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The Unknown War: The defeat of communism 20 years ago was the most liberating moment in history...
Reason ^ | November 2009 | Matt Welch

Posted on 10/17/2009 1:58:43 PM PDT by neverdem

The defeat of communism 20 years ago was the most liberating moment in history. So why don't we talk about it more?

On August 23, 1989, officials from the newly reformed and soon-to-be-renamed Communist Party of Hungary ceased policing the country's militarized border with Austria. Some 13,000 East Germans, many of whom had been vacationing at nearby Lake Balaton, fled across the frontier to the free world. It was the largest breach of the Iron Curtain in a generation, and it kicked off a remarkable chain of events that ended 11 weeks later with the righteous citizen dismantling of the Berlin Wall...

(Excerpt) Read more at reason.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Editorial; Foreign Affairs; Germany; Politics/Elections; Russia
KEYWORDS: anniversary; berlinwall; coldwar; communism; eastgermany; reaganlegacy; ussr
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To: Jacquerie
OK, I've read your profile, you seem like an intelligent
Conservative person, what is it about communism you don't
understand? What makes you think Communism was defeated?
What snarky comments are you referring to?
41 posted on 10/17/2009 10:00:21 PM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: tet68

And what makes you think those millions will still
remain free once the US is converted to a socialist
system?


42 posted on 10/17/2009 10:03:33 PM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: Parley Baer
....but no Nobel Peace Prize to the most deserving soul.

I would not want the memory of my beloved President Reagan sullied with that bogus award!
43 posted on 10/18/2009 2:48:42 AM PDT by GodBlessRonaldReagan (Refugee from the World of Doomed Olsens)
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To: tet68; VR-21
There's an entire tribe of clowns at FR who race to post their inane comments before reading the material.

Had you two taken the time to read and comprehend, you may have noticed that the column deals with liberation, rejection of communism in eastern Europe and how the momentous events are ignored in the country largely responsible for liberation.

Oh, and the article closes with comments regarding the fight for economic freedom and capitalism is no longer lead by the United States in the form of President Obama.

Lead by the United States, the West cut off the head of world communism. Communism is no longer exported as a matter of policy by the world's second most powerful country.

Your earlier comment insulted the memory of a Nation which gave hundreds of billions in treasure and tens of thousands of lives to fight and defeat Soviet barbarism.

What is it about our great victory over world communism 20 years ago you don't understand?

44 posted on 10/18/2009 3:29:46 AM PDT by Jacquerie (Understand Natural Law and understand our Declaration of Independence & Constitution.)
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To: Jacquerie

Great victory? Don’t make me laugh, it makes me
hurt too much. For some reason you refuse to
admit that our own government has been infiltrated
by communists, our communities by socialist organizations.
I honor all those who have sacrificed in the struggle to
overcome that evil ideology but make no mistake,
that struggle is not over!


45 posted on 10/18/2009 3:42:01 AM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: SWAMPSNIPER

GOOD STICKER!!!!!


46 posted on 10/18/2009 4:59:13 AM PDT by RoadTest ( But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do)
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To: Jacquerie

“your country is responsible for the liberation of millions.”

Not really. What you saw as liberation is the first step in the enslavement of the world. Can’t you see the signs? Obama dismantling freedom and prosperity brick by brick, selling us on the world market; KGB-inspired slogans being chanted at Sheriff Arpeo?

Open your eyes! It’s happening all around you.


47 posted on 10/18/2009 5:06:27 AM PDT by RoadTest ( But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do)
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To: VR-21

“There’s even been one (so far) self-proclaimed communist found serving in the current executive branch of our own government.”

Self proclaimed. Yes. What does proclamation have to do with anything? The whole federal government is Marxist-Leninist now. The rest of them are just covering their perfidy with euphemisms like “Progressive”.

The important thing is that the tenets and goals of Lenin are being enacted here in America the beautiful, right now, in its government in Washington, DC .


48 posted on 10/18/2009 5:12:13 AM PDT by RoadTest ( But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do)
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To: neverdem

What defeat of communism?


49 posted on 10/18/2009 5:12:56 AM PDT by Altura Ct.
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To: Anti-Bubba182
there is no paid up dues card for freedom.

Great post, but who will tell the children?

50 posted on 10/18/2009 5:26:27 AM PDT by 1010RD (First Do No Harm)
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To: aquila48

Whatever it will be (communism or socialism), you can bet they won’t use that term. Until, of course, the whole populace is sufficiently indoctrinated.


51 posted on 10/18/2009 6:03:58 AM PDT by rbg81 (DRAIN THE SWAMP!!)
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To: neverdem
IMHO, I don't think the money hungry Chicoms will do anything to devalue their investments in the U.S. How is that in their interest?

It will no doubt hurt the Chinese economy but it will absolutely destroy ours and, with the U.S. out of the way, they will be able to dominate entire continents without having to play nice to do it.

It really depends if the Chinese are "new communists" who want to be government-controlled capitalists or if they are just posing for global acceptance and will return to their "old communist" ways (like North Korea) just as soon as they've cornered our capitalist markets.

Remember the old communist style sheds no tear for starving and killing their own people, forcing them to live minimalist lives while surrendering all control to the party and the state. It will only take one dictator to return China to those days.

And if you listen closely to American environmentalists, how different are their demands from the ones of the old-style communists? Not much as far as I can see. They want government squelching our freedoms and controlling our thoughts.

