Posted on 02/01/2011 11:35:48 AM PST by jdoug666
The birthers have a plan to end Barack Obama's presidency—and in Arizona, they're making progress.
(Excerpt) Read more at motherjones.com ...
You are so right. A little known fact about Chauncy the Gardiner (for those who’ve only seen the movie) is that in the book, when he said he ‘liked to watch’, it was a man, not a woman, who put on the show. Could it be any more appropriate? This is a very sick man in the white hut, and the sooner he can be removed the better.
Another thing you’re right about is the father issue. If his father turns out to be American, one might think his problems would be solved. But when his followers realize the degree to which they’ve been deceived, Soetoro will be ruined.
I do think that’s the most likely scenario. For Fukino to elevate herself to judge and Constitutional scholar and pronounce him ‘natural born’ indicates to me she’s well aware Obama Sr isn’t the dad. Just a personal theory, fwiw.
The letter in the centennial magazine didn't give Kapiolani permission for it to be published. If Obama gave permission to publish the letter, that is equivalent to giving permission to confirm the event. The Octomom situation, as I'm sure you're aware, would not be comparable to a PUBLIC confirmation of an event that acording to you was confirmed in a letter they published anyway. No Hawaiian state regulators would go after Kapiolani for a HIPAA violation. Sorry, this is yet another stupid excuse to justify hiding something that doesn't have to be hidden.
The letter in the centennial magazine didn’t give Kapiolani permission for it to be published. If Obama gave permission to publish the letter, that is equivalent to giving permission to confirm the event. The Octomom situation, as I’m sure you’re aware, would not be comparable to a PUBLIC confirmation of an event that acording to you was confirmed in a letter they published anyway. No Hawaiian state regulators would go after Kapiolani for a HIPAA violation. Sorry, this is yet another stupid excuse to justify hiding something that doesn’t have to be hidden.
I really don’t think that we’re dealing with rocket science here.
Kapi’olani was using its 100 Anniversary celebration for fundraising purposes. As a part of that effort they wanted to publicize their facility as the birthplace of some famous Hawai’ians. One of those famous Hawai’ians just happened to be the 44th President of the United States. They asked Obama if he would mind writing a letter congratulating the hospital on its 100th anniversary, and oh, by the way, could you please mention that you were born here? Obama said “sure.”
Some underling in Press Secretary Robert Gibbs’ office was tasked with drafting a letter. Gibbs approved it, Obama approved it and it was sent to Kapi’olani’s fundraising foundation for publication.
End of story.
Absolutely, and if that’s the case, we need to know. History needs to know.
Can you provide an authoritative citation (meaning from Obama directly or someone in the WH under Obama) that any of that is factual, in contrast to wishful speculation? The story that has been on FR and in the MSM to date that I recollect is that Abercrombie read what he claimed to be a letter that he received from Obama claiming to have been born at Kap'oliani. That is substantially different (in terms of legal evidence) from your story. How does anyone know that someone did not pull a political prank on Abercrombie, Kap'oliani, Obama, and the general public by manufacturing the letter that Abercrombie claims to have received? Recall that at least two details do not match: as of now, I (for one) have not ever heard it reported in the MSM that Obama, Gibbs, or anyone else in the WH went on record that the letter was actually from Obama. I believe Gibbs once dismissed a question about it from a reporter without bothering to answer the question. Secondly, the words that Abercrombie read from his copy of the letter did not match the words of the letter as later received from Abercrombie by Kapi'oliani. These two details IMHO collectively or individually do not lend an air of authenticity to the letter itself.
Some underling in Press Secretary Robert Gibbs’ office was tasked with drafting a letter. Gibbs approved it, Obama approved it and it was sent to Kapi’olani’s fundraising foundation for publication.
Again, can you please come up with an authoritative citation from the WH for any of this. In the WND, IIRC, Kapi’olani personnel denied receiving any letter directly from Obama, and told reporters that they received the letter from Abercrombie. Before anyone bashes the WND, they were apparently the only media willing to go to the extent of legwork needed to obtain such answers from Kapi'oliani. They quoted specific Kapi'oliani spokespeople and got a photo of the letter from them. Because it was reported that they got the letter from Abercrombie, not Obama, it provides Obama plausible deniability in a legal sense if it ever were to be discovered that Obama was in fact born somewhere else.
It is strange that Obama did not send the letter directly to Kapi'oliani if he ever sent any letter at all to anyone, it was through an intermediary. Being hearsay, the communication actually used by Obama in fact (if the version I gave of events is correct) provides Obama with legal deniability if he were ever to encounter a formal legal situation in which fraud or other wrongdoing were alleged.
I am not suggesting you are definitely wrong, but only that the version of events that you are describing seems to be at considerable variance with the version of events that has actually been reported, unchallenged, since late summer of 2009 IIRC on FR and elsewhere. So it would help if you could provide a link to an authoritative source to verify your statements.
