Posted on 04/07/2010 5:41:52 PM PDT by PaulZe
I have been engaged in an ongoing debate with a liberal friend of mine ever since Obama became president. The current thread is on health care, specifically my questioning the legitimacy of the Federal Government forcing every American to buy health insurance. Below is a copy of her last email to me commenting my my previous email to her. I have noted who's comments are who's.
Her:
Anyway, we're forced into buying auto insurance, if you want to drive. And for most people driving is a necessity. Before you can buy a house, you have to have proof of insurance (this is to protect the bank, not you
Me:
You finally took the bait. This is another example of the illogical logic of liberalism. Your analogy is wrong on many levels.
1. I am not forced to buy a car nor am I forced to buy a house.
Her:
Bait?! ROFL! Yes you are forced to pay for the insurance. Let's say you rent. Who owns the building? THEY are the ones forced to buy insurance. Don't buy a car? Fine! Ride the bus. Think they aren't forced to buy insurance? They are, and the cost of those insurance policies gets passed on to YOU.
Me:
2. The state in which I lives sets the laws that I must abide by to drive on public roads (that rascally 10th amendment again) I have to have a valid driver's license issued by the state in which I live and many states (not all) requires car insurance.
Her:
Remember "55 to stay alive"? That was a country wide, government mandate. Ditto seat belt laws. And find me a state that doesn't require auto insurance.
Me:
In regard to a house that's part of the agreement with the lending co.
Her:
Oh if you live in a coastal or flood area, you're FORCED to buy flood insurance via FEMA. I'm not in either place but I choose to carry flood insurance. Interestingly, although it's through Hartford Flood Insurance, I still am contacted by FEMA to register it.
Me:
The Fed government has little if anything to do with either apart from interstate commerce issues,
Her:
FEMA is part of the Fed government
Me:
The fed gov has more important responsibilities like protecting us from enemies foreign and domestic to be concerned about all of us having health insurance
Her:
Spoken like someone who's been fairly healthy all their life.
You don’t need friends like her. Trade her in for a better friend.
Quit arguing with her and kick her to the curb. You can’t argue with idiots.
I’m having trouble too. My problem is that RomneyCare mandated buying insurance, and the Heritage Foundation (the dopes!!!) justified it! I thought my liberal “buddy” was making it up but then she gave me a link: http://www.heritage.org/Research/Reports/2006/04/Understanding-Key-Parts-of-the-Massachusetts-Health-Plan
Stupid Mitt-iot... and I’m disappointed in Heritage.
Problem is, I stop debating her, she’ll crow to all her friends that she’s won and that I ran away... I never run away from a debate! Can you guys help?
Ask her if two wrongs make a right, and wouldn’t we be better off if each state could design its own health care system for its own particular problems—diversity!
Don’t have to have car insurance if the car is paid for and you only drive it on your private property.
Best thing I was ever told was only a fool arues with a idiot. Enough said.
Throw her away. You don't need a lifetime of grief.
As she has already submitted herself to govt health authority, her opinion on the issue is no longer relevant. She is effectively a subject of the state.
The lib is an imbecile.
Now there are 2 kinds of libtards: one which you can “discreetly’ educate and then there are the ..nimrods.
I’ve had liberal EX friends who think Bush is pure evil. When I said “if Bush went to war, he needed Congressional approval and the Dem-majority voted for it, so how exactly did Bush do this illegal war?” No one has come up with the answer except ‘F888 Bush”.
That’s their “logical” answer.
i guess im a fool...smile
Yeah, I tried that one, and she dug up a law from 1792, the Militia Act.
http://www.law.ucla.edu/volokh/2amteach/SOURCES.HTM#TOC33
This one had the government mandating all men to buy a gun and ammunition.
Anyone got an answer for that? She is a tricky one... I want to just write her off but my pride won’t let me! Guess this is what I get for debating a lawyer!
You've already noted that home insurance is requiremed by the mortgage company (who loaned you the money), not the federal government.
Flood insurance is similar: they can't loan you the money for a property in a flood zone unless you have flood insurance. In this case the "can't" is correct: a federally-regulated institution has to require the insurance. In this case, this is federal regulation of a bank, which insures depositors against failure.
All of the other examples are state-mandated -- not federally mandated. There's a big difference.
Finally, the federal "mandates" for the 55 speed limit and seat belt laws (as well as the age limit for purchasing alcohol) were all imposed the same way: Change your laws, or we will withhold your share of federal gas tax funds that we collected. A state could refuse those funds, on principle... but none did.
.
Does she really believe that previous incremental assaults on Lady Liberty make her full on rape Constitutional?
You aren’t kidding. HF was a dope...
Your argument - RomneyCare is busting the state. So anyone - ANYONE - who thought this was a good idea was dead wrong.
Ask her if it would be OK if you stuck a knife in her ribs to extort money from her for your medical expenses.
If she says “No”, ask her why it’s OK for the government to do it.
RomneyCare is a state mandate. Massachusetts decided to impose it, and unless their state constitution prohibits it, it's within the powers of the state.
It's not the same as a federal mandate. There are US Constitutional issues in play.
There's a Constitutional basis for that: the 2nd Amendment.
Another question: Why does Congress have different retirement and healthcare plans from the rest of the populace? Hmmmm...?
Liberals are just stupid. You can’t argue logically with someone that’s just plain stupid as most libs are.
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