Posted on 06/04/2013 11:44:25 AM PDT by rickmichaels
An Alabama teenager was denied her high school diploma and fined $1,000 for wearing a feather on her graduation cap to celebrate her Native American heritage.
Escambia Academy High School in Atmore, Ala., makes its students and staff sign a pre-graduation contract agreeing not to wear "extraneous items during graduation exercises unless approved by the administration."
Chelsey Ramer, 17, tried in vain to get approval to attach an eagle's feather to her graduation cap as a symbol of her Native culture.
"They told me that if I wore it that they would pull me off the field," Ramer, a member of the Poarch Creek Band, told NBC affiliate Local 15.
But Ramer wore it anyway and refused to sign the dress-code contract.
The school wouldn't give Ramer her diploma. She now has to fork over $1,000 to get it.
The teen, however, regrets nothing.
"It was worth it. It means a lot to me," Ramer said.
Eagles soar 2500 feet above the earth, and they lose feathers frequently. There has never been a need to kill an eagle to garner a feather.
That line sounds kike a cousin to global warming.
When I lived in WNY I lived near the Onondaga Indian reservation. I recall Speaking to the Department of Environmental Conservation officer near that area and he told me that about 50 years ago Eagles and other raptors were in Danger of becoming extinct due to poaching for the feathers. He also said that only certain preapproved rehab places were used for injured birds.
The Native Americans came around and collected the feathers. Ones that were in good shape were used in ceremonial head gear and damaged ones were burnt.
This DEC agent had no reason to lie to me about it.
If this is a public school then it is a government agency.
Since this is technically an amount due based on a breach of contract, it would be considered "liquidated damages".
Sorry, but a 17 year old cannot enter into a legally binding "contract" unless they have been certified by a court as being emancipated. (Even then most contracts are void).
Whoever wrote the story used the term "fine" for convenience sake, but this has nothing to do with a civil fine imposed by a court. So the case you cited has no relevance to this case.
Any penalty imposed by a governmental agency is a fine. You can't dress it up as some kind of "liquidated damages clause" and avoid the implications of the excessive fines clause.
On top of everything else, the girl did not even sign the "contract".
The only legitimate recourse the school had was to deny her access to the ceremony. Refusing to give her the diploma and slapping her with a $1000 fine (liquidated damage fee) was not something they had a right to do even if they waived a "contract" in front of her.
The guy with no theology tells me that mine is weak for basing it on Yeshua’s words?
Must be humor, right?
>> “they signed a contract which included certain requirements on the student’s part, and specified certain consequences for breaching the contract.” <
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Yes, then the school waived their contractual recourse by allowing her to participate.
How do you miss this glaring fact?
The difference between you and I is that I am a Rebel and you are a Conformist.
I see stupid rules and I rebel against them and cheer on those who break them.
You see stupid rules and you submit to their authority and cheer on those who made them.
“If this is a public school then it is a government agency.”
It is not a public school.
Poaching an eagle is nearly impossible.
I seriously doubt any government environmentalist’s word that any measurable poaching of eagles has been done.
Eagles get seriously injured when diving for a kill, as do hawks. They get their wings broken, and cannot fly. There are one winged bald eagles that have been “rescued” at numerous zoos around the country. I’ve never heard anyone at the zoo claim that the eagles were deliberately injured, its just too common to make such a claim.
>> “This DEC agent had no reason to lie to me about it.” <<
Yes he did, his job was created by asserting a problem that doesn’t exist.
Poaching eagles isn’t impossible, they don’t spent their whole life way up in the air, they have nests, and sometimes just hang out on the ground or on polls. Probably once a month on the bike trail I get within a BB-gun shot of an eagle, had one sit on a rail watching me cruise by no more than 10 feet away just a month or so ago. If I wanted to kill me an eagle I’d have done it a bunch of times already.
And as I have said repeatedly, this is a PRIVATE school.
Sorry, but a 17 year old cannot enter into a legally binding "contract" unless they have been certified by a court as being emancipated. (Even then most contracts are void).
No, but her parents could and did enter into a contract with the school.
