Posted on 12/11/2018 6:43:17 AM PST by marktwain
Armed citizens and police officers are natural allies, and teammates in the fight against crime. There is no segment of the community more supportive of law enforcement than their fellow citizens who are lawfully armed.
So why are they accidentally killed by police with such distressing frequency?
2018 has been a tough year
This has been a tough year for police and armed citizens alike. In 2018, we’ve seen a number of tragic mistakes made by police officers who shot and killed lawfully armed citizens in error, including a homeowner in Aurora, Colorado, a security guard in Chicago, Illinois, and a Thanksgiving eve shopping mall patron in Hoover, Alabama, among others.
In each of these situations, the officers believed they were using force to stop someone who had endangered innocent life, but they were sadly mistaken. The officers were thrust into a dynamic and dangerous situation where they had to act quickly based on imperfect and incomplete information, and each of them made a fatal error that cost a life.
We still don’t understand the details of how these particular events unfolded, so it’s inappropriate to comment directly on the circumstances or assign blame. There were probably mistakes made by all parties – both armed citizens and police – which led to the unhappy endings of these stories, and this is not the place to hash that out.
Tactical considerations
Instead, I’d like to suggest some things for police to consider in order to avoid a tragic repeat of these events:
More Here at Policeone.com
(Excerpt) Read more at policeone.com ...
Why don't you explain to us why the policies and actions of police are not subject to political considerations?
Did I say that???? Funny, I don’t remember saying or even implying anything remotely like that.
Perhaps you better read all the posts that prompted my ACTUAL statement and then you would perhaps understand why I referred to his “twisted attitude”.
Your hyperbolic anecdotal horsecrap is unworthy of comment. But I will say this; Offduty is likely 100% correct in his estimation of 90-95%+ “LEO’s are dedicated, informed, honest, hard working, public servants trying to do their level best to protect the public and avoid using violence if at all possible.”
But if you choose to judge the entire profession on media hyped sensationalistic stories of rare occurrences to the contrary then knock yourself out. But the majority of us that know better are going to assume you are just another ignorant paranoid lunatic spewing nonsensical bilge water.
LOL, great statement. I love it!
Not so sure about that...I was pulled over and the officer took my license and registration, went back to his cruiser and returned and said, "do you have a firearm in your vehicle? My computer says you have a CCW permit"
I told him I did have a loaded firearm in my vehicle and he told me he considered it a 'courtesy' for me to have notified him of this fact. I was polite and he only gave me a warning, and I pointed out that I was on his side and CCW holders have the lowest crime rate in the US...he merely repeated that he considered it a courtesy to be advised.
I asked my local LEO buddies what they thought of this and they all laughed and said I should have told him to got to hell. LOL...easy for them to say!!
“...he considered it a ‘courtesy’ for me to have notified him of this fact.”
He’s right. CCW training recommends that be exactly what you do even if you’re in a state where it’s not required.
Not really...when I am working in a state where I am not a resident, I usually obtain a concealed carry permit...mostly because it is good training and I get a lot out of the class sessions, almost always taught by active or retired LEO guys.
I really like the classes and at one time had permits in AZ, NV and ID. Plus have taken advance combat handgun courses in Nevada...EXCELLENT course. Nevada is a non-recip state.
Never once did anyone ever say that it was required or a good idea or a courtesy to inform LEO during a traffic stop...I understand the concept, I just don't recall in the many hours of classroom lectures ever hearing this mentioned.
Thanks, though.
Years ago it may have been ok to do the courtesy of volunteering you’re a CCW holder. Today, answer truthfully if asked and don’t volunteer anything else. It may depend on the state though.
Interesting, I have been to several and one of the most common “suggestions” is if you are pulled over and you are carrying, when asked for your license you hand him that and your CCW permit.
Actually several states have “Duty to Inform” laws on the books :
http://concealednation.org/2013/07/traffic-stop-while-carrying-concealed-what-to-do-if-youre-pulled-over/
By just making it a matter of your practice when pulled over it eliminates the need to know each and every state law. Personally I have always just believed it to be a smart thing to do.
Sorry, here’s the proper link with a listing of thise “Duty to Inform” states:
So, how many dead pets, wrong doors, property seizures, etc., are you good with?
Thanks for the link...good info
“YOU have much more latitude in discretion than I did then and in retirement do now.”
In Washington State (in spite of the rash of new anti-gun referendums), the law specifically states that the use of deadly force is more restrictive on police officers. Although there have been recent cases where some DA will try to make a name for themselves in getting a conviction on a self-defense shooting.
“...when asked for your license you hand him that and your CCW permit.”
That’s a REALLY good idea. Last time I got pulled over the first think I blurted out was “I have a gun.”
That didn’t work out so well. j/k
Having read through all of the posts, my take-aways are:
Avoid interaction with LE at every opportunity ( everything you say and all). Don’t speed, come to a full stop, do PMCS regularly on your vehicle etc, that IS under your control.
Avoid involving oneself with situations that do not directly involve yourself or your loved ones, be a good witness, use your cell phone camera long before your sidearm maybe?
If unable to avoid either the above, insure that your weapon(s) are holstered or otherwise secured long before the LEOs arrive, declare yourself “ a good guy”, and most importantly, maintain situational awareness (head on a swivel, focus on the whole of the immediate area and assess what you see/hear/sense quickly; decide based on that input. Remember, another CCW type may not know that you are a good guy either!
Regarding CCW and LE interaction- know what is required by law- do it. Never assume that any cop is either a good or bad guy ( just like any other person you encounter and interact with n the street) but, have a plan either way.
If being armed is an occasional thing, then I think you are more likely to have issues than if it is an everyday all the time mentality. If you are a “newbie” at this lifestyle, then I suggest participating in role playing and competitive marksmanship ( IDPA or USPSA etc) to burn off the butterflies and nerves etc. Never stop thinking….
God Bless the good guys, whomever they are.
I've seen undercover cops that look like bums with badges that you would never think were cops.
"...Having read through all of the posts, my take-aways are..."
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