation” instead of the invasion and the war it started).

Ukraine is a member NATION of the UN, and is recognized as such internationally. You can trot out your little games to try to cover up your BS (as you’ve done several times on this thread already), but the fact remains you are simply full of @#$%, and remain so.


157 posted on 11/20/2023 5:01:21 PM PST by ought-six (Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule. )
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To: Jonty30
”the US has gone to war lots of times because of nations choosing communism”

Just when I though I’d everything from our favorite Russian bot, you went and gave us that zinger!

So, go ahead and tell which countries “chose” communism that we went to war with!

Wouldn’t have been South Korea, because the nasty Northerners (supplied and assisted by Stalin and Mao’s generous assistance) invaded South Korea.

Couldn’t have been South Vietnam, because the lovely old Comrade Ho made an “offer the South couldn’t refuse” (ably assisted again by the Sovs and the Chinese).

So -do tell - who “chose communism” and then we attacked…

183 posted on 11/20/2023 7:41:09 PM PST by Chainmail (How do I feel about ignorance and apathy? I don't know and I don't care.)
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