Posted on 04/02/2014 9:14:27 AM PDT by Star Traveler
Imagine it’s 2040.
You go to the grocery store, and when you look for the checkout counter there is none. There’s no place to pay for your groceries because you already did.
When you walked into the store, a sensor identified you, perhaps from a ring or watch you were wearing that transmitted the information. Or perhaps you didn’t need to wear anything special. Maybe a device in the store figured out who you were using a combination of facial recognition, 3-D body shape identification and your gait.
Your unique identifier is attached to your digital wallet, which transmits payment for the groceries directly to the store. But you don’t pay in dollars. Your wallet has a dozen digital currencies in it, all with different values based on a variety of factors, including loyalty programs. At certain stores, you might pay with their version of frequent-flier miles. At others, you might pay with the equivalent of a virtual credit card — except the credit card isn’t issued by a traditional bank.
You might also pay with credit that you received through a peer-to-peer online exchange that connects investors with people seeking short- and long-term loans. That’s how you got your mortgage and financed your self-driving car, too.
(Excerpt) Read more at dealbook.nytimes.com ...
Did you actually bother to read the article, or even the link? It’s chip AND pin, or chip AND signature. Pins and signs ain’t going away.
That’s an interim function ... they’ll do both until everything is in place. These things are phased in and that’s what we’re talking about here.
I should mention also that this is an interim step to “no pin” and “no signature” cards, or what they refer to as “contactless payment”.
Actually I was using that very thing, “contactless payment” in Dallas, Texas - back in 2005 through about 2008 in a limited trial. It worked great. I just “waved” it and the transaction was done ... :-) ...
Bitcoin, phasing in like a silkworm missile.
Oh ... and one more thing ... I’ve been reading that Apple is probably going to get into the payment systems act, too. I believe they’re talking about using the iPhone (or any iDevice they have) with Bluetooth and making it a “contactless payment” system — no signature and no pin!
It’s great until it gets stolen. Again my gas credit cards used to work the same way, then it dawned on them that if people’s wallets got stolen the thief was free to use the credit cards since there was no level of verification that the card was in the possession of the owner. Gas stations backed away from that and now require you enter your zip (which of course is also on your license so it’s not that great a security measure). If anybody goes to no-sign no-pin they’ll go back when people’s cards get stolen. Contactless only only sounds like a good idea until you remember thieves.
I’m assuming this customer is the one in front of me, with 25 or so items in the “12 items or fewer” line.
It worked fine for me and I used it several years. Apple is going to go that way and I think you’ll see them going into the payment systems in a big way.
There’s always a transition period, and we’re in it now, while the changes are made. As I said, it’s already been out into effect in a limited way and I used it without any trouble.
Right now, as we speak, I go to QuikTrip and just today, one of the workers there said that they’ve gone to completely “sign-less” for $50 — and that’s on the old cards, not the new ones. Well, heck, that covers just about everything for one trip ... :-) ...
Basically ANYONE could grab someone’s card and buy stuff there, no questions asked.
However, the person who has the account is protected, because if something is stolen or missing, you call it in and your money is put right back in your account. That’s an old card or a new card.
With the guaranteed money back in case of fraud, people are going to have no problem using them.
I’m sure it worked great for you. And would have worked great for the guy that stole your wallet until you got the card canceled. That’s the hole in no contact, it presupposed the guy who has the card is the guy who’s supposed. Which kind of makes it like cash, only your entire credit limit in now in your wallet, which in most worlds would be considered bad.
An Apple app has whatever security you put on your phone, if you set it to lock then thief will have to get past that, if you don’t though.
You’re “protected” in so far as you figure it out and call it in have your card canceled and replaced and go through the list of charges to figure out which were you and which weren’t. Think of it from the bank’s perspective. How many times do you think they’re going to reimburse people for these fraudulent charges before they decide sign-less is too expensive. There’s a reason they’re the guys driving (years after they should have) chip and sign/pin, additional security layers work in their favor in the long run because they’re the guys out $50 * the number of card thieves that go to QuickTrip or anyplace else that will do contactless.
No matter what the problems are for these card companies, they are doing it. You’re saying — There are problems! There are problems! — and yet, here they are doing it already. I’ve been through a limited version of it in Dallas - just “waving it” and walking out. You say, “there are problems” but there I was, and everyone else in the program doing it.
