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Posted on 01/03/2012 1:02:05 AM PST by NoPrisoners
Ok, what’s the natural function of your reproductive organs? What does a vasectomy do to yours?
Yes, it is mutilating the body. You would say that someone was crazy to pay money to get their arm made useless.
A heart bypass restores the function of the heart. What does a vasectomy do?
Which is why birth rates were higher when the state budget was less?
People are paying too much in Taxes. This is money that could go to raising another child, that gets to go to the state instead.
What are those ‘good reasons’?
I am not telling you how to live your life. Contraception is legal & its a free country. However, as a Catholic, part of the spiritual works of mercy are to counsel the ignorant & admoish sinners. I am not judging the soul of people who use birth control, but I am bound by my faith to point out that it is sinful & not in accordance with God’s law. I’m sure as a reasonable conservative/Christian, you would agree that we all must judge BEHAVIORS and not SOULS. Judging souls, obviously, is for God alone to do.
That being said, there is much wisdom in the Church’s teachings regarding the contraceptive mentality & its inherent evil. I just wish you would take the time to read that information.
As far as statistics to validate what I said, the Guttmacher institute has compiled lots of data over the years regarding the use of various types of birth control among women seeking abortions. Earlier this year, they released a report that upwards of 50% of abortions are done on women who were contracepting when they got pregnant. Furthermore, this article
http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_contr_use.html
shows that the ovewhelming majority of American women in their childbearing years are using birth control. Assuming that those stats are true, how do you explain the high rate of illegitimate births & the 1.3 million abortions per year other than contraceptive failure. I submit to you that the use of contraceptives is a lie (the sex-with-no-strings lie) and an evil that has contributed to the breakdown of our moral fabric in American society.
I do not think that I am holier-than-thou. I am a sinner in great need of God’s mercy. Beleive me. I just feel strongly that the contraceptive mentality is a lie, an evil, and has brought about a great deal of problems. I do not want to see others go down that road.
Right, which is why the west is fading away because the ‘smart women’ aren’t.
“Treating women like breeding machines is far more harmful to society. It is also reminiscent of the attitude towards women-as-cattle in Islamic countries.”
Which is why the sexual revolution has empowered women. Right?
“After watching and listening to Newt after his conversion to Catholicism, I thought perhaps it was worth a second look. But gauging from some responses on this thread, I’ll stay simply and quite happily unaffiliated.”
This is FYI & may help you understand where the Catholics on this forum are coming from. If it piques your interest, I’d encoulage you to google & read Humane Viate in its entirety.
http://www.goodmorals.org/smith6.htm
bigoted?
exactly what are you referring to that you feel is bigoted?
If you think catholicism is “probably” ok - then I’m not sure what you think is wrong with Rick.
All he did was restate catholic teaching.
No one is forcing you or anyone else into a “catholic mold”
Rather - I am sensing you are bristling at one particular teaching, and have, yourself, decided to throw flames at a practicing catholic over it.
The problem with your reasoning is that you have inferred what the reason is for God slaying him, but it’s not specifically stated as you claim.
Genesis 38:10 states, “What he did greatly offended the LORD, and the LORD took his life too.”
Why exactly was The Lord offended? You claim the Bible specifically states the reason God was offended was simply the act of pulling out, so naturally anytime anybody else does the same God will be offended with them as well.
However, you have neglected to consider the whole context of this passage. Onan was only supposed to have sex with Tamar to produce a child in his late brother’s name. He was only to treat her as wife in order to bring honor to his deceased brother and not just enjoy the act of sex.
Onan’s sin was not fulfilling his family duties and showing great dishonor to his brother by what he did. That is not the case with normal, married couples today. This passage doesn’t say that every other man is forbidden from withdrawing from his wife or that every act of sex must be specifically done in an attempt to procreate.
When you can find a western society where women are constrained against their will to have children you will have a point.
It is no different than characterizing fatherhood as economic slavery. If that is really how you feel about the subject have youself sterilized so the rest of us don't have to put up with your whining.
I’ve never heard of birth control referred to as Onanism (though that may be a Catholic thing), but I’ve seen some early 20C books that refer to masturbation that way.
However, by your logic, Uriah’s refusal to go “down to his house” in 2 Samuel 11 should also be grounds for death, since he had an opportunity to sleep with his wife (and thus potentially create a child) but did not take it. Furthermore, under Mosaic law Onan was specifically commanded to marry his brother’s widow to carry on the family name. There is no indication in the text that the specific law he broke was or is intended to apply to all people, let alone that it is some pronouncement on birth control.
If you’re referring to the “Wisdom of Solomon,” King Solomon didn’t write it. It’s a Greek text from the 1st century BC.
But this is the politics forum, so further discussion of the Canon would be best suited for the Religion forum.
Onanism is usually defined as the improper use of the sexual faculties; that is, for sexual pleasure without being open to the possibility of life.
One thing a person can always count on with any message board is being slammed and accused of all manner of evil for daring to have an opinion that differs from the majority.
Will that make me shut up and be *good* ?
Nope.
Go back and read the quote I referenced in post 32...
It doesn’t matter how “Onanism” is “usually defined”. What matters is the context of the Biblical passage where the sin of Onan is discussed.
As previously mentioned, the context of Genesis 38 is that Onan failed to honor his family duties by providing offspring for his deceased brother. That passage doesn’t provide a blanket condemnation of withdrawing during sex.
You aren't being slammed for disagreement, you are being slammed for making an infantile argument.
A good argument would be: Birth control allows more women to enter the workforce. A bad argument would be: Women bearing more children makes them little better than cattle.
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