Posted on 06/22/2012 6:08:58 PM PDT by SmokingJoe
The Surface tablet unveiled by Microsoft at its mysterious event in Los Angeles this week looked very impressive. It obviously faces very stiff competition from the Apple iPad—which dominates the tablet market. But, there’s a very good chance that businesses will flock to the Surface (or other Windows 8 tablets) if Microsoft delivers something close to what it presented to the media.
I am a huge fan of the iPad, so I don’t make that claim lightly. I have owned all three iterations of the iPad thus far, and I’m not prepared to abandon the New iPad any time soon. That said, I also love Windows, and I appreciate that businesses that rely on Windows PCs and Windows-based applications would love to have something like an iPad that also happens to be Windows. As it happens, I’m also in a position to compare the two side by side…almost. I don’t have a Surface tablet, but I do have a Samsung Series 7 Slate PC running the latest Windows 8 Release Preview. As far as devices actually available today to the general public go, this is about as close as you can get to what you can expect a Windows 8 tablet like the Microsoft Surface to be. --------snip------- The iPad is a tremendous device for working on the go, but it requires a lot of “duct tape and chewing gum”. You have to find apps and workarounds that let you be productive until you can get back to your “real” PC, and find ways to smoothly integrate and sync data between the two. But, with a Windows tablet you just use the same tools and software you always use.
(Excerpt) Read more at pcworld.com ...
Symbian devices(mostly from Nokia) and Blackberries did dominate the smartphone market at the time, no?
Things like the Blackberry were widespread but that wasn't what the iPhone was intended to compete with
The iPhone wasn't going to compete with the Blackberry and Symbian(which had an even beigger market share worldwide)? Well the iPhone (together with the Androids)has managed to wipe out the market shares for Blackberries and Symbians.
“Microsoft faces the more difficult situation that having tipped their hand, they've given Apple and their third-party accessory vendors many months to come up with competing features. “
Yes, but then Apple tipped their hand with the IPhone announcement too. Till his dying day, Steve Jobs believed that Google ripped of Apple's iOS for their Androids. However, it never stopped the iPhone from being widely successful, did it?
Well, the surface has microSD, USB 2.0, Micro HD Video, plus 2×2 MIMO antennae, (none of which the iPad has), which should have added up to make it a bit thicker, instead the RT surface is actually thinner than the iPad.
As for the screen, the Surface has a cleartype HD screen screen (that measures 10.6 inches diagonally, compared to 9.7 inches for the iPad), that comes in the 16:9 aspect ratio, which is more suited to watching video in the widescreen format, compared to an aspect ratio of only 4:3 for the iPad.
Its too hard to explain in writing. You have to try it and see. You can download it for free at http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows-8/release-preview
It takes a bit to learn the new way of doing things in Windows 8, but once you do, its hard to go back. Its also visually beautiful. Apple is releasing a new version of OS X with more iOS tidbits in order to sell more phones. The iPhone, after all, is their new cash cow. Microsoft is releasing a new version of Windows that really provides the user with a much better computing experience, in my opinion.
“So will Windows RT tablets, with purchases through Windows Store.”
Does this mean the traditional installation from .exe files, either from the Web or removable media is now out the window?
“Various applications have the ability to load their own files.”
Yeah, but it’s not like an Android tablet, in that you can hook it to any computer and go. If I had an Ipad, and I was on the road, I’d have to have a laptop along as well in order to sync files from a computer.
“Thankfully. Managing everything between the internal memory and SD card in my Android was a PITA.”
I agree, the way Android manages SD is a PITA. But, if you simply plug in your card and can open the card directory in My Computer or something, that’s way more functional. I assume Windows 8 will have this capability?
“Every system has the set of videos that it has codecs for.”
More specifically, every system has a set of videos that it DOESN’T have codecs for. And Apple is by far the worst. I’ve never had to re-encode a video to get it to play on my Android tablet.
“Since you note the use of an adapter is acceptable to you, just get the iPad Camera Connection Kit, which comes with USB and SD adapters. If you are a serious photographer, this setup even supports RAW (and Apple is continually shipping RAW updates as new cameras come out).”
More money and kludgy add-ons to duplicate functionality that other systems have already. Silly, especially at twice the price.
