Boeing Source: Missing Plane in Pakistan

Lignet ^ | March 17, 2014, 5:30 p.m. |

[robowombat]

The Malaysian government reportedly is investigating the possibility that missing Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370 avoided radar detection and landed in Pakistan near the Afghanistan border inside Taliban-controlled territory, according to the UK Independent . . . investigators confiscated a homemade flight simulator from the pilot’s home to see if it reveals any useful information . . . the Malaysian foreign minister told reporters that Malaysia asked several Asian countries for assistance in its investigation, including Pakistan . . . Pakistan dismissed the idea that a Boeing 777 could land undetected inside the country but promised to work with the Malaysian government in its search for the missing plane . . . a LIGNET analyst received information from a source at Boeing that the company believes the plane did land in Pakistan . . . Israel is taking the possibility of a terrorist attack seriously by mobilizing air defenses and scrutinizing approaching civilian aircraft, according to the Times of Israel . . . a Boeing 777 requires a lengthy, 7,500-foot runway, and Pakistan has many of them, meaning Flight 370 could conceivably be hidden in a hangar inside the country . . . U.S. surveillance of the area may be able to shed light on the theory through satellite imagery or signals intelligence.

[editor-surveyor]

Likely all of the above!

[Always A Marine]

Don't know that 35,000 feet is up high enough for an effective EMP blast. Most of the tests in the mid-60s were at altitudes between 30 and 60 miles up... I would think that some sort of ballistic missile would be more effective.

There's no doubt that a High Altitude EMP would be most effective, but a detonation at only 40,000 feet could devastate an area several hundred miles wide. A radius of 120 miles from Philadelphia includes Washington, Baltimore and New York City. If successfully detonated, that's enough to bring the USA to a grinding halt.

[LaRueLaDue]

There's no doubt that a High Altitude EMP would be most effective, but a detonation at only 40,000 feet could devastate an area several hundred miles wide.

That's true. I just thought that terrorists and/or third world countries with limited resources (compared to us) would prefer a bigger bang for the effort. Why cripple a small percentage of the country, when, with a little more effort, you could cripple an area vastly larger?

[old curmudgeon]

That type aircraft would never get past the ADIZ.

Even the dope haulers have quit using aircraft.

20 years ago, they were stealing planes like crazy.

How often do you hear about it now?

Either that plane had something on it they want, or it will be used against some country with a lesser defence.

[ebshumidors]

Most engines are derated -governed- to extend service time. An empty CFM56 737 with derated engines is a sportscar.

[huldah1776]

I wondered about al qaeda #2 and what he was doing.

[PghBaldy]

I imagine that any surviving countries, if their leaders had half a brain, after seeing what happened to us, would completely obliterate any country suspected of being involved in the attack.

[LiveFreeOrDie2001]

BIG Nuclear Summit on March 24th.....

Could be a target.

[fso301]

However the disappearance of this airplane does not fit the pattern. Terrorists go for terror. They do not go for suspense

Successful terrorists avoid patterns. The 9/11 terrorists were successful in part because years of conditioning taught passengers to stay calm, the flight was going to be diverted to Havana, or wherever. The hijackers would make their demands for release of some prisoners on the other side of the planet and after a few days the passengers would be released.

By "disappearing", FL-370 has achieved, D.B. Cooper, Emelia Earhart and Bermuda Triangle fame.

[Yosemitest]

"Did you know that she was going to the area? Could she be the target?

WASHINGTON — First lady Michelle Obama will travel to China this month with her daughters, Malia and Sasha, and her mother, Marian Robinson, ..."

I didn't even think about her.

Why would Muslim Terrorists target another Muslim Terrorists (the Obamas) ?

The Obamas are arming them, every chance they get, and "Collapsing this System", as quickly as they can .
Why would Muslim Extremists want to do anything but support their friends.

[Yosemitest]

Take a close look at this graphic.

Previous ACARS data Mar 17, 2014

In the world of Air Traffic Contgrol, "Attention To Detail" is everything.
Being accurate FIRST is everything.
Being safe is everything.
Speed comes later, but accuracy is a must.

Now for other career fields, accuracy isn't stressed as much.
Now let's ASSUME that, in the speed of getting out the information, that graphic is built on the WRONG degree off of that satellite.
Look what that would do to the search area.

What if a Muslim sympathizer was in the chain of people that disseminated that information.

