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Victor Davis Hanson: Are we on the verge of civil war?
washingtontimes.com ^ | Victor Davis Hanson

Posted on 09/20/2018 4:00:29 AM PDT by RoosterRedux

Americans keep dividing into two hostile camps.

It seems the country is back to 1860 on the eve of the Civil War, rather than in 2018, during the greatest age of affluence, leisure and freedom in the history of civilization.

The ancient historian Thucydides called the civil discord that tore apart the fifth-century B.C. Greek city-states “stasis.” He saw stasis as a bitter civil war between the revolutionary masses and the traditionalist middle and upper classes.

Something like that ancient divide is now infecting every aspect of American life.

Americans increasingly are either proud of past U.S. traditions, ongoing reform and current American exceptionalism, or they insist that the country was hopelessly flawed at its birth and must be radically reinvented to rectify its original sins.

No sphere of life is immune from the subsequent politicization: Not movies, television, professional sports, late-night comedy or colleges. Even hurricanes are typically leveraged to advance political agendas.

(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: cwii; cwiiping; vdh
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To: RoosterRedux

When the CW2 begins i hope the other side keeps in mind that they reside in mostly gun free zones.


41 posted on 09/20/2018 4:36:08 AM PDT by Leep
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To: RoosterRedux

I can tell which side someone is on by one question. What do you think about the assassination of Abraham Lincoln?


42 posted on 09/20/2018 4:36:27 AM PDT by Ikeon (I'd rather be hated for who I really am, than loved for something I'm not. K. Cobain)
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To: RoosterRedux

The cultural marxists that you speak of got their start at the beginning of the 20th centuty when the “Progressive” movement began in earnest, inspired by Marxist principles. It went on nitrous oxide overboost with the election of Obama. He was allowed to assume office, with nary a whimper from so called “constitutional conservatives.” It could be safely said this portent signaled the potential death knell of the constitutional republic.

Whatever else Obama may be, He most certainly is NOT an Article II, Section 1, clause 5 natural born citizen, and he blatantly told us so when he admitted that he was born a citizen of Great Britain and Kenya. He knew no one in a position of consequence would dare to oppose him, lest they be accused of nativist racist beliefs, the restrictions of the constitution be damned.

Their timing was perfect. He was allowed to get away with it for TWO terms.

Now, Kamala Harris is waiting in the wings for HER curtain call....


43 posted on 09/20/2018 4:36:42 AM PDT by DMZFrank
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To: jmacusa
I think this country is, in some ways, always in the middle of a civil war. What prevents the violence is the fact that our civil wars are (mostly) fought at the ballot box.

The difference this time is that the opposing side wants to completely change our constitution and country. That kind of civil war can't be fought at the ballot box because the enemy wants nothing less than the destruction of the ballot box. Democratic Socialism/Communism/Marxism is mandatory, not optional or voluntary. Most citizens of the U.S. will never simply turn their property over to the state. It must be taken by force.

I think when Trump got elected, the Radical Left realized that the electoral system in this country will not give them what they want. That is one of the reason we see such ramped up rhetoric from the Left.

Trump's election was a wake up call.

44 posted on 09/20/2018 4:37:20 AM PDT by RoosterRedux
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To: Leep

when the interstates are closed, the cities will quickly starve


45 posted on 09/20/2018 4:37:32 AM PDT by bert ((KE. N.P. N.C. +12) Muller..... conspiracy to over throw the government)
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To: Vaquero

I can tell you what Union general William Tecumseh Sherman had to say on the matter:

“I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as little more than spies, which, in truth, they are.
If I had my choice I would kill every reporter in the world, but I am sure we would be getting press dispatches from Hell before breakfast.” William Tecumseh Sherman


46 posted on 09/20/2018 4:39:14 AM PDT by ought-six (Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: iontheball

“For us, it comes down to liberty or death, so there you have it in a nutshell.”

Yup.


47 posted on 09/20/2018 4:40:19 AM PDT by ought-six (Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: RoosterRedux
The war has already begun (probably started when Obama was first elected)

I'd push the time back to immediately post-Reagan. Just as Woodstock was the capstone of the 1960s, the late 1980s was the birth of globalism. The seemless policies of two Bushes, Clinton and Obama have us where we are today.

48 posted on 09/20/2018 4:40:22 AM PDT by JonPreston
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To: VanDeKoik
People here are no more inclined to sacrifice their nice life for a shooting war, than anyone else.

This is the essence. When the time comes that it is not a choice whether we 'sacrifice our nice life' because it's already being taken away, then it may turn into a 'civil war.'

One of the most foolish discussion points going around is about which states would go which way in a Civil War II. The first "Civil War" was not a civil war at all. It was a War Between the States. People were fighting for their states more even than for the Federal or Confederate central government. A 'Civil war' is people against people, literally "civilians" against civilians.

That is what we face now. If the self-centered, entitled, socialist thugs start intruding on 'nice' peaceful neighborhoods, then we might have a civil war. If the 'nice' people in their nice neighborhoods fight back and a lot of people are actually shot, then one of three things will happen:

1) The rioters will stick to safer places to loot - like they do now - and things will remain turbulent but not at war.