Any penalty imposed by a governmental agency is a fine. You can't dress it up as some kind of "liquidated damages clause" and avoid the implications of the excessive fines clause.
Once again, there is no governmental agency involved in this case.
On top of everything else, the girl did not even sign the "contract".
I think part of your confusion is sloppy reporting. The "contract" the girl was asked to sign was akin to a "behavior contract" often used to deal with children - an acknowledgement of the rules and the consequences for breaking them. It has no legal standing per se, other than to counter any claim that the student didn't know the rules. Here that is not even a claim - she clearly knew the rules, because she asked for an exception to the rules. The contract at issue here is the contract her parents signed very year when they registered her in this private school. That contract did include the dress code at issue here and also specified the consequences for violation. And as long as her parents signed the contract (which they did or sh could not have attended the school) and were not under duress, then the school has every right to impose the consequences described.
Having been monitoring this thread, I’ve noticed that quite a few folks seem to start with the assumption that this is about what a public school can/can’t do. That would make the girl (in the eyes of most) the hero in this story. But, given that this is about a private school, about individuals making a conscious choice to attend such a place, about the rights of private individuals/private businesses to establish their own criteria for standards of behavior, etc., then the girl becomes the one who is in the wrong. I do have a problem with the excessive nature of the fine and, if it is not one that is stipulated ahead of time, it tends to make the institution sound petty.
As for those whose libertarian sensibilities have been violated by the school’s tamping down on this student’s “rights” to express herself, get a grip. Young people are to be instructed in the ways of the world. Decorum is one aspect of those ways, always has been. Maybe, because we see so little of it anymore, it is beyond our ability to recognize its necessary place in society every now and again.
They waived one aspect of their contractual recourse, but the waiving of one avenue of recourse does not prevent them form availing themselves of the other avenues of recourse allowed by the contract.
And that is fine, as long as you are willing see the consequences imposed. But if you argue for their to be no consequences for breaking rules, you are not a rebel, but an anarchist - definitely not a conservative.
If I see a rule that I believe I cannot morally or ethically follow, I will break the rule - but I will not whine when faced with the consequences.
“Yeshua never criticised the dress of the people.”
Actually, the Old Testament has some pretty strict dress codes. And the Apostle Paul spend some time in scripture discussing appropriate attire as well.
In this case, a private school had a code meant to provide a nice graduation ceremony that could be enjoyed by all. They probably also wouldn’t have approved of someone wearing jeans & a T-shirt. And that is OK, and it is legal.
Eagles can be found in Iowa scavenging road kill. Also around livestock facilities where dead chickens or pigs are sometimes left exposed. That’s in addition to the expected places like river parks. Easy to pick off with a .22 or even a pistol. Even guys who kill hawks on sight seem to like seeing eagles and mostly leave them alone.
No reason for stringent restrictions on them. They’re not far away from being nuisances.
Not many people poached eagles for feathers in the midwest, and they became very rare there too fifty or so years ago. We were always told it was due to DDT. Plenty of them around now.
How do you know that? It is not in the article. If it is a "Charter School" then it is a quasi-govermental agency and must adhere to the constitution as if it were a government agency.
>> “Actually, the Old Testament has some pretty strict dress codes.” <<
.
Lay the references on us!
That factoid is not in the article.
If it were a private school, the the student made the mistake of asking permission. She should have put the feather on after she had taken her seat and then asked for forgiveness after the ceremony had ended.
It is always better to ask for forgiveness than permission. If you ask for permission and it is denied, then you can't later ask for forgiveness.
She has some lessons to learn about being a Rebel.
I actually took the time to look up the school and visit its website... It is a private Christian school. I also read the enrollment contract and the student handbook.
If you read the article, the student didn't "whine". She said it was worth it. Probably true in a weird sense. She made international news.
She'll probably get some interesting scholarship grants because she asserted her Native American heritage and got punished for it.
I think she'll bleed this event for much more than the $1000 her parents will have to pay to get a copy of a diploma that no one will ever look at anyway.
My two sons were both home schooled through high school. They are both 6 figure engineers now. No one ever asked to see their high school diploma.
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