“Windows 8 will use Secure Boot, optional on PCs, but mandatory for tablets. No OS or driver without a cryptographically signed key will run on the hardware.”
AAAAAAAAAAAAAND we have our dealbreaker. Thanks but no thanks...I’ll keep my netbook.
Let me restate what I meant, hopefully more clearly, using the venerable car analogy.
Wheeled passenger vehicles existed long before automobiles appeared. Let's say the existing horse-and-carriages all had one horse. If (say) Henry Ford had come out with a two-horse carriage, that would be "competing" -- he offers a similar product with some "advanced features". He could be said to be advancing the state of the art of horse carriages, but he's not going to wipe out one-horse carriages simply because his has new features.
But if instead he comes out with an automobile, that's not what I think of as "competing", so much as "replacing" -- it replaces the old market with a new one that is radically different. It's a different product type. No matter how advanced a horse and carriage might be, it no longer has a place, except where automobiles are disallowed.
When Apple came out with the iPhone (and its associated apps and store), it was radically different. There simply was no longer a place for the Blackberrys and Symbians. Those older phones were useful horse-and-carriage products. Apple came out with an automobile, and within a short time, the old carriages were obsolete and disappeared.
With Surface, Microsoft has proposed another automobile, similar to the existing autos, but with a different engine and styling, and they've added a radio and a backseat for folks who want to go parking on a Saturday night. It will compete with the existing automobiles, and probably well, but it will not replace them because it's fundamentally the same product type, differing only in features that other manufacturers can add if they want to.
All I was saying is, competing with entrenched dominant products is a lot harder (sales-wise) than coming out with something radically different, that replaces the entire older product market.
I did a little more reading. I didn’t understand the difference between the Pro and the RT.
RT will be locked down, ala Ipad. Pro will run straight Windows 8. Also, secure boot is confirmed for RT only. Pro isn’t confirmed yet. If they decide to leave it open, this might be an attractive product for me, provided it doesn’t cost a million dollars.
http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/windows-8-surface-tablet/
Should be interesting.
If I ever need SD, USB or video out I'll buy the adapters (wife's months of having one has never produced that need). Otherwise I prefer to buy something without the extra baggage. Antenna? Don't know. The WiFi on the iPad is pretty good, better than the Android phones and the iPhone in the house.
instead the RT surface is actually thinner than the iPad.
They managed .01 centimeters thinner, and that only because they don't have to cram in that high-res screen. Any news source that has compared the specs in inches lists the same size rounded to the hundredth because that's a four-thousandth inch difference which gets rounded down.
As for the screen, the Surface has a cleartype HD screen screen (that measures 10.6 inches diagonally, compared to 9.7 inches for the iPad)
ClearType HD is a marketing term, just like Retina. Here's where you probably say "the Surface has ClearType and the iPad doesn't." That's because ClearType is Microsoft's name for an old antialiasing technique for text called subpixes rendering. The iPad doesn't need to anti-alias text because the pixels are already smaller than your eye can resolve at normal viewing distances.
that comes in the 16:9 aspect ratio, which is more suited to watching video in the widescreen format, compared to an aspect ratio of only 4:3 for the iPad.
Great, if that's all you do, but the iPad does a lot more than movies. I've found 16/9 a bit squished otherwise.
Of course it generates buzz, but the tradition goes further back than the iPhone. Remember, that announcement was when AT&T itself learned all about the iPhone.
after Microsoft has just signed a contract with a Taiwanese ODM(Pegatron)to manufacture the product(which they have),and they actually started making it?
Just contracted out? If that's true, it's terrible for Microsoft, and really stupid. That would mean the manufacturer has yet to tool up and work any bugs out of the mass-manufacture of the devices. We wouldn't be seeing this thing for at least a year. I have a feeling you're wrong on that point.
And I notice in your article, only Wi-Fi at first. Sad.
Win 2 Go is interesting. But, for me, the possibility of being able to boot an image of a work pc on a different device loses much of its value when the image is removed from the context network / workgroup and the resources available therein.
Secure Boot is impressive, and is the most compelling reason for me to consider an upgrade.
The Metro UI makes sense on a phone or tablet, or maybe even a touch-screen enabled PC. But for the existing base of installed screens... I’ll be using the Win 7 UI mode.
