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Sparks fly as neutral pronoun included in French dictionary
The Associated Press ^ | November 18, 2021 | By THOMAS ADAMSON

Posted on 11/18/2021 12:08:06 PM PST by Oldeconomybuyer

PARIS (AP) — It’s a neutral pronoun that’s proving anything but: A nonbinary pronoun added to an esteemed French dictionary has ignited a fierce linguistic squabble in the country.

Le Petit Robert introduced the word “iel” — an amalgamation of “il” (he) and “elle” (she) — to its online edition last month. While the term is gaining currency among young people, it is still far from being widely used, or even understood, by many French speakers.

Though at first the change went mostly unnoticed, boisterous debate broke out this week in a nation that prides itself on its human rights tradition but that also fiercely protects its cultural heritage from foreign meddling. In one camp are the traditionalists, including some political leaders, who criticize the move as a sign that France is lurching toward an American-style “woke” ideology. In the other is a new generation of citizens who embrace nonbinary as the norm.

“It is very important that dictionaries include the ‘iel’ pronoun in their referencing as it reflects how the use of the term is now well accepted,” said Dorah Simon Claude, a 32-year-old doctoral student who identifies as “iel.”

“It is,” they added, “also a way of confronting the Academie Francaise that stays in its conservative corner and continues to ignore and scorn users of the French language.”

Education Minister Jean-Michel Blanquer is not in the same camp. He went to Twitter on Wednesday to say that “inclusive writing is not the future of the French language.” The 56-year-old former law professor warned that schoolchildren should not use “iel” as a valid term despite its inclusion in Le Robert, seen as a linguistic authority on French since 1967.

(Excerpt) Read more at apnews.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: french; iel; wankers; woke
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1 posted on 11/18/2021 12:08:06 PM PST by Oldeconomybuyer
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

2 posted on 11/18/2021 12:12:14 PM PST by Magnum44 (...against all enemies, foreign and domestic...)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

I can’t keep up. They should start a weekly update on verboten words.


3 posted on 11/18/2021 12:12:36 PM PST by Lurkina.n.Learnin (The road to tyranny is paved with compliance )
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

The Jacobins only attempted to change the Calendar.

Today’s radicals want to change language itself.


4 posted on 11/18/2021 12:13:12 PM PST by PGR88
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

“It is very important that dictionaries include the ‘iel’ pronoun in their referencing as it reflects how the use of the term is now well accepted,” said Dorah Simon Claude, a 32-year-old doctoral student who identifies as “iel.”I

++++++++

Well, of course “iel” would think that. Change everything to accommodate “iel”. I have always wondered if this stuff was going on in other languages.


5 posted on 11/18/2021 12:15:20 PM PST by Southside_Chicago_Republican (The more I learn about people, the more I like my dog. )
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

From the article at the link:

“In Greece, where all nouns have not two, but three possible genders, there is no official nonbinary pronoun, but groups who support them suggest using “it.””

_Somebody_ gets _it_.

I have been calling those “things” It for a while now!


6 posted on 11/18/2021 12:15:57 PM PST by cgbg (A kleptocracy--if they can keep it. Think of it as the Cantillon Effect in action.)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

Idiocy.


7 posted on 11/18/2021 12:16:28 PM PST by A Navy Vet (USA Birth Certificate - 1787. Death Certificate - 2021. )
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
Why would they do that. They have a perfectly acceptable alternate.

”On” as in, “On dit” translates as “One says.”

8 posted on 11/18/2021 12:16:37 PM PST by HIDEK6 (God bless Donald Trump. )
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

This should be fun to watch! I was wondering what would occur with the romance languages where each noun is male or female!


9 posted on 11/18/2021 12:17:08 PM PST by vaskypilot
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To: PGR88

If you can’t language something it is hard to think it.

That is why some folks here have a lot of trouble dealing with concepts that are hard to explain with specific words designed for that purpose.


10 posted on 11/18/2021 12:17:57 PM PST by cgbg (A kleptocracy--if they can keep it. Think of it as the Cantillon Effect in action.)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
If "iel" is the third-person singular neutral term - then what is the third-person plural neutral term. I.e., what pronoun would be used to refer to a group of "neutrals?"

And what about the possessives?

Son = his

Sa = hers

and "its"???

Regards,

11 posted on 11/18/2021 12:20:33 PM PST by alexander_busek (Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

instead of adding a new one, why not dump the other two?


12 posted on 11/18/2021 12:22:05 PM PST by Chode (there is no fall back position, there's no rally point, there is no LZ... we're on our own. #FJB)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

i hope it causes no end of troubles in general, let alone legal documents...

will misgendering a word become a hate crime?


13 posted on 11/18/2021 12:24:48 PM PST by Chode (there is no fall back position, there's no rally point, there is no LZ... we're on our own. #FJB)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
Isnt French already its own gender?

/Ducking ;)

14 posted on 11/18/2021 12:25:17 PM PST by Magnum44 (...against all enemies, foreign and domestic...)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

Would have been most appropriate to use “ill”.


15 posted on 11/18/2021 12:25:52 PM PST by drSteve78 (Je suis Deplorable. STILL)
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To: Chode

There is only one personal pronoun that works and it’s all inclusive because everybody no matter what, has one.

Therefore by their definition it is gender-neutral. The word is... (drumroll please):

a**hole


16 posted on 11/18/2021 12:26:46 PM PST by Clutch Martin (The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.)
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To: Magnum44

Mais oui!

Or is it, may we?


17 posted on 11/18/2021 12:28:00 PM PST by drSteve78 (Je suis Deplorable. STILL)
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To: Clutch Martin

thank you...


18 posted on 11/18/2021 12:34:50 PM PST by Chode (there is no fall back position, there's no rally point, there is no LZ... we're on our own. #FJB)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

Equivalent to our He/she or “shemale”?.................


19 posted on 11/18/2021 12:38:12 PM PST by Red Badger (Homeless veterans camp in the streets while illegal aliens are put up in hotels.....................)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

“It’s a beautiful thing, the destruction of words.”
― George Orwell, 1984


20 posted on 11/18/2021 12:40:16 PM PST by Red Badger (Homeless veterans camp in the streets while illegal aliens are put up in hotels.....................)
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