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Wulff wants Bombodrom in Alaska (German Army want to test bombs in Alaska)
Financial Times Germany ^ | 14.07.2009 | FTD

Posted on 07/15/2009 6:54:44 AM PDT by SolidWood

So far the news is only in German language.

To sum it up... because German lefties and enviros succesfully protested a military testing area ("Bombodrom") a center-right German state prime minister (Wulff of Lower Saxonia) suggested testing bombardments and ordninance in Alaska.

Key quote:"It doesn't have to be necessairly in Germany."

This is insane. They can't test for their own military in their own country because of some enviromentalists? Were do they want to maneuver in Alaska? ANWR?

Here an online Translation (probably with several mistranslations):


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Germany; News/Current Events; US: Alaska
KEYWORDS: alaska; germanarmy; germany; military
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The Air Force should practice reinforced at simulators or in population poor regions abroad. Therewith unterstrich the lower saxony Prime Minister Christian Wulff its demand for of a closing of air ground ground shoot place of "north horn ranks" in Lower Saxony. Concretely the Christian Democratic Union politician named the US state Alaska. "The throwing off of bombs must not be practiced" compelling in Germany.

It contradicted therewith its party colleague, Minister of Defense Franz Josef boy. "This load with bomb droppings is not in the thickly populated Germany permanently to take responsibility for". Young had said on the other hand in Berlin on Monday: "The Federal Armed Forces must if it should defend Germany, also can" practice in Germany. After the renunciation of the practice place Wittstock, boy does not want to forgo also yet the locations north horn and victory castle in Bavaria.

Wulff wants to reach first of all a slighter load the "north of horn ranks". "The closing is us most dearly whether that goes short-termed, can doubt one. The least is now that there are binding promises, that it a reduction of the load gives". The persons in the region expected right such a perspective.

According to the defense ministry, already 75 percent of all practices take place abroad. There had been 2007 altogether 1650 uses, in the lower saxony north horn therefrom only 318, in the Bavarian victory castle 95: The practice places would not be replace also by simulation.

1 posted on 07/15/2009 6:54:44 AM PDT by SolidWood
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To: SolidWood

Why not test in Afghanistan?


2 posted on 07/15/2009 7:00:48 AM PDT by silverleaf (Save the earth. It's the only planet with chocolate!)
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To: silverleaf

Here is some news for him - our own environmentalists would raise such a stink and engage in such legal logjams that it would not be possible for them to use a part of Alaska either. Couldn’t happen.


3 posted on 07/15/2009 7:07:07 AM PDT by Wally_Kalbacken
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To: silverleaf

why not France?


4 posted on 07/15/2009 7:13:16 AM PDT by Nihil Obstat (God bless)
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To: SolidWood

You do realize that the German Air Force already has bases in the U.S.? El Paso and New Mexico if recollection serves me right.


5 posted on 07/15/2009 7:16:33 AM PDT by STFrancis
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To: STFrancis

Yes, I know. But I don’t see a reason for them to bomb in Alaska just because they are to wussy to confront their own enviromentalist nuts.


6 posted on 07/15/2009 7:18:04 AM PDT by SolidWood (Sarah Palin: "Only dead fish go with the flow!")
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To: SolidWood

Why not?
I’ve lobbed, launched and thrown hundreds of tons of ordnance all over Grafenwoehr.

Seems only fair.


7 posted on 07/15/2009 7:21:39 AM PDT by SJSAMPLE
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To: STFrancis

There’s one a Dulles Airport in Virginia as well. It’s small, primarily offices and a motorpool. . .but it’s Luftwaffe. . .


8 posted on 07/15/2009 7:26:37 AM PDT by Salgak (Acme Lasers presents: The Energizer Border: I dare you to try and cross it. . .)
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To: SJSAMPLE
Seems only fair.

I don't remember the Germans taking up security duties for the US... we stationed our troops to protect Europe from the Reds and not at least we were there as Victors.

Just because the Germans are groweling before some tree-huggers, they should get to bomb in the US? Doesn't sound appropiate to me.

9 posted on 07/15/2009 7:30:56 AM PDT by SolidWood (Sarah Palin: "Only dead fish go with the flow!")
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To: SolidWood

You seem to forget that they probably ‘pay’ for those services as well as are a member of NATO.

Also, the entire country of Germany is about the size of Florida and has a population of about 1/3 of the United States which means it is VERY heavily populated. There are not a whole lot of areas to practice bombing runs etc..


10 posted on 07/15/2009 7:44:30 AM PDT by STFrancis
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To: SolidWood

German forces are e.g. on guard for several army sites in germany.

Also there’s german troops in afghanistan if you’d like to count that into securtiy duties for the US.

Did you know that the first MIG shot down during irak war 1 was lead by a german airforce officer on board of a NATO AWACS ? He commanded two F104s from the italian airforce to take out the 2 migs heading for the awacs.


11 posted on 07/15/2009 7:50:03 AM PDT by Rummenigge (there are people willing to blow out the light because it casts a shadow)
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To: Rummenigge

I am aware that Germany is doing it’s (albeit comparetively small) share on global security matters... but it’s in little relation to what the US had done and is doing, not only for Germany but all of Europe. There can be hardly a denial that the US is bearing the overwhelming brunt of responsibility, costs and casualites.