Secure boot is confirmed for both. For any manufacturer to be certified for Windows 8, it must include secure boot. However, Microsoft has given the option for PC OEMs to allow secure boot to be turned off in the UEFI settings. ARM OEMs do not have the option.
Given this larger picture, I don't think it's likely Microsoft will give the option to turn off secure boot on their own hardware. Each non-Windows Surface machine is one fewer going into the ecosystem they're trying to build. You will likely be able to run Linux on it eventually, after somebody's hacked the secure boot system or started signing Linux binaries and drivers.
I need to know more about the price.
Various outlets have speculated (because the prices haven't been announced yet) that the RT should retail in the $600-800 range and the Pro in the $800-1000 range. There are two issues to note, though.
First, you don't know what losses Microsoft is willing to take in order to penetrate the market. MS took some serious losses with both the Xbox and Kinect hardware in order to drive game & software purchases/marketshare. The components should cost in the ranges outlined above IF MS doesn't subsidize the product by taking a hit on price. Which they might do.
Second, you have to look at what is competing with what. The Surface RT is the primary competitor for the Ipad market, as the processors and specs are similar (if not slightly inferior). So the pricing should be around that of an Ipad. But the Surface Pro has the same specs as an ultrabook(!), meaning that it delivers full PC functionality in a tablet form. When you consider that the MacBook Air has a similar spec sheet (Intel i5 processor, onboard Intel graphics, an 11" screen, etc.) and retails for $999, you are getting a comparable (if not superior, based on its compatibility with all of the MS/business software) machine at the same price point and in tablet form! For a business, this is an amazing product. Why would I buy a MacBook Air when I could get a tablet that I can use as a workstation when needed?
I understand. But I think you need to consider that a large part of their target market is business, and they're not much given to impulse purchases. You have to get them thinking about your product while they're still working up next year's budget and deplyment/upgrade maps.
From all I've read, yes. They want the functional equivalent of the iPad and App Store.
If I had an Ipad, and I was on the road, I’d have to have a laptop along as well in order to sync files from a computer.
Thus the whole iCloud thing. Apple is thinking a step ahead of the old idea of the tablet as a slave device. A lot of people are giving up their desktops and notebooks completely in favor of the iPad.
I assume Windows 8 will have this capability?
Probably not for RT. They are rightfully trying to get away from that old paradigm of viewing files, one that Apple started ditching with the iPod. We don't need to care about song *files* being moved. We care about *songs* being moved. We don't play mp3 files, we play songs, let the OS worry about where the files (if any) actually are.
I’ve never had to re-encode a video to get it to play on my Android tablet.
I did for my Android phone. The popular MKV format has spotty Android support too. BTW, one reason for Apple's limited video format support is the hardware. Apple includes a dedicated hardware H.264 encoder that consumes very little power to display high-profile HD content. You get a consistent user experience. Apple is known to hinder flexibility to gain the best user experience. This is good and bad, depending on the circumstances and your point of view (and totally evil according to Richard Stallman).
More money and kludgy add-ons to duplicate functionality that other systems have already.
Your ideal required a "kludgy add-on" (an adapter) and so does the iPad solution.
AAAAAAAAAAAAAND we have our dealbreaker. Thanks but no thanks...I’ll keep my netbook.
Everybody has their requirements. Often they are made up to steer the user to what they already want or avoid what they don't like. We see this often in Apple haters trying to find some reason not to buy the generally superior Apple product (read above).
However, this is a reasonable absolute requirement. If you want to run Linux, and the product won't run Linux, then it's not for you. Too bad, it would be the best general-purpose Linux tablet out there.
Thank you, that’s helpful. I have an iMac and an iPad. I have been thinking of getting an Apple notebook, but maybe a Surface would be just as good.
Thank you, that’s helpful. I have an iMac and an iPad. I have been thinking of getting an Apple notebook, but maybe a Surface would be just as good.
Dude... that's totally false. The Surface RT might have those restrictions (since it is an ARM powered Ipad competitor), but the Pro is running "desktop" Windows 8 (i.e. Windows 8 Pro). It'll have every capability of a normal Windows machine, including installing whatever you want from wherever.
I understand you don't like Microsoft, but that's no excuse to just make things up...
What a coincidence, RT is what we were talking about.
