Posted on 12/27/2012 4:08:34 AM PST by afraidfortherepublic
The New York Times seems concerned that teens in the fracking belt of eastern Montana are opting to work in the new oil-field economy right after high school rather than going straight on to college. A front-page story warns: Taking a job is “a lucrative but risky decision for any 18-year-old to make, one that could foreclose on his future if the frenzied pace of oil and gas drilling from here to North Dakota to Texas falters and work dries up.”
Let’s see. Where is a teenager more likely to learn the basic and transferable virtue of showing up every day and on time, not to mention how to get along with a boss and fit into an organization — as a communications and binge-drinking double major at Missoula State University, or as a mechanic fixing broken rig equipment?
Too many high-school graduates are reflexively going to college as it is, without a clue what they are doing there or how to take advantage of higher education. Mandatory stints in the private economy before college enrollment could do wonders for study skills. If, by deferring or maybe even skipping college entirely, students were foregoing their one hope for immersion in Western civilization, there would indeed be grounds for regret.
But colleges’ own curricular decisions have long since destroyed their right to present themselves as a gateway for precious knowledge of the past.
(Excerpt) Read more at nationalreview.com ...
“This is now, when college costs reflect the padded bill enabled by enticing dumb kids to pay extra “
Those kids aren’t dumb, they are ignorant. The kids aren’t to blame for being ignorant. Its the parents fault and society in general for allowing public schools to be operated in a fashion where they prey on our children.
In a certain way its Darwinian, kids who have been taught don’t fall into the trap and are better prepared.
I was looking at a job posting at a local university that matched almost exactly what I did when I was in the workforce 20 yrs ago (again, no degree). It required a four-yr degree as well.
“It is not possible to work your way thru college...”
Its alot of work...and I mean it looks like ALOT of work; but, I’ve know many people who have done it...even recently. I have alot of admiration for them.
On the flip side of the coin, I have a liberal co-worker, whose wife has racked up around $220k in loans, going for her PHD in Spanish!?!?! I feel sorry for hium really, because he has no idea what is about to hit him.
How did she rack up that much debt?
Living off of the loans.
I suggested to him that the loans should be limited to tuition, books, fees, etc; and, he got offended. In his mind, everyone DESERVES and education; and, in order to be a full time student and get said education, one has to borrow money for living expenses.
Its a recipe for disaster. There is no restriction on how the loans are used. In fact, I got the feeling that he had actually been encouraged to use the loans for living expenses, at the student aid office.
At the very least, I think the loans should only go for tuition and books. If the student has to get a part time job to buy his Ramen noodles, so be it...things in life are not always easy. And, if you shop at the organic food grocery store instead (like my nit wit co-worker), you are only delaying the hard parts of life.
My point stands. It’s immoral to continue to support this “education” system, which has as a primary goal the debt-enslavement of the students.
A co-worker of mine went to engineering school. He started out getting a job as a technician at our company. Then he went to the local college (not ABET accredited) to get his pre-requisites out of the way. This college specializes in non-traditional studnts; and, there were lots of night classes and early morning classes. Our company also gave him some flexibility on his hours...and helped with tuition.
He worked like a dog for two years. Some of the plot stamps on things he plotted were at 2 in the morning, etc, because he was working such a crazy schedule. This whole time, he and his wife (and new baby) were doing the Dave Ramsey beans and rice lifestyle, to pile up a cash reserve. He used the cash reserve to take a two year break from work and go full time to an ABET acredited program.
And he graduated!
This guy came from nothing...dirt poor. And, he worked like crazy and greatly improved his life. I really admire him for that. I don’t know if I could have done it myself; but, he proved that it is possible to work through school these days.
My daughter is a senior in HS, she now carries a 4.25 gpa. I am amazed at some of the offers she has gotten, Indiana State University gave her a 4 year free ride a couple of weeks ago and my daughter had no idea why I was started crying when I read the letter.
She wanted to work through high school but the wife and I made her concentrate on her grades, with her I know we made the right decision.
I don't mean to take away from your co-worker's accomplishment. It is significant. And very few people have the discipline at a young age to do it.
Do you remember the total amount of time, from beginning to save up for college to getting his degree?
“It’s immoral to continue to support this “education” system, which has as a primary goal the debt-enslavement of the students.”
So you are going to change it how? By keep students out of college? lol yeah that’ll work
how about lobbying our elected reps for change? wait they are too corrupt and will just follow the money
You don't see what's coming, do you?
