Posted on 12/07/2011 8:31:33 AM PST by Smokeyblue
The Arizona 2012 Project hosted special guests during its Monday evening meeting, which drew attendees from across the state.
Chairman Ron Ludders introduced constitutional Attorney Van Irion of the Liberty Legal Foundation (LLF) and Republican presidential candidate John Dummett (pronounced Dumay), the lead plaintiff in a class action complaint filed against the National Democratic Party, challenging president Barack Obama’s eligibility.
SNIP
Arpaio said the investigation was progressing and stated, “I’ve got a gut feeling there’s a little cover-up … We’re not out to hang anybody. I’m just doing my job.”
Noting MCSO may be the only law enforcement agency in the country looking into the issue Arpaio said even the Republicans don’t like what he’s doing.
He asked, “Why wouldn’t they want to get to the bottom of this?”
While he’s doing the investigation at the behest of the people of Maricopa County, Arpaio said, “If it affects the whole nation, that’s not my fault. I think people deserve to know the real story. Maybe there’s nothing to it. But, I don’t know. It doesn’t look good.”
SNIP
Questioning why Congress wasn’t looking into the issue, he asked, “Who are you going to bring in, the FBI, the justice department? (met with laughter) I just want to get to the bottom of this to get the truth out.”
He stated what the posse was doing was interesting and said, “My guys are pretty good. Forget the birth certificate. We’re looking at other things. We’re going to do something – I promise you.”
Alluding Obama could conceivably be an illegal alien, which he said was “not that far off,” Arpaio chided the mainstream media for ignoring the issue and said, “I know what I’ll do; I’ll get on Twitter tomorrow and Facebook.”
(Excerpt) Read more at examiner.com ...
“It replaces his natural born status.”
No it doesn’t. The only way a person can lose citizenship once a natural born citizen is to renounce it himself.
We have dictionaries this time frame.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/backroom/2512143/posts?q=1&;page=251
Links to a few dictionaries published in the 18th Century, located by rxsid.
The link to samuel johnson is located in the link. We have links to Etymology dictionaries and lots lots more.
obumpa
The same applies to a born Brit.
Obama, today, has status as a British subject.
A situation that mimics that of the PM of Thailand.
‘Citizenship’ is not the issue. ‘natural born Citizenship’ is. A dual citizen AT and FROM birth can not be a natural born Citizen.
When did Obama ever fill out British form RN? Forget the (fraudulent) COLB or the LFBC. Where is RN?
“A dual citizen AT and FROM birth can not be a natural born Citizen.”
Sure they can. We don’t care who else issues a citizenship. A person is natural born if they don’t need ot take any additional action to have been born a US citizen. The other defeinitions are simply Internet conspiracy kooks that don’t know the law.
According to your theory, all China would have to do is issue citizenship to every American born and then no one can be President.
“According to your theory, all China would have to do is issue citizenship to every American born and then no one can be President.”
Only if the US recognized the citizenship - which it obviously does not.
Obama’s legal documented (regardless of actual) father at birth was a British subject.
Like the PM of Thailand - he is a dual citizen to this day.
Not exactly the intent of the founders.
My sister was born in England and her father was a military serviceman. She holds US recognized dual citizenship. She is also a natural born citizen, by law and by the First Congress’s definition, regardless of the fact that England grants her citizenship.
The fact that you had to say ‘by law’ nullifies the natural part of natural born.
By the immigration act passed by the first Congress a child born to US citizens overseas ‘was considered’ a ‘natural born Citizen’ (note that the wording, capitalization exactly matched Article II, Section 1. No hyphen, capital C). So the intent of that act was just as you describe to grant, via law, natural born status to those born overseas to citizen parents (note that is it is plural).
Unfortunately for your sister, assuming she has plans to make a run on the US Presidency, the next version of the immigration dropped that passage. And thus, there is no law and has not been for 200 years that declares a person born to US Citizens (such as John McCain) a natural born Citizen according to Article II, Section 1.