Can you provide an authoritative citation (meaning from Obama directly or someone in the WH under Obama) that any of that is factual, in contrast to wishful speculation? The story that has been on FR and in the MSM to date that I recollect is that Abercrombie read what he claimed to be a letter that he received from Obama claiming to have been born at Kap’oliani. That is substantially different (in terms of legal evidence) from your story. How does anyone know that someone did not pull a political prank on Abercrombie, Kap’oliani, Obama, and the general public by manufacturing the letter that Abercrombie claims to have received? Recall that at least two details do not match: as of now, I (for one) have not ever heard it reported in the MSM that Obama, Gibbs, or anyone else in the WH went on record that the letter was actually from Obama. I believe Gibbs once dismissed a question about it from a reporter without bothering to answer the question. Secondly, the words that Abercrombie read from his copy of the letter did not match the words of the letter as later received from Abercrombie by Kapi’oliani. These two details IMHO collectively or individually do not lend an air of authenticity to the letter itself.
Again, can you please come up with an authoritative citation from the WH for any of this. In the WND, IIRC, Kapi’olani personnel denied receiving any letter directly from Obama, and told reporters that they received the letter from Abercrombie. Before anyone bashes the WND, they were apparently the only media willing to go to the extent of legwork needed to obtain such answers from Kapi’oliani. They quoted specific Kapi’oliani spokespeople and got a photo of the letter from them. Because it was reported that they got the letter from Abercrombie, not Obama, it provides Obama plausible deniability in a legal sense if it ever were to be discovered that Obama was in fact born somewhere else.
It is strange that Obama did not send the letter directly to Kapi’oliani if he ever sent any letter at all to anyone, it was through an intermediary. Being hearsay, the communication actually used by Obama in fact (if the version I gave of events is correct) provides Obama with legal deniability if he were ever to encounter a formal legal situation in which fraud or other wrongdoing were alleged.
I am not suggesting you are definitely wrong, but only that the version of events that you are describing seems to be at considerable variance with the version of events that has actually been reported, unchallenged, since late summer of 2009 IIRC on FR and elsewhere. So it would help if you could provide a link to an authoritative source to verify your statements.
However the letter itself is in the Kapiolani Centennial Magazine.
http://www.kapiolanigift.org/doc/centennial-magazine.pdf
The key quote is on page one in the right hand column and the full letter is on page six.
Here’s a link to an article published a few days after the 2008 election and a year before the letter to Kapiolani from Obama which discusses Kapiolani and the HIPAA law.
“Obama Boyhood Homes Drawing Gawkers:”
http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2008/Nov/09/ln/hawaii811090361.html
What YOU don't understand is that sending a letter to a hospital doesn't give them the right to publish it, especially if it contains so-called private medical information.
What YOU don’t understand is that sending a letter to a hospital doesn’t give them the right to publish it, especially if it contains so-called private medical information.
You're supporting my argument. Thanks. I said nothing would happen if Kapiolani officially confirmed Obama was born there. The magazine is equivalent to a HIPAA violation because there's no proof it was printed with permission. At best, Kapiolani has plausible deniability because they can say it wasn't them making the claim, but unless they have specific permission to publish the letter (which has never been shown) it would still be a HIPAA violation.
You’re supporting my argument. Thanks. I said nothing would happen if Kapiolani officially confirmed Obama was born there. The magazine is equivalent to a HIPAA violation because there’s no proof it was printed with permission. At best, Kapiolani has plausible deniability because they can say it wasn’t them making the claim, but unless they have specific permission to publish the letter (which has never been shown) it would still be a HIPAA violation.
They have to have permission to publish such a letter. There's no evidence he gave such permission. Short of that, this would still be a HIPAA violation.
The letter is a red herring. The white hut refuses even to confirm that Barry Soetoro/Obama sent it.
They have to have permission to publish such a letter. There’s no evidence he gave such permission. Short of that, this would still be a HIPAA violation.
Do you think that the Obama Administration’s Justice Department and the Abercrombie Administration’s Attorney General’s office will get right on filing suit against Kapi’olani for publishing a letter from the President of the United States congratulating the hospital on its 100 year anniversary?
What part of "There's no evidence he gave permission" did you not understand??
Do you think that the Obama Administration’s Justice Department and the Abercrombie Administration’s Attorney General’s office will get right on filing suit against Kapi’olani for publishing a letter from the President of the United States congratulating the hospital on its 100 year anniversary?
No, for the same reason no one will cite Kapiolani Hospital for HIPAA violations if they gave an officially documented confirmation that Obama was actually born in the hospital and who the doctor was.
What part of “There’s no evidence he gave permission” did you not understand??
Kapiolani will say: “We can’t devulge the name of the physician, HIPAA laws prevent us from releasing private medical information without the patient’s consent.”
Actually, it was reported that Obama sent the letter to Abercrombie, not to the hospital directly.