I understand you don't like Microsoft, but that's no excuse to just make things up
I like products, or not, and Microsoft has made some good products and bad ones. Look back through the posts, you'll find comments positive to Microsoft. If you go further back you'll see some bitching about Apple, too.
“Your ideal required a “kludgy add-on” (an adapter) and so does the iPad solution.”
I disagree. Attaching a klunky, protruding piece of hardware to the outside of your machine to achieve functionality it should have had to begin with is way different from having a tiny, slick little device that virtually disappears in normal use, and expands compatibility to a NUMBER of devices. Any device made to adapt external media to the Ipad can only be used with the Ipad, but MicroSD adapters will work with ANY SD compatible device. In fact, they’re so invisible that, in my cameras, I actually have to visually check to see if I’m using an SD or MicroSD.
And, the true beauty of it is, in all my cameras, I can remove the micro SD without removing the adapter. In effect, it becomes an invisible part of the camera. No kludginess there.
When I first saw the MicroSD adapter, I thought it was brilliant and I still do. On the Ipad, blocking your charge port/data transfer port so you can use SD cards is just silly. What do you do when the Ipad has a dead battery, but you want to look at your pictures?
The Ipad should have either an SD or MicroSD port, standard. For the price, there’s no excuse. My netbook has two of them, for half the price. When I saw that the Surface tablet had a MicroSD slot AND a USB port, I got excited, but if it is going to be locked up like the Ipad, it just becomes a toy as far as I’m concerned.
I guess for me, the real issue is, will there be something out there that will make it worth it for me to ditch the netbook form factor? So far I haven’t seen anything, and the more I learn about Surface, the more I believe this. I already knew that about the Ipad.
A conversation between me and my brother-in-law, a diehard Ipad owner, sums it up. He was playing around with it after Sunday dinner once.
I played dumb and asked a few questions....
“That thing got a keyboard?”
“Uh, no”
“USB ports?”
“Nope”
“What about a card reader?”
“No, no card reader”
“Can you upgrade the battery or memory or storage?”
“Nope”
“Does it run Flash?”
“No, it can’t run Flash”
“Can you download 3rd party apps and run them?”
“Not unless they’re in the Itunes store.”
“What’d you pay for it?”
“$500”
“Hmmm”, I said. “I only paid $299 for my netbook, plus $30 for an upgraded battery that lasts 7 hours...”
He paused for a minute.
“When you put it like that, I’m not so glad I got this thing,” he said.
Later on, he got a case for $75 that had a keyboard built into it. I said, “Congratulations! You’ve just built a very expensive netbook!”
The old 110 isn’t stylish or a powerhouse, and is a bit bulkier, but it does way too many things well, and being open, is too easy to upgrade in a variety of ways.
Right now, I’m running Xubuntu 12.04. I’ve kept it continually upgraded since I got it in 2008. When it was obvious that the old SSD wasn’t going to cut it, I had the option of replacing the SSD with a traditional HD, but I found a cheaper, easier solution...I got a big, fast, class 10 SD card and put it in one of the SD card slots. Since the 110 wouldn’t boot from the SD, I put the /boot directory on it’s own partition on the SSD, then put the / (root directory) on the fast SD card. The rest of the old SSD is storage.
It works great. Seamless...you’d never know that parts of the OS were on two different drives. Zippy, in fact, as the class 10 SD is much faster than the built in SSD. A simple, cheap, invisible solution. And, if at some point I don’t want to occupy one of my SD slots (its not been a problem so far) then I can always go the traditional route of upgrading the internal HD.
When the original battery went bad, I got a 9 cell battery for it, so the run time is competitive with the Ipad. When it goes bad, I can get a new one for cheap and install it literally in under a minute.
When a wall shelf fell on it a few years ago and broke the LCD, I got a new one for under $60. A few screws and a plug-in later, it was working like new.
If any of these issues had come up with the Ipad, none would have been as easy a fix, and some would have just caused me to sell it or trash it and start over.
I don’t argue that the Ipad and Surface tablets aren’t well engineered pieces of hardware and entertaining, but I’ve never found them particularly useful for my purposes. They just don’t let me do enough. Options are my friend.
I’m just one person, though. If others find the Ipad or Surface useful, and they’re willing to pay for either, that’s great. Capitalism is a wonderful thing.
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