And I take issue with the argumentation that because they can’t deal with some aging hippies who foiled their perfectly suited “bombodrome”, they should get US territory. Why don’t they ask other allies like Canada (NATO) with even larger and more remote areas, or Australia? Australia (although non-NATO) especially is suited to test Afghanistan like conditions, unlike freezy Alaska.


12 posted on 07/15/2009 8:02:37 AM PDT by SolidWood (Sarah Palin: "Only dead fish go with the flow!")
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To: SolidWood

We did A LOT of training in Germany, and you can’t say that 100% of that training was a direct benefit to Germany.

Sure, we were there, but the skills we developed there are being used WORLDWIDE.

They’ve been a good ally.
Now, they’re being targeted from within.
I have no problem letting them us US ranges, but I am concerned that it will lessen their will to fight the enemy at home.


13 posted on 07/15/2009 8:06:53 AM PDT by SJSAMPLE
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To: SolidWood

Ah heck, it ain’t as if they hadn’t already tested them nearby - in Poland, Spain, France, Greece, Yugoslvia, Serbia, Russia, ... - before.

Why not do it again over here this time?


14 posted on 07/15/2009 8:47:42 AM PDT by Robert A Cook PE (I can only donate monthly, but socialists' ABBCNNBCBS continue to lie every day!)
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To: SolidWood

The Luftwaffe already conducts training in New Mexico around White Sands, Holloman and Cannon.


15 posted on 07/15/2009 8:50:18 AM PDT by Tijeras_Slim
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To: SolidWood
I started to post the painting Guernica here but looked at it in preview and decided it really wasn't funny at all.

We have ranges they're welcome to use, but there are intelligence difficulties inherent in doing one's weapons development in a foreign country, even a close ally. And it really doesn't address the issue that some of the Greens have, as their acknowledged object, the suppression of all things military on principle. These are not generally all that accepting of the notion that their utopian ideology is going to have to accept some limits, and that "no" is an acceptable answer. And unfortunately the tools of power given to them by a democratic society - laws, courts, protected civil disobedience - become tools of tyranny if there are no limits placed upon them. It is an ancient and foolish notion that if one prevents the preparation for battle that there will be no war. Si vis pacem, para bellum.

16 posted on 07/15/2009 9:16:18 AM PDT by Billthedrill
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To: STFrancis

There is no German base in El Paso.


17 posted on 07/15/2009 9:22:00 AM PDT by csmusaret (If you like this economy, keep voting for Donkeys.)
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To: SolidWood

Let the Germans practice at bomb ranges in the western US. After all, Germany is one of our military dependents.


18 posted on 07/15/2009 9:25:42 AM PDT by Rockingham
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To: Rummenigge

Italy did not deploy any F-104s to the Gulf. They only flew Tornados during the Persian Gulf War.


19 posted on 07/15/2009 9:30:15 AM PDT by MediaMole
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To: SolidWood
I am aware that Germany is doing it’s (albeit comparetively small) share on global security matters... but it’s in little relation to what the US had done and is doing, not only for Germany but all of Europe. There can be hardly a denial that the US is bearing the overwhelming brunt of responsibility, costs and casualites.

During the cold war the Bundeswehr had countless tanks aimed at stopping the Russian invasion of Europe, which became mostly useless after the end of the cold war (many were sold or given as military aid to Poland). Everyone knew the Russian plans, namely that in the event that the cold war got hot, Germany would become a radioactive wasteland and the Bundeswehr cannon fodder. After the German reunification nobody wanted Germany as the foremost military power in Europe and I don't believe anyone wants a militarily assertive Germany today.

And I take issue with the argumentation that because they can’t deal with some aging hippies who foiled their perfectly suited “bombodrome”, they should get US territory.

Nobody is asking for US territory. Alaska was mentioned as an example of a sparsely populated region. In Germany there isn't really a region where you don't have NIMBY problems, because even in - by German standards - rather empty regions, there are always towns and villages nearby and lawsuits due to the noise etc.

In the end it's just a question of money, of working out a deal among friends, just like the problem of ammunitions waste on former US installations in Germany could be worked out. If it makes financial sense to both parties, what's the harm? Then they'll start negotiations and there will be a mutually agreed upon contract. And if it doesn't, they'll find another place. Or not. Or whatever...

This here is much ado about a by-line, which basically states the obvious: that Alaska has a 600 times lower population density than central Europe.

Why don’t they ask other allies like Canada (NATO) with even larger and more remote areas, or Australia? Australia (although non-NATO) especially is suited to test Afghanistan like conditions, unlike freezy Alaska.

Right now they haven't asked anyone, including Alaska. And if they decide to go down that road, they'll probably ask Canada and Greenland as well (Australia is on the opposite side of the world, that's probably a no-go.).
20 posted on 07/15/2009 11:58:15 AM PDT by wolf78 (Inflation is a form of taxation, too. Cranky Libertarian - equal opportunity offender.)
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