If this is true, then the hospital is relieved of any obligation to maintain the privacy of Obama, because from the standpoint of the hospital, the letter is an artifact that the hospital received from Abercrombie. The hospital can publish anything from Abercrombie it likes. Whether the letter is factual or not has not been established. From a legal perspective it is a letter given to the hospital from Abercrombie about Obama. No one except Abercrombie knows where it came from. It could have come from Obama, but that is not established in the public record. It could have come from a dirty tricks operative of the Republican Party, but that is not established in the public record. It is certainly to the hospital fund’s short term fundraising advantage to publish the letter. Therefore if they give their word that the letter is authentic or was confirmed by Obama or the WH to them directly, it is not necessarily trustworthy, since the hospital fund has a motive to lie.
Also, there may be legal distinction between the hospital and the hospital fund. Those two entities have two different web sites. If the hospital fund is a separate charitable fundraising organization, then it is not bound by HIPAA laws at all.
Note that if the letter was not provably from Obama, then Obama has effectively insulated himself legally from the contents of the letter, which may conceivably be proven false in the future.
‘If anyone should ever raise the issue of permission (two years after the fact), the President will simply say, “yes, I gave Kapiolani Medical Center (the place of my birth) permission to reprint a letter from me.”’
What a flat out lie. The White House has been asked repeatedly to confirm that Obama sent this letter, and they have declined each and every time. Gibbs was asked straight up, politely, if Obama sent it. If you were right, he would simply have said, ‘Of course he did; next question’.
But Gibbs did no such thing. Instead, he ridiculed the questioner and refused to answer. Still, in your make-believe fantasy world, Obama would be proud to say he wrote the letter. He’s just too arrogant, smarmy, deceptive and coy to allow his spokespeople to say it for him, right?
Wrong. He’s had ample opportunity to claim authorship of that letter, and the only thing that’s happened is that his close associates have refused to validate it, and the hospital no longer displays it or uses it for fund-raising.
Look what you’ve been reduced to. You pretend you have a crystal ball, and you can see into the future. You alone can channel the spirit of your hero, Obama, and find out how he would answer a question he’s never been asked. [He assiduously avoids venues where he might be asked ‘hard’ questions.] Yet his spokesman HAS been asked, and his answer in no way resembles your fanny kissing Obama fantasy.
(And notice how, btw, in your weird, surreal cloud cuckoo land Obama actually gives a straight answer [did your leg tingle much, I wonder, when you created Obama’s rather manful (and totally out of character) response from the whole-cloth of your fondest daydreams?] and resolves at least one issue. In reality he’s a slippery, slimy, lying, conniving, cheating AA shyster who never speaks plainly or resolves anything. He’s a fraud. He sells snake oil, and gullible, mindless liberals buy it.)
This is just pathetic. You can’t argue on the basis of anything Obama has actually said or done, or even on the basis of what his minions have said or done. You stake your entire argument on what would happen in the lala fantasy world of your make-believe alternate universe.
Rather than go to such ridiculous extremes, why don’t you just admit you’re only here to pimp Obama? What have you EVER said that is pro-conservative? When have you *ever* criticized Obama in the slightest way? All you do is stick up for your crush, Obama. Since that is not the purpose of FR, why do you keep doing it? Why not, instead, ping the mods and turn yourself in? Confess you’re a troll and request a zot. I’m sure it can be arranged. You’ll feel better about yourself and your integrity—and Kos will welcome you home with open arms.
OR, you could come over to the right side. It wouldn’t be hard at all. Just say, ‘Look, he’s a jerk and I’m tired of defending him. He ought to make himself available for questions from more people—including conservatives and tea partiers; he ought to give straight, non-evasive answers, and he needs to stop treating with contempt and disdain American citizens who have honest questions, and who make reasonable requests to see basic documentation. He’s a public servant, not a king, and he ought to start showing a modicum of respect and appreciation to the people who pay his salary and finance his lavish lifestyle’.
We would be very happy to welcome you as a brand new fellow-conservative, that’s for sure.
Actually, it was reported that Obama sent the letter to Abercrombie, not to the hospital directly.
If this is true, then the hospital is relieved of any obligation to maintain the privacy of Obama, because from the standpoint of the hospital, the letter is an artifact that the hospital received from Abercrombie. The hospital can publish anything from Abercrombie it likes. Whether the letter is factual or not has not been established. From a legal perspective it is a letter given to the hospital from Abercrombie about Obama. No one except Abercrombie knows where it came from. It could have come from Obama, but that is not established in the public record. It could have come from a dirty tricks operative of the Republican Party, but that is not established in the public record. It is certainly to the hospital fund’s short term fundraising advantage to publish the letter. Therefore if they give their word that the letter is authentic or was confirmed by Obama or the WH to them directly, it is not necessarily trustworthy, since the hospital fund has a motive to lie.
Also, there may be legal distinction between the hospital and the hospital fund. Those two entities have two different web sites. If the hospital fund is a separate charitable fundraising organization, then it is not bound by HIPAA laws at all.
Note that if the letter was not provably from Obama, then Obama has effectively insulated himself legally from the contents of the letter, which may conceivably be proven false in the future.
“Dear Friends,
I am writing....”
Signed Barack Obama
that question is mean ....really mean
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