Do you think we can keep printing money with no consequence?
Triple-digit inflation is just around the corner. Our "elected reps" got us here.
And your solution is business-as-usual and "lobby our elected reps."
Good luck with that.
And good luck with the collapse.
Which has very little to do with which students go to college.
sheesh
But you are still stuck in the "everybody should go to college" mode.
Don’t be an idiot.
Education is never a waste, assuming of course the kids get an education but thats a different issue.
You’re advocating the state limiting what children can go to college. Let them figure it out.
now they are worthless because of junk studies.
College used to have the “well rounded” individual in mind.
now we are forbidden the classics, prohibited for critical thinking science, and forced junk studies for worhtless departments.
The joke was basket weaving classes. Now we have a degree for that.
When college studies are real studies it makes sense.
You're advocating the state be involved in handing out student loans.
The state should have nothing to do with it. Banks should grant loans based upon the likelihood of being repaid.
Very few kids are mature enough to go to university at 18 years old. The oil field is a good place for them when they get out of high school. When they are ready they will go to college and some will learn that they do not want or need college.
I’m sure the NYT IS worried.
The “Big Education” cycle is a funding mechanism for progressives.
Huge borrowed govt created money is routed to institutions who pay excessive salaries to profs and admins who donate it to Democrats.
The other advantages these kids have are:
* If they save up the money, they can pay for their own college or vocational school later.
* They can get other jobs elsewhere, with or without schooling, showing that they have a work history and work ethic.
Dave Ramsey’s Generation Change and related financial education courses are getting into some schools, though not enough. You can, however, send the kids to one of the classes on a Saturday to give them the basics of financial information.
When we taught it as volunteers at our church, some of the high schoolers and college freshmen were stunned. It costs how much? We can’t get rid of this debt with bankruptcy?
I really don’t know how long he saved up, before starting. Once he started, it only took 4 years. His first two years going part time were elongated such that he went to class all year long (no summer break)....but he got them done in time. And his last two years were as a full time student...and you can get all your classes scheduled in the right time frame, if you go to morning classes, since fewer of the traditional 19 y/o students sign up for these. So, it took 4 years. (I think there are some flat rate semester fees, paid in full even if taking only one course...and since this was his own money, he made sure not to let any classes slip by, lest he be forced to pay another fee for an entire semester).
....but what I don’t know is how long prior to this he was saving money. He worked at our company for around 5 years before starting, so he potentially could have been saving up that entire time. I’m sure it was very tempting for him to just quit his job and live off student loans...but one can dig a large hole very quickly doing that. So, it may have taken him nearly a decade...and I don’t see anything wrong with that. Some might think that takes too long...but what other choice is there, if you don’t come from a wealthy family? Taking full scale loans on is a trap, so the long haul is the only option. It might not be fair, if you compare yourself to classmates who have their parents pay for it...but sometimes life isn’t fair.
I see you keyed off of the fact that he had tuition assistance from work...I don’t think that’s a bad thing. For all the people who say its impossible to work through school, the existence of employer tuition assistance is a good counter-argument. We had another lady (in her ‘50s) go to the community college part time on this and get an associates degree in business administration. Her kids were grown, she didn’t have alot of expenses, etc...but she made it happen. Another co-worker’s girlfriend went to the exact same school and got the same degree...and is over $50k in debt. IMHO, she took the wrong approach....literally living off of student loans. I don’t see anything wrong with getting a full time job first (and possibly getting tuition assistance), and going to night school. This is contrary to the notion some have that the job must be part time and in the evenings, while school is full time. I don’t think that is always possible...just my opinion.
I just had the realization that my school took 9 years, in a way. I went to a service academy for 4 years, and owed 5 years service in the army after that.
My brother got a sports scholarship and lived at home...and did part time jobs. I think it took him 6 years.
My sister took 13 years, again living at home and working.
None of these were the standard 4 year plan that we would love for our own kids to have...but we all found ways to do it, without mortgaging our future. And I really mean that - a liberal co-worker is over $220k in debt for his wife’s stupid PHD in Spanish. He constantly moans that the world isn’t fair; and, his son will never go to college. Well, he certainly won’t be able to help his own child for the next 30 years...so he has literally mortgaged his future.
I am not sure I agree that debt-enslavement of the student is a primary goal of the system, but it sure is a primary outcome for many who did not know or think about how the higher education game is played to their personal, financial detriment.
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