Update from Ukraine | The Ukrainian Strike on the Ruzzian Black Sea Headquarters | ATACMS approved

Youtube.com ^ | 9-22-2023 | Denys Davydov

[UMCRevMom@aol.com]

Update from Ukraine | The Ukrainian Strike on the Ruzzian Black Sea Headquarters | ATACMS approved

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkdey9bDvgc

The summary of the situation of Russian re-invasion to Ukraine covering the recent developments on the battlefield, as of 20th September 2023 – 22:00 (Kyiv time). [NOTE: two summaries per week, released on Wednesday and Sunday]

https://militaryland.net/news/invasion-day-574-summary/

*** Great interactive maps with viewer controlled Map magnification tool to use for each Front!

https://militaryland.net/maps/

[MalPearce]

Money. It's the theme overall. Excepting when one looks to the US Debt Clock, and learn that it is really about more and more debt. That's the real theme overall.

Well, if you take a VERY narrow, simplistic, parochial, short term view, yes. If you take the long term geopolitical view, though, it isn't anywhere close to being that simple. Yes the USA is probably in a position where it could ignore the Ukrainian issue completely, and leave it to Europe to figure out.

But even if the USA isn't directly impacted by Russia invading former Soviet country after former Soviet country in order to rebuild some kind of empire, the USA definitely isn't the only country without "skin in the game" bankrolling Ukraine's defense.

Is Biden in the German government signing off their checks? Is he in London, signing off the British checks? Is he signing off the Japanese checks? Poland's? The Baltic States? Of course not.

Most of the Global South is exploiting Russia's position while avoiding getting dragged into the conflict (even Cuba has sent a diplomatic rocket in Moscow's direction for attempting to muscle its people into the meat grinder). Russia has about 3 other countries really in its corner: North Korea, Syria, and Eritrea. Everyone else is offering moral support but not a lot else.

The same is true with Ukraine, however Europe and Russia's neighbors have a direct existential interest. It's one thing not to want to put boots on the ground, quite another to think Russia should be given carte blanche to treat ANY OTHER COUNTRY the way it's already treated Ukraine, Georgia and Chechnya despite having non-aggression and border recognition agreements in place.

Whether or not people think those three countries are clean or corrupt is actually irrelevant; fundamentally if Russia's word even via a solemn and binding agreement like Belovezha can be cancelled simply because a butt-hurt Vatnik gangster in Moscow thinks they need the Lebensraum, then there is NO TREATY anyone ever signs with Russia that is worth the ink. THAT is why Ukraine's support comes from so many directions.

I don't have a problem with that.

People call Zelenskyy a grifter... well, that's kinda HIS JOB when his country's been invaded under false pretences in violation of multiple explicit agreements between Ukraine and Russia, the UN Charter, the Helsinki Accords 1975, the Belovezha Accords, the Budapest Memorandum... and with other countries (including China, weirdly) providing further security guarantees in the event that Russia or anybody else attacked Ukraine.

In the immediate aftermath of 9/11 GW Bush invoked NATO Article 5, and many countries that weren't even in NATO immediately offered their support. Irrespective of the fact the Bush administration completely went Tonto by attacking the wrong countries (Saudi was behind 9/11 not Afghanistan or Iraq) Was George Bush grifting when he asked his NATO allies and partners for support? Absolutely, yes - but that is NOT a bad thing. It's the frickin' DUTY of a President to pull out all the stops to protect his people.

Some people have this really odd idea that these kinds of agreements are intended to be one way streets. They're not.

The same agreement that obligates the USA and UK to assist Ukraine is one that ensured that Soviet era nuclear missiles that had been abandoned in Ukraine's bases (ostensibly becoming Ukraine's property not Russia's) didn't end up being flogged to any old buyer on the black market.