And take a look at the fuel capacity of the different models of Boeing 777-200,

Maximum Fuel Capacitycan be from 31,000 U.S. gal (117,340 L) to 45,220 U.S. gal (171,170 L) to 47,890 US gal (181,283 L), depending on the configuration,

and that can give it a Maximum range (at maximum payload {because MH370 might have weighed less, giving it a LONGER range} ) of from

5,240 nautical miles (9,700 km, 6,027 miles) to 7,725 nmi (14,310 km, 8,892 mi) to 9,380 nmi (17,370 km, 10,793 mi), depending on its configuration.

So the search area may change,

but since we don't know the exact configuration of that particular aircraft,
and we don't know if the Malaysia Officials are revealing ALL of the facts to us, or being honest with us,

we must assume the worst.

So, ... YOU do the MATH.

[B212]

for sure an aircraft such as the 747/777, can takeoff in less, if one elects to ignore the safety margins....

[getmeouttaPalmBeachCounty_FL]

I’ve been wondering something since the first days into this.

Suppose the Capt. & First Officer are innocent for a moment. And since very little suspicion is cast over the passenger list, who could have taken over the control of that a/c?

I’ve been wondering if someone was able to enter that plane before the crew and passengers - likely via the companies servicing it before the next flight — catering, cleaning, etc. This flight was a red eye. It was dark outside. The majority of airport workers have gone home for the evening. How easy would it be for a sympathizer of a nefarious fanatic group to lay low inside a truck whose driver supported your cause? Once delivered onto the plane, the perfect compartmental place to stowaway awaited your arrival and you laid low until reaching cruising altitude. What if you had advanced knowledge of the 777, and you knew how to disable tracking devices? I’m just saying.

Has Malaysia Airlines checked all of its 777 pilots? Has everyone been accounted for? Everyone on leave, recently retired, someone who maybe changed a/c and now flies something else?

I just haven’t heard anyone speculate about the possibility of there having been a stowaway. Maybe that’s why there are no leads and this is so confusing. Everyone known to be aboard #MH370 is checking out as clean.

Have all of the ancillary people who were on the flight line that evening been checked out?

What I’m theorizing is - someone on the inside of that plane made a surprise appearance about 40 minutes into the flight. Many of the passengers would have already nodded off given the time. It was likely to have been a darkened cabin. Flight attendants would have been milling about the galley and making small talk. Maybe even delivering some coffee or a light snack to the cockpit.

I’ve had too much time to think about this.

[Yosemitest]

I suppose anything is possible, but not everything is probable.
I'd bet that the flight’s pilot, Zaharie Ahmad Shah is the planner and instigator of this event.
Me? I'm just a retired air traffic controller trying to figure out HOW all of this is possible.

[RinaseaofDs]

Killing the passengers, taking the phones and removing the batteries is easier than a lot of things I can think of, especially if they dove the plane and popped the oxygen masks. With masks on, you could put them all out within two minutes with CO2. The body loves CO2 as much as it does O2, and you’d keep breathing it after passing out.

[getmeouttaPalmBeachCounty_FL]

I just have a strong feeling he was not involved.

[Yosemitest]

Don't allow your feelings to override your logic.
Weigh ALL the facts, and apply your feelings accordingly.

[GOPJ]

Pakistan dismissed the idea that a Boeing 777 could land undetected inside the country but promised to work with the Malaysian government in its search for the missing plane . . .

Pakistan wouldn't know if Osama Bin Laden was living 5 miles away from one of their major military bases...

Yes, the pakis are our 'friends'... here's a related story:

PESHAWAR, Pakistan – A Pakistani tribal court on Saturday reduced the prison sentence for the doctor identified as helping the CIA track down Osama bin Laden from 33 years to 23 years.

http://www.latimes.com/world/worldnow/la-fg-wn-pakistan-reduces-jail-term-for-doctor-who-helped-cia-track-osama-bin-laden-20140315,0,5588437.story

[GOPJ]

Were other flights going to Pakistan that night? A flight that could be shadowed?

[Yosemitest]

MH370 Didn't need to shadow the same aircraft all the way.
The shadowing was needed crossing the border to the country's airspace, although the longer you do one aircraft, the easier it is as you change airspace from controller to controller.
The pilot's experience over the years of flying that airspace helps him to know where the radar blind spots are, in those routes.
He could have used two separate aircraft for the two border crossings, shadowing them from slightly behind and above, but below could have been done also.
Below is harder due to wake turbulence.
The hardest part is keeping the aircraft in sight, that you are shadowing, and below and slightly to one side is also possible, but out of sight of the passengers in the aircraft you are shadowing, is very important.