Posted on 10/12/2012 11:00:08 AM PDT by BigReb555
America mourned the death of Gen. Robert E. Lee on Wednesday, October 12, 1870 and Friday, October 12th marks the 142nd anniversary of his death.
(Excerpt) Read more at canadafreepress.com ...
Lee sent an application to Grant and wrote to President Johnson on June 13, 1865:
Being excluded from the provisions of amnesty & pardon contained in the proclamation of the 29th Ulto; I hereby apply for the benefits, & full restoration of all rights & privileges extended to those included in its terms. I graduated at the Mil. Academy at West Point in June 1829. Resigned from the U.S. Army April ‘61. Was a General in the Confederate Army, & included in the surrender of the Army of N. Va. 9 April ‘65.
I don’t revere Robert E. Lee and I’ve the right to say so. Whomever has their feelings bruised,too bad. I’m not going to lose sleep over it. And again, this has NOTHING to do with Obama and why do you keep dragging that into this? And lastly, for Heavens sake, enough of your pompous affectations of being affronted , please.
The vast majority of southern soldiers were conscripted, aka, enslaved to serve the slave power. They were accustomed to being so used, being required by law to act as slave catchers slave patrols. Often the wealthiest slave owners, almost always one of the wealthiest slave owners in a district was the militia captain. He assigned southern members of the militia to their duties as slave patrol, and they called it militia training.
The southern soldiers were enslaved. The slave power thought enslaving people to their “betters” was a positive thing.
You don't consider unjust taxes and regulations to be slavery?
"Slavery wasn’t in existence in New Jersey in 1861."
It was, until 1865. The 1846 abolition of slavery merely redefined slaves as indentured servants serving a "lifetime apprenticeship." Look it up if you don't believe me. It appears New Jersey had slavery and wasn't even honest about it.
Seriously? This is your “proof” of treason?
Come on. I know that we don’t agree on most of this stuff, but that’s really week.
Of course they were enslaved. Thanks for proving my point. Being forced to stay in a union at gunpoint that they entered willingly made all southerners slaves...well...except for the freed slaves who were allowed to come and go as they pleased.
Nobody...NOBODY...willingly joins a club that they do not believe they are allowed to leave, ever. The northern states believed that, until Lincoln came along.
Bruce.
Better check your “facts” again. They abolished NEW slavery in 1804. On February 15, 1804, New Jersey became the last northern state to abolish new slavery and enacted legislation that slowly phased out existing slavery. This led to a gradual scale-down of the slave population. By the close of the Civil War about a dozen African Americans in New Jersey were still apprenticed freedmen. New Jersey voters initially refused to ratify the constitutional amendments banning slavery and granting rights to the United States’ black population.
Nonsense. Good try though. You can’t have it both ways.
No two ways to it. None of the Southern leadership in 1861 believed slavery was dying, much less that it would be dead within 5 years. And there aren't any quotes from any of them that indicates otherwise. It's you who can't have it both ways. You can't launch a cause based on slavery and believe it was doomed to an early demise.
I didn’t. You injected such nonsense and have painted yourself into a corner with it.
I suggest you put the shovel down while you are behind.
So for the sake of clarity, do you agree with your friend that slavery would have died out in the South within 5 years?
Bruce Lee?
That’s just sad that you sully his memory.
Look. I’m sorry I’ve made you look so bad in these discussions, I didn’t realize your little ego was so fragile. Heck, I wasn’t even trying. But stop with the personal insults, OK. It makes you look even worse and is a waste of everyone’s time. The better approach would be to keep trying, hone your debate skills, and learn from your mistakes. People respect that a lot more than pulling the whiners card.
Get back to me when you’ve upped your game and want to debate the facts and the hypotheses.
Your Liberal Projection is amusing.
Well, given that you projected FMA’s observations on me to start with I appreciate you actually asking what I think before condemning.
Five years? NO. Eventually, for sure. There is no reason to believe that the CSA would be the only civilized country in the western world to continue with slavery. How long would it have lasted...no telling. But forever, no way.
Nope. Too soon. Keep working on it.
Of course, you have a right to say so. What is puzzling is why you are so full of hate that you feel a need to not only say so, but to insult those who disagree with you, on a thread intended to honor his memory.
this has NOTHING to do with Obama and why do you keep dragging that into this?
The point, ignored by you in your need to slander other people's heroes, is that by keeping this nasty banter going, you are distracting others from the campaign to replace Obama. Apparently insulting an American hero who died 142 years ago, is more important to you than defeating Obama.
for Heavens sake, enough of your pompous affectations of being affronted , please.
It is no affectation. I have honored Robert E. Lee, his father & uncle--both closely associated with the immortal Washington & American as well as Virginia independence-- since I was a schoolboy in Cincinnati. If I were not focused on defeating Obama, I would really let you have it. Your rants here, are not defensible. But enough is enough.
The same goes for you ally, who accuses one of the noblest men who ever came out of West Point, of treason. Why? Apparently because he did not betray the State, whose independence--recognized as among the sovereign nations of the World in the Treaty of Paris--was won in a considerable measure by the heroism of his own father & uncle. For Lee not to have served Virginia would have been treason, under any reasonable interpretation of the "Law Of Nations," as understood by the Founding Fathers.
If either of you "gentlemen," want to renew this, after the election--bring it on.
William Flax
P.S. Note how World War II hero, Douglas MacArthur--like Lee a former commandant of West Point--and a General whose father served the North on the Northern side in the War, you have been discussing--saw the Confederates in his classic farewell to West Point: Duty, Honor, Country. Don't think that you will find very many genuine American heroes, who saw this any differently.
So those decent Virginians who chose to honor their commitments to defend their country against the rebellious scoundrels - do you consider them treasonous?
Where did you learn history, “Ripleys Belive It Or Not’’?
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