Now the USA probably can nickel and dime its way out of the word it gave in the Budapest Memorandum, rather like it did in 2013 when the whole darned world could see Russia was violating the terms of that agreement. Yep, you get to keep your buck 'o five. But in doing so you send the message that it's not just Putin who rips up binding treaties, stabs his partners in their backs, and violates completely on a whim. Russia is currently the outlier at the UN in that regard; if America stoops so low as to join him then why the hell should ANY member of the UN Security Council honor ANY treaty or resolution, past present or future? And if the UNSC has no reason to bother doing it anymore, why would the UN General Assembly do it?

Giving Putin a pass on what he's done in Ukraine would have horrific consequences all over the world, the USA would not be immune to those consequences, and that's why you really need to ask why any sane American would want to go there JUST to save a few bucks.

[Worldtraveler once upon a time]

Mulling over the morning coffee: "No quantity of badly behaved tourists / expats lowering the tone of a place alters the reality of which country it's in, so Benidorm remains part of Spain despite hordes of Brits, and Crimea remains part of Ukraine no matter how many settlers Russia buses into it."

Have you more broadly observed separatist movements, as you cite Benidorm in what they call the "Valencian Community?"

It is additionally interesting that Benidorm is a British sitcom, but back to separatist movements.

Spain: The unprecedented alliance between Valencia's right and far right

Right-Wing Victory in Spain Could Bolster Catalan Independence Drive

Spain's Political Storm Stirs Separatist Movements

Other separatist sentiments are found throughout the world.

What is Quebec's mood - to stay with Canada or independence?

In Europe alone, there are many such movements afoot (I use "afoot" as reminiscence of the Holmes series).

List of active separatist movements in Europe

[Worldtraveler once upon a time]

--- "Is Biden in the German government signing off their checks? Is he in London, signing off the British checks? Is he signing off the Japanese checks? Poland's? The Baltic States?" Well, there are views to such and beyond....

"The ‘PUTIN-Biden-Clinton-Obama’ cartel did used Ukraine as a FRONT to stage their money-laundering by using Russian agents embedded BY PUTIN in the Ukraine government: Ukrainian deep-state!

President Zelensky is still trying to remove Ukraine CORRUPT “deep state created by Putin!”

Ukraine CORRUPT “deep state created by Putin with Biden in the cartel

[kiryandil]

As I wrote earlier, the Russian forces are in the Russian Federation. They ARE home.

All the Brit blather you can post won't change that.

[dforest]

If you were looking for the truth about Ukraine you will not find it on these threads.

Best look elsewhere .

[UMCRevMom@aol.com]

“But in doing so you send the message that it’s not just Putin who rips up binding treaties, stabs his partners in their backs, and violates completely on a whim. Russia is currently the outlier at the UN in that regard; if America stoops so low as to join him then why the hell should ANY member of the UN Security Council honor ANY treaty or resolution, past present or future? And if the UNSC has no reason to bother doing it anymore, why would the UN General Assembly do it?

Giving Putin a pass on what he’s done in Ukraine would have horrific consequences all over the world, the USA would not be immune to those consequences, and that’s why you really need to ask why any sane American would want to go there JUST to save a few bucks.”

EXCELLENT COMMENT! Clear & to the point, Thank you. :)

[UMCRevMom@aol.com]

Surprisingly, most Freepers discern truthful info from the anti-Ukraine word vomit.

[dforest]

Yes they do, that is why your majority of posts made by you to you attempt to mislead people. Unfortunately for you, Ukraine support is tanking everywhere and your lies are being seen for exactly what they are.

Tell Denny to get a new gig or go back to Ukraine from his safe spot and be the last Uke standing.

[mass55th]

With the bizarre people both Biden and Zelenskyy have appointed to work for them, you have to wonder what’s next? Beastiality? They both seem to have an extreme fondness for surrounding themselves with people as perverted as themselves.

[MalPearce]

There’s a difference between a separatist movement formed directly by the people who’re actually from a region, and a bunch of ex-pats being paid by the Kremlin to stir up separatism.