52 posted on 10/18/2009 6:35:28 AM PDT by OrangeHoof ("Barack Obama" is Swahili for "Bend over suckahs".)
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To: fidelis
I think this nails it. Communism (as a global, militaristic and agressively nationalistic force) WAS defeated — trounced, in fact. The West did the same thing to Islam in the First Crusade. But, just like the First Crusade, after victory, instead of going for the jugular the West just lost interest and went about it’s self indulgent way and allowed it’s enemies to transmogrify and grow. Just like we have seen the emergence of a resurgent Islam, Communism survived, bided it’s time and found other ways to plot their revenge and our demise. All that time and all that effort and all that money and all those lives — wasted. What our enemies could not defeat from without, they have patiently watched rot and have infiltrated from within.

BINGO.

53 posted on 10/18/2009 6:37:53 AM PDT by OrangeHoof ("Barack Obama" is Swahili for "Bend over suckahs".)
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To: neverdem

We made a mistake in assuming communism had been defeated.


54 posted on 10/18/2009 7:21:14 AM PDT by nonliberal (Graduate: Curtis E. LeMay School of International Relations)
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To: ALOHA RONNIE

((((((Hugs)))))))Bump
Tony Melendez - Never Be The Same
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shK0DZHd81E


55 posted on 10/18/2009 9:16:18 AM PDT by fatima (Free Hugs Today :))
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To: OrangeHoof
It will no doubt hurt the Chinese economy but it will absolutely destroy ours and, with the U.S. out of the way, they will be able to dominate entire continents without having to play nice to do it.

It really depends if the Chinese are "new communists" who want to be government-controlled capitalists or if they are just posing for global acceptance and will return to their "old communist" ways (like North Korea) just as soon as they've cornered our capitalist markets.

Remember the old communist style sheds no tear for starving and killing their own people, forcing them to live minimalist lives while surrendering all control to the party and the state. It will only take one dictator to return China to those days.

The USA has its problems, but I think you greatly underestimate the problems the Chicoms currently have.

Bordering on Danger - A Sino-Indian boundary dispute risks flaring up.

Besides India, the Han Chinese have major problems with the Tibetans and Uighurs as well as recent refugees from Burma.

In their rush to embrace capitalism and industry, the Chicoms have huge problems with air, water and soil pollution.

Corruption is rampant. Lax building code enforcement due to corruption is suspected in their earthquake fatalities. Due to their one child only policy, and their preference for boys, they now have an average of six males for every five females being born for some time now.

As for China's domestic unrest:

China's Public Security Ministry reported 87,000 mass incidents in 2005, up 6.6 per cent over the number in 2004, and 50 per cent over the 2003 figure. The ministry has not released the latest figures.

According to Dr Wang's presentation yesterday, which he said was based on official statistics, there were at least 10,000 mass incidents recorded in 1993. The number ballooned to more than 60,000 in 2005. Two years later, it exceeded 80,000.

And if you listen closely to American environmentalists, how different are their demands from the ones of the old-style communists? Not much as far as I can see.

The progressive left is weaker than ever. With the current economy, their premier issue - global warming/climate change - is dead last out of 20 concerns with respect to issues the voters care about in the USA.

They took Congress in 2006 by moving right on gun control and abortion where needed and promising to be fiscally conservative. They continued that BS in 2008. Now they have lost the moderates and independents that control elections if you check recent public opinion polls. Self identified liberals and progressives are only little more than one fifth of the electorate in the 2006 and 2008 exit polls.

Could a Wave be Building?

As analyst Charles Cook notes, 84 House Democrats represent districts that were carried either by George W. Bush in 2004 or John McCain in 2008, and 48 of those districts were carried by both Bush and McCain.

56 posted on 10/18/2009 1:33:55 PM PDT by neverdem (Xin loi minh oi)
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To: RoadTest
“your country is responsible for the liberation of millions.”

Not really.

Obama regularly minimizes and insults the accomplishments and sacrifices our nation made in the violent course of the 20th century. I never thought I would hear like sentiments from a Freeper. You are a true clown.

57 posted on 10/18/2009 2:03:50 PM PDT by Jacquerie (Understand Natural Law and understand our Declaration of Independence & Constitution.)
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To: tet68

By your “logic” our defeat of, and stupendous victory over Fascism in 1945 was no victory at all. After all, fascism still exists, right? You are a true clown.


58 posted on 10/18/2009 2:06:10 PM PDT by Jacquerie (Understand Natural Law and understand our Declaration of Independence & Constitution.)
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To: Jacquerie

You have totally misunderstand my stand. I respect and admire and pray for our soldiers and I agree with all the Bush did over there.

You’re not reading what I said at all. Don’t do to me as the Liberals are doing to Rush Limbaugh!


59 posted on 10/18/2009 2:50:57 PM PDT by RoadTest ( But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do)
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To: Jacquerie

The defeat of Fascism was a victory but not the victory
it could have been, why did Ike stop at the Elbe?
Why did he let the communists take Berlin? It could
have been a victory for the west but instead it was
a victory for communism, and we paid a stiff price for
that in later years.
I do not understand your personal attacks, I assure
you there is nothing clownish in my study of history.
And I certainly do not denigrate the sacrifice I and
thousands of other Americans have made in fighting for
freedom.


60 posted on 10/18/2009 3:49:51 PM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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