Posted on 09/30/2017 4:19:11 AM PDT by RoosterRedux
I was watching a World War II movie in a theater, with an Asian immigrant friend, when I learned a lesson in culture that no university could have taught better. In one battle scene, there is a cease-fire order, and a German soldier approaches the British position, under a white flag of truce. The British commander steps forward, completely vulnerable, but the Germans do not shoot. There is a brief exchange of words, as the Germans demand surrender, and the British commander declines. Both men then return to their positions, and the deadly fighting resumes.
My friend in the theater leaned toward me, and quietly asked, why didn’t they shoot the German?
I was both amused and horrified at the question. It was unthinkable that one would shoot a man under a white flag, so unthinkable that it was literally laughable. I actually did laugh.
My answer was, they can’t shoot him; he’s under a white flag.
My Asian friend was perplexed for a moment, and then got it. So, this is how Western people fight wars.
This incident sticks in my memory all these years later, because it enlightened me to a profound truth. Not all cultures are equal. In that same war, the Japanese, for example, had utterly no regard for our white flags, unless it suited their purposes. Their concept of honor was utterly unlike ours. To them, it was the white flag of surrender that was dishonorable, and anyone who surrendered, friend or enemy, was a pariah. Suicide was preferable.
(Excerpt) Read more at americanthinker.com ...
I had an uncle who was a B-25 pilot in the Pacific Theater during WWII. He was shot down over China and his whole crew survived six months behind enemy lines while the Chinese helped them get to General Chang's lines. The Japanese knew they were alive and tried everything to get them. Whenever the Japanese found evidence of my Uncle's presence at a village they killed everyone in the village and burned it down.
My uncle loved the Chinese people and hated the Japanese until the day he died.
I agree with the WWII vet.
All victories have a price.
I disagree re the “good guy” muslim.
VIRTUALLY ALL of those suffering from ‘sudden jihad syndrome’-—those who lived among us prior to it before attacking us-—were considered as friendly by t heir neighbors..........
Until they were NOT!
yes
It happened in the ETO as well, and in that case, there were a fair number of Americans who spoke some German and Germans who spoke some English. The Germans were all over the place when it came to behavior- some of them had no compunction about shooting medics, etc, while others were "correct" to the point where they put themselves on the line. When Germans went past the established boundaries, they generally got it back good and hard.
(Incidentally, about a year before my dad passed away he told me about a situation involving an ETO vet uncle that touched on some of the points brought up in this thread. Dad did not tell me how it ended - I don't know if my uncle actually ever told him the ending - but there was no good outcome possible.)
Mr. niteowl77
“Take them to the rear,” was usually code for “get them away from the front line and kill them.”
Hacksaw Ridge has some illustrative scenes.
Bump. Key word, resolve.
I bet that’s part of it.
Then again, after watching “Blackhawk Down”, “Saving Private Ryan”, etc... what does a person really want to say?
My dad is a Korean War vet. Drafted and ended up in the DMZ. All my years of growing up he had PTSD, and he and Mom are relieved now, that there’s finally a word to describe what happened to him. I’ve promised to help him write a book so I’m recording his stories. He says he wants to talk about Korea, to give a picture of what it was - and that it would be ugly. But the words and stories he comes up with can’t convey that. The only references he’s made so far (after over a year of recording his stories) that come close to conveying it were his talk of the smell, and his talk of wanting to see a particular place where many Americans had died. He mentioned in passing a couple days ago that (IIRC) 56,000 Americans were killed in Korea.
But he wants to write the book to describe “community”. His generation survived the Depression because they each had a cow and chickens, and my grandma owned the store and offered credit to those who she knew couldn’t pay - saying no child would starve to death if she could help it. His stories truly reflect that the community was a family.
It’s everything that today’s society under the politicized culture and weaponized government is not.
I do feel like I’m living in a war zone, and as I watch the America I love die and realize it will die because of the deep state and the lack of those willing to fight the deep state, I’ve lost interest in talking about truth. There’s nobody willing to hear it or do anything about it so what’s the point of talking? We’ve long since passed the point where evidence and truth made any difference to the culture-at-large.
The old-time stories are the only place where life makes sense these days.
I’ll bet it was fed well before the pictures.
Stephen Ambrose (IIRC) wrote in one of his books that an ambulance full of American wounded took a wrong turn and ended up at a German roadblock.
The officer looked at the white-faced driver, checked inside, saw it was full of wounded and told the driver to turn around and get the Hell out of there.
About an hour later another vehicle came down the road, stopped, dumped off some large boxes, turned around and hauled posterior.
After waiting for the boxes to blow up, some guys (probably expendables) were sent out to see what was in them. It turned out it was full of American cigarettes.
Never saw anything even remotely comparable to that happen in the Pacific.
That is one of the things my father talked about; albeit briefly.
The smell.
Sitzpinkler is a term of ridicule and contempt, not respect. So no, most don't...
When they do they do so completely. My dad was among the first into Japan after the surrender. Initially everyone was confined to base out of fear that lone Americans would be killed if they wandered off. Very quickly the occupation authorities realized there was no danger. The Japanese fought like lions but when the emperor said surrender they all obeyed.
I don't know about "take them to the rear" being a dog whistle for "shoot them". For one thing, prisoners can be a valuable source of intelligence. (Many Japanese who surrendered were seething with resentment towards their officers, and willingly gave as much information they could.) The following snippet is from the memoirs of Major Dick Winters (Band of Brothers) T/5 Leibgott's parents were Austrian, and he spoke fluent German. He hated Nazis so badly that his fellow soldiers assumed he was Jewish, which he was not.
My casualties were one man dead and four wounded. Tech/5 Joseph D. Liebgott had been slightly wounded in the arm, but he was ambulatory so I assigned him the mission of escorting seven German prisoners to the rear. Liebgott had earned the reputation of being one of Easy’s best combat soldiers, but we had all heard stories that he was very rough on prisoners. Liebgott was one of Easy Company’s killers, so I deemed it appropriate to take a bit of caution. When he heard me say, “Take the prisoners back to the battalion command post,” he replied, “Oh boy! I’ll take care of them.” In his exuberance Liebgott stood up and paced back and forth and he was obviously very nervous and concerned.I stopped him in his tracks. “There are seven prisoners and I want seven prisoners turned over to battalion.”
Liebgott was highly incensed and started to throw a tantrum. Somewhat unsure of how he would react, I then dropped my M-1 to my hip, threw off the safety, and said, “Liebgott, drop all your ammunition and empty your rifle.” There was much grumbling and swearing, but he did as I had ordered. “Now,” I said, “you can put one round in your rifle. If you drop a prisoner, the rest will jump you.” One of the German prisoners, an officer, evidently understood this exchange. After he understood my orders, he relaxed and sat down. Liebgott returned seven prisoners to battalion headquarters that day—I personally checked with Nixon.
Of course my dad exaggerated a bit. Still it’s a fact that not a single unit of the Japanese army surrendered as such. Individuals yes but never whole units. Think of the German Sixth Army, the American Philippines garrison or the British garrison in Singapore. They all surrendered as units. The Japanese never until the total surrender occurred at the end.
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