Girkin blew the excuse years ago by admitting he and the other “little green men” were sent into Ukraine to stir up separatism. Also, a massive proportion of the people who siezed control of the public buildings prior to the DPR and LPR announcing themselves the new administrations were actually Russians on holiday, not Ukrainians on the side of separatists.

[Worldtraveler once upon a time]

"In April 2023, Girkin, alongside some fellow Russian nationalists joined the Club of Angry Patriots, a hardline war-promoting group. On 21 July 2023, Girkin was arrested by Russian authorities on charges of extremism." Wiki.

Sounds like our "color revolution" Nuland on steroids, except she hasn't been arrested for extremism. Had to use a search engine again, as you don't provide citations. Interesting that Girkin seems to think Putin is too easy in the conduct of the war. Oddly it aligns with the OP's assertion as posted earlier (August 2023, and so after the Girkin arrest) in this thread, but apt here:

"The ‘PUTIN-Biden-Clinton-Obama’ cartel did used Ukraine as a FRONT to stage their money-laundering by using Russian agents embedded BY PUTIN in the Ukraine government: Ukrainian deep-state!

President Zelensky is still trying to remove Ukraine CORRUPT “deep state created by Putin!”

Ukraine CORRUPT “deep state created by Putin with Biden in the cartel

Putin. Biden. Clinton. Obama. Nuland. Girkin. "War promoting." Seems so. Thanks for adding his name to the picture, increasing in granularity.

War promotion. It's a thing, worldwide. Russian ex-pats. American Democrats. So one learns.

[Kazan]

To RevMom: do you agree with his pick? Do you disagree with it? How can you propagandize for and worship someone who advocates for such demonic filth? Awaiting your take on this latest, sordid development.

Great questions. Let's see if Mom has decency to answer them.

[fieldmarshaldj]

7 posts deleted, apparently all from E Pluribus Unum for speaking the truth about a certain warmongering ghoul praying for WW3. Despicable.

[fieldmarshaldj]

Again, Paco, Crimea is still Russian. :-)

It doesn’t matter how much you want to wish and pray and hope, it’s Russian.

[UMCRevMom@aol.com]

CORRECTED: Putin seems to have an extreme fondness for surrounding himselh with people as perverted as himself.

[mass55th]

Correct yourself. You seem to be infatuated with Putin, to the point where you have to mention him when you reply to someone who never mentioned him in their original comment at all.

[gleeaikin]

One thing we must remember is that a lot of the Ukrainian disabled are the sick and elderly who are not even able to move away from their threatened village locations near and in the contested eastern and southern Ukrainian regions. This was most elequently described by the Democrat Secretary of State who had just been traveling in tho nearby threatened regions.

It is terrible that these vulnerable people are forced to spend their remaining days in such rotten conditions. However it is also important to note that their large numbers considerably reduce the statistics on younger disabled who are no longer able to contribute fully to their country’s progress and wellbeing. One thing that amazed me was seeing videos of the upbeat attitude of soldiers being treated for war wounds at aide stations near the front lines. They seemed quite eager to get well so they could return to the good fight. Hopefully similar optimism will inspire the younger sick and injured Ukrainians to recover and continue to contribute to the growth of their country.

[gleeaikin]

One interesting development in Spain is recent movement to allow Catalan and Basque languages in government space. Does this indicate a strength in allowing more diversity in government matters or weakness in feeling that one must allow these liberizations to reduce the danger of separatism?

In an unrelated experience in Quebec almost 70 years ago, my family was picnicing near Lac St. John, deep inside Quebec. Off in the distance we could hear boys playing baseball.. What we heard was jabber,jabber, jabber (in French), strike one; jaber, jabber, jabber (in French) you’re out. I formed two conclusions. One was that baseball was popular amid young Quebec males, and two that the use of English was not avoided. I suspect this has not changed significantly over the years. Anyone have different information?