Notice that the law even acknowleges that a person born overseas to US Citizens is not a natural born Citizen. The law made them legally equal with declearing them an actual natural born Citizen. Those in the category were CONSIDERED AS. This is because natural born Citizen is not a legal construct. It is a construct that is considered part of natural law and beyond the controls of ordinary man-made law. So the founders never attempted to define something they considered a non-legal issue. And when they knew they wanted sons borh overseas eligible for the Presidency they did make make a law to have them CONSIDERED AS natural born Citizens - because they knew - they were not.
But then they removed the passage. Likely because they realized the had illegally attempted to alter the base Constitution in a non-Constitutional manner.
Regardless of what the philosophical discussion were of the day.
Title 18 Section 1401 gives legal meaning to the Constitution’s words. It clarifies what the Congress considers natural born. You can try to claim the law violates the Constitution but the courts have repeatedly skirted the issue and have allowed the law to stand.
Unless you get that law overturned, all arguments to the contrary are moot points.
I believe Zero was not born here, and if he was, his mother had spent too much time overseas and not enough time here to qualify to give birth to a US citizen. I am foggy on this law but I believe she had been out of the country for 5 years, and as a 19 year old, needed to be here at least 1 full year before any offspring could be given a US birth certificate.
That is an argument you might just win.
I also believe he has applied for student program, grants, admissions, etc., as a foreign person and has used multiple social security numbers, which gives me cause for believing he does not even have a birth certificate to show.
Just throwing this out there:
Ever wonder why the new BO "coffee mug" has "Made in the USA" on it and NOT "BORN in the USA"?
:)
Do you have an image to post? That would be awesome!
Made in USA from imported parts.
Must comply with the law: http://business.ftc.gov/documents/bus03-complying-made-usa-standard
Why, indeed?
Why, indeed?
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Ask this question.
Who, within the standard establishment - Congress, Administration, SCOTUS, Either major political party, judges, state officials, etc. - wins if the they to the bottom and the bottom is a ugly as it probably is?
The answer - no one.
So if the truth does not help anyone win something of value the establishment does not care. It is sort of a Mutually Assured Destruction issue for the entire inside establishment.
Title 18 (sio) Section 1401 gives legal meaning to the Constitution’s words. It clarifies what the Congress considers natural born. You can try to claim the law violates the Constitution but the courts have repeatedly skirted the issue and have allowed the law to stand.
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I believe it is Title 8 (vs. 18).
According this Cornell listing it says nothing about natural born.
It does say ‘at birth’ but citizen at birth and natural born Citizen are not the same thing.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/8/1401.html
But apparently inserting ‘natural born’ anywhere for ‘at birth’ is common.
As in here:
http://www.worldandi.com/subscribers/feature_detail.asp?num=26823
The original immigration act gave is insight as to the exact meaning and intent of the founders.
I have no idea as to the facts and do not pretend to at this point. The only thing for certain is the that the story as portrayed is not reality. Beyond that anything and most things are possible.
lol! That’s funny! I can imagine all kinds of other mugs: “Made, but not BORN, in the USA!”
There simply isn’t three levels of citizenship as you describe: Natural, native, and naturalized. There are only two, natural and naturalized. The founding fathers weren’t trying to get into a semantics game when they stated ‘natural born’. They knew what the words ‘natural’ and ‘born’ meant and they used them as they understood them. Those words have the same meaning today.
Title 18 Section 1401 gives legal meaning to the Constitution’s words. It clarifies what the Congress considers natural born.
People given citizenship by statute are naturalized. The children mentioned in Title 8 Section 1401 are naturalized at birth. The law makes no mention of "natural born" anything. If a law could make someone a natural born Citizen, then congress could pass a law declaring the Governator to be a nbC, and our next Pres could be Arnie.
I believe Zero was not born here, and if he was, his mother had spent too much time overseas and not enough time here to qualify to give birth to a US citizen. I am foggy on this law but I believe she had been out of the country for 5 years, and as a 19 year old, needed to be here at least 1 full year before any offspring could be given a US birth certificate.
At the time he was born, SAD had spent very little, if any, time outside the U.S. The law you are referring to said something like the parent must have spent so many years in the U.S., five of which must have been after the fourteenth birthday (i.e. at least 19 years old). SAD was allegedly 18 at the time. However, that law only applied to a birth on foreign soil. So if he was born in Hawai'i, then he would be a citizen. But if he was born in Canada, Kenya, or Antarctica, he would not have been a citizen at all.
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