2) The state will stand back and let people defend themselves, in which case their might be a true civil war.

3) After the civilian 'battle' the government will step in and arrest/destroy the 'nice' people who were defending their homes instead of the rioters (after all they don't arrest the rioters now). Then we might have a second Revolutionary War to throw off the oppressive government.

Of those options, only one leads to 'Civil War.' The good news - for some of us - is that those scenarios will play out in other locations long before they get to my home. By then the path forward will be obvious - painful, but obvious.
49 posted on 09/20/2018 4:42:11 AM PDT by Phlyer
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To: RoosterRedux

Civil war can be avoided if the country would simply come to an agreement on splitting. It can’t survive as a 50-state entity anymore.


50 posted on 09/20/2018 4:43:39 AM PDT by ScottinVA (Liberals, piss off. That is all.)
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To: qaz123

L8r


51 posted on 09/20/2018 4:43:57 AM PDT by preacher ( Journalism no longer reports news, they use news to shape our society.)
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To: billorites

Better question: Which side is more willing to use them? And use them regardless of consequence?


52 posted on 09/20/2018 4:44:08 AM PDT by PIF (They came for me and mine ... now it is your turn ...)
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To: RoosterRedux

IMHO, it started way before obama. But, I think they thought obama would be able to push it over the edge. They didn’t realize there’d be as much resistance as there was. It may not seem like it, especially with how much loathing we all have for the guy, but he wasn’t able to do as much as he could have done. The GOP caved on a lot of stuff and he got o’care through. But, he had 8 years to completely destroy the place and couldn’t pull it off.

Since he didn’t pull it off and now things seem to be going in the opposite direction, they’re getting insane. And I say, good. Let them get as insane as they can and want to be. The crazier pelosi, harris, and the rest talk and act, the better.


53 posted on 09/20/2018 4:44:15 AM PDT by qaz123
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To: Phlyer

In the civil war.....

The object is not to die for your state but rather to kill the enemy of your state


54 posted on 09/20/2018 4:45:06 AM PDT by bert ((KE. N.P. N.C. +12) Muller..... conspiracy to over throw the government)
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To: jimfree

Dems whose historical perspective begins either when they were born or when they were elected.


Or at the moment of opening their mouths ..


55 posted on 09/20/2018 4:45:13 AM PDT by PIF (They came for me and mine ... now it is your turn ...)
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To: NonValueAdded

Maybe on the brink, but where do we draw the boundaries of the territory to be claimed by each side?

In the past, I have suggested that the division be made not by state lines, but by the counties or Congressional districts within those states. The “red” part of the electoral map is nearly contiguous across the United States, with sometimes widely scattered little “blue” islands of varying size. The “red” portion is then free to pursue the historical policies and legal traditions that went into the founding of the entity known as “the United States of America”, while the “blue” enclaves are free to adopt whatever cockamamie set of rules of governance they choose. Those individuals that are trapped within the “red” zone, that crave to live under rule other than that based on the US Constitution and framed in the Declaration of Independence, would be free to migrate to the “blue” zone of their choice, and if caught in any kind of criminal activity, would be forcibly sent to one or another of those “blue” zones.

Of course, there would be a strong border maintained between the greater “red” zone, and each of the smaller and scattered “blue” zones, with no border jumping allowed. Emigration from these “blue” zones would be permitted only on an individual basis, after extreme vetting, to assure the applicant really and truly is being persecuted in the “blue” zone, and that should the application be accepted, that a full embrace of the of the ideals and principles of the “red” zone is an inviolate requirement. Later attempts by this individual granted refuge, to resist or overthrow the stability of the “red” zone results in revocation of the citizenship granted, and immediate return the the “blue” zone from which the person came.

But of course, this is only a pipe dream, and has zero chance of being adopted.


56 posted on 09/20/2018 4:45:48 AM PDT by alloysteel (If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, bury them in bull feathers.)
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To: MeneMeneTekelUpharsin

10 YEARS AGO


late to the party again? That was self-evident when B Clinton assumed the Throne with his Chinese partners.


57 posted on 09/20/2018 4:47:29 AM PDT by PIF (They came for me and mine ... now it is your turn ...)
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To: RoosterRedux

And they’ll still lose, if it comes to that. They do not expect any resistance. Just look at ANTIFA rallies now. Folks show up to fight back and ANTIFA is running to the cops.

Watch this video. Guy fights back, knocks a few of them down and they’re crying for the cops.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mlt123zGIB0


58 posted on 09/20/2018 4:47:51 AM PDT by qaz123
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To: bert

Yep, distributions of goods is a big part of it.
And someone has to make the goods as well.
Also, hope they enjoy not having power.


59 posted on 09/20/2018 4:50:32 AM PDT by Leep
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To: RoosterRedux

The tipping point could be the impeachment of DJT, should the RATS get their way.
Maybe its time for a massive march on DC by Trumpsters.


60 posted on 09/20/2018 4:50:39 AM PDT by kenmcg (tHE WHOLE)
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