You say, again, “there are problems” and yet here is the BIGGEST OPERATOR of gas station/convenience stores in to town doing transactions with no pin and no signature!
It appears that regardless of your view — “There are problems” — they’re moving full speed ahead.
That’s what I mean with “direction” and “movement”. It’s happening regardless of the perceived problems.
Card companies don’t always think long term, the fact that chip and pin has been out in the world for a decade and the card companies just NOW (after the Target debacle) decided to push it hard here shows that. So the fact that they are currently allowing a glaring security hole doesn’t mean they won’t figure it out and change their tune. Or maybe the stores will change their tune, according to Wiki in the UK the retailer carries the liability for fraudulent charges involving CNP cards.
There are problems, and when the problems dig deep enough into the right pockets they’ll fix them. Much like the gas stations that started requiring the zip. You keep studiously ignoring that fact, we’re in Battlestar Galactica land, this has all happened before, this will all happen again. Companies HAVE done no contact card usage before, got burned, and brought back contact. Why QuickTrip chooses not to learn from the example Texaco, Shell, Chevron and Exxon I don’t know; but I’ve already seen how this plays out.
Again, it’s in the “movement” and “direction” - from all that I’ve seen, read about and experienced for myself.
The “movement” is there and it’s steady. The “direction” is continuing in this same way and not going backwards to a previous time.
When you have “movement” and “direction” — then it’s only a “matter of time”.
I’ve got “contactless payment” right now ... and have had for a long while. And it’s expanding - just with my own personal experience. Thus no matter what you refer to as “the problems” — in my real life and direct experience - it’s expanding. And that’s not expanding from just maybe a couple of months ago and it’s just a “hiccup” right now - but expanding in my direct experience from NINE YEARS AGO.
It’s not a movement. Like I told you multiple times, companies have done no sign no pin and BACKED AWAY from it. That’s not a movement, it is not steady, it is not a continuing direction. That’s experimenting, getting their fingers burned, and realizing it’s a stupid idea.
When I say “movement” I’m talking about things “progressing” - and then the other item is “direction” — and with that, they’re either going back to where they were before — or — it’s going to a direction forward into areas where it hasn’t been before.
SO ... what I’m telling everyone here is that in my direct experience, plus what I’ve read and seen - the ‘direction’ is forward in the future (where it hasn’t been before) and the ‘movement’ is happening (namely it’s not at a standstill).
And that is experience not over just a couple of months, but direct experience and observation over NINE YEARS and that shows that it is not a fluke, since it’s been progressing for that length of time.
But as I’ve pointed out to you, it’s NOT territory it hasn’t been before, companies have in the past gone no-sign no-pin with cards, and got burned, and remembered why signatures and pins are used. It’s not new, and there won’t be a mass move to it. Really all we have to do is look at the UK, they’ve had these cards for a decade and they still primarily couple the chip with signing and pins, because doing otherwise defeats the whole purpose of the chip.
By any metric you choose,every dataset indicates that Bitcoin technology is being adopted faster than any technology preceding it. Bitcoin is going viral on a global scale,it is a measurable,predictable fact.
Since its usage is anonymous it’s not really measurable. And since prior performance is not an assurance of future performance it’s not really predictable either. And frankly it’s not really even a technology, it’s a method of doing private cash, and private cash has been around and heavily adopted for a long time. And heavy adoption doesn’t mean it’s going to last, when was the last time you collected Green Stamps? Camel Cash? Marlboro Miles?
You really need to catch up.
Eddie, you really are kidding. Has the IRS issued guidance for green stamps? I must have missed that.
The reality is sir that billions of dollars are poring into this “technology” to fund startups.
Clinging to this “fake money” concept is making you sound rather silly.
Very soon you will see signs reading “Bitcoin Accepted Here” everywhere.That is just the way it is going to be, your denials aside.
The big difference Green Stamps were for trading not for selling. Bitcoins are straddling the line between a private currency and a commodity because of the trade system, that “requires” (in so far as anything the IRS does is required) tax guidance.
I saw plenty of Green Stamps accepted here signs growing up.
Green stamps
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