[vladimir998]

“Big difference my friend.”

Dead is dead - especially when the people had every right to hold onto their property.

“Seems every time Hitler is brought up the obfuscators say, what about Stalin?”

How are the people who bring up Hitler not the obfuscators? Ukraine wants to be a free country. The Russians want chunks or all of it. What do they say? Oh, the country is now run by Nazis, Hitler lovers. Get it?

[tcrlaf]

“Ukraine wants to be a free country. The Russians want chunks or all of it.”

You paint this as a “Russia-Ukraine” thing.

What about all those people who simply don’t support what happened in Kiev? Should they be hunted down and “killed like dogs!”, as several ID’s have said of FR?

[Rashputin]

You know, if Russia really wanted chunks of Ukraine they'd already be sitting on it. Russia taking over parts of East Ukraine is the fondest hope of the people in Kiev. It solves a lot of their problems and reduces the number of people who vote for others. The people in Kiev are far more anxious to get rid of parts of Ukraine than Russia is to have them.

You're usually a level haded guy and I give serious consideration to what you say but somethings blinded you to half the situation in this case. Soviets, Nazis, Right Sector, "little green men", every bit of that is part of one smokescreen or another.

The real issue, behind the smoke, is that the people who took over do not have and have done nothing to earn the trust of a large percentage of the population. So far, in fact, they've all but begged Russia to roll in and now they're using the Army in a way that generates the most possible anger. They roll in, shoot the place up, roll out.

That chit didn't work in VN, it never works. You have to leave people in the towns, people who are fair and who play by the rules they announce, not show up, blow up, and move on. There are US people in Kiev, they know that approach doesn't work if the goal is to regain control instead of to generate anger. So, what's the goal that fits the reality that's unfolding?

IMHO, goal number one has been to not count the votes from a number of regions in the East, especially the Southeast. Goal number two, was to if possible goad Putin into taking enough of the Southeast to keep it permanently off the voting rolls in Ukraine no matter who comes in as peacekeepers or to monitor elections in the future. Beyond those two there may be a desire to frighten "ethnic Russians" into leaving the country, maybe or maybe not. The overriding goal, though, is to be the ones controlling the corruption they have no intention of ending.

What other goals fit with what Kiev has been doing as opposed to the smoke it's blowing?

[duckln]

But the law was everybody had to share and share alike and when you don't follow the law you normally suffer.

Ukraine wants to be a free country

The ones that took control in Kiev, want a fascist country and that nut praising Hitler is proof.

In the last 30 years Russia has remarkably changed for the better. I know that's hard for you to accept, but it's undeniable.

The fascist Ukes have not, by holding their stupid parade, and sticking it to the Russians every chance they could for the last 30 years.