Russian separatists down 2 choppers, fighting spreads to Odessa as Ukraine teeters

Fox News ^ | May 02, 2014 | Fox News

[BurningOak]

Pro-Russian separatists shot down two helicopters in a key eastern Ukrainian city, and fighting in the port city of Odessa triggered a fire that killed dozens, as the embattled nation moved closer to the brink of civil war.

Interim Ukraine President Oleksandr Turchynov said "many" pro-Russia rebels have been killed, injured and arrested in a major offensive to regain control of Slavyansk, though it was not clear if the Kiev-backed forces had succeeded. Russia reacted angrily to the offensive by Ukrainian security forces, calling for an emergency meeting of the UN Security Council after a spokesman for President Vladimir Putin warned it "effectively destroyed the last hope for the implementation of the Geneva agreements."

In the Black Sea port city of Odessa, Ukraine's third-largest city, a fire that broke out in a trade union building amid clashes killed 31. Fighting there represented another ominous milestone in the conflict that threatens to become a full-blown civil war, as Odessa holds huge historic significance for Russians and Ukrainians alike.

[DoughtyOne]

Ukraine is on the other side of the world from the USA and we have no important interests there. 

Did we have an important interest in Austria in the 1930s?  How about Poland?  What about France?  What about Northern Africa?  What about Russia?  Did we sanction state adventurism when Germany was doing it?

I don't think Reagan thought of the Ukraine as of no interest.  He cared about everyone behind the Iron Curtain and wanted them to be free to live out their own best destiny.  Do I think he would commit all our troops to the defense of the Ukraine?  No, but I do believe he would be taking it to Russia big-time in the media, and doing whatever he could behind the scenes to help.

Ukraine was also part of Russia going back a thousand years. Crimea was moved from Russia to Ukraine during the 1950’s by Khrushchev.

Who moved Crimea from Russia to the Ukraine?  The Politboro did it.  Khrushchev as merely the mouthpiece.  If they hadn't wanted him to do it, it wouldn't have happened.  And if he had tried without them, he wouldn't have lived on in retirement..

How America acquired PR is an interesting story and not in a way that supports your point.

That could be.  None the less I do believe you are sharp enough to understand the difference between U. S. medling and Russian medling in this era.

[Rashputin]

Western Ukraine is a much a powder keg as Eastern Ukraine but for different reasons. At least that's what I hear from folks with family who live there. From what I hear that's part of the reason the "government" in Kiev stays tight with the Right Sector types and their affiliates.

Like I've said before, I'm amazed Ukraine has stayed in one piece this long.

[BenLurkin]

Not me!

I’m going to start lurking on these threads — they have gotten as bad as the Crevo-Devo threads were.

[DoughtyOne]

So you’re saying the U. S. had armed gunmen there?

Oh, you’re talking about Crimea. That’s right. Tanks and the like...

I agree.

[lodi90]

The great mystery of today is who shot the Ukrainians in Odessa. Right Sector? Monsanto?

[tcrlaf]

“Every post from you is some sarcastic insult. Try debating and arguing with facts and logic sometime”

It can’t, because the facts in evidence simply don’t support it’s “position”.

It is merely here to flame troll, and to divert the conversation way from the topic.

[Rashputin]

Wait for it ...... "PUTINISTA" !!!!

Yeah, if you don't swallow every PR puff piece out of Kiev and the EU you're probably Russian Special Forces with a laptop somewhere in Eastern Ukraine. I know how you feel, I didn't believe the stuff about the Parachute Brigade being clever and displaying a separatist flag to save lives, not displaying it because they defected. Silly me, huh?

Now I don't believe the Army shooting protesters armed exactly like the protesters in Kiev were is really the Army slaughtering evil Russians who deserve it. So . . . we'll see.

[BurningOak]

I do not believe that belligerent dictators building empires is something American can afford to ignore. The world changed, isolationism has been destroyed by technology. We can no longer be untouchable seating on our little island and sticking our head in the sand.

As for the excuses for why Russia is justified to take Crimea, all of these can be used to justify a Mexican reconquest of Texas.

[tcrlaf]

“The great mystery of today is who shot the Ukrainians in Odessa. Right Sector? Monsanto?”

The evidence is pretty clear about that. All you have to do is google the videos, and search the tweets.

[1rudeboy]

Russia Today tweeted that the shooters were English speakers. /s

[Norm Lenhart]

Well being a Palinista already I could see Russia from my house ;)

[1rudeboy]

Hey man, if you’re not going to give me the courtesy of a ping when you’re speaking about me, then quit your whining, forever.

[Norm Lenhart]

” do not believe that belligerent dictators building empires...”

Like Obama?

[1rudeboy]

Help me with the logic, again: when Obama does it, it’s bad; when Putin does it, it’s . . . .

[no-to-illegals]

Guess one could say God knows the reasons.

[BurningOak]

-”I do not believe that belligerent dictators building empires...”

-”Like Obama?”

Obama has not invaded Canada. Russia under Putin crashed an insurgency (so much for loving separatists) and invaded/occupied two nations.

[Rashputin]

". . .all of these can be used to justify a Mexican reconquest of Texas."

The difference is, Texans say,

and the Kiev Kiddies say,

[BurningOak]

I know that God is in control. But that does not mean he is on our side, The Lord can and does use evil men to punish those that fail in his eyes.

[no-to-illegals]

The Earth was last night affair, one guesses.

[babygene]

“The Ukrainian president was impeached for good reason. Our neo-Bolsheviks, never, ever bring up why.”

Why don’t you tell us why? (probably because you have no idea)