Posted on 12/23/2008 10:29:59 AM PST by lewisglad
Tis the season of empty gestures! Inaugural pastor Rick Warren rewrote his website so it no longer says gays are poison to his congregation. In fact a whole long lecture about gays was deleted.
Here's the old content, via AmericaBlog, via Dave Winer, where Warren explains why gays can't join his church:
This was from a website section called "Small Group Questions About Saddleback Church." The above is part of an answer to the question "What does the Bible say about homosexuality?" Also part of the answer, in the original, was a description of homosexuality as "an enormous sin" and a comparison of being gay to being alcoholic.
Another question encouraged people to tithe to the church even while paying off credit card debts. 10 percent! "The Bible is very clear about believers giving the first 10 percent to the Lord."
Now that Warren has become an embarrassment to the president-elect, everything, the whole stupid section, is gone. Trying to visit the page will either get you a database error or redirected here. Because Warren now realizes his gay-bashing is a manifestation of the vile sin of bigotry and intolerance.
Ha ha, just kidding, he's temporarily shunning his true beliefs to be on television in front of the whole world and gain popularity, sort of like an instrument of the devil, or maybe in this case it's God, or just Rahm Emanuel dressed as an angry, demanding, freak-fingered demon, haunting his bedroom.
Yep, this reeks of a hoax.
I agree.
Where, specifically, has he “capitulated”?
Rick Warren: Bringing the Council on Foreign Relations and the New Age into the Christian church.
Yep, this reeks of a hoax.
Knowing the source of the article it is not a hoax, it is a lie.
maybe
maybe not
maybe you should apologize for falsely accusing me...maybe
Jesus WAS SENT HERE to die for our sins. He was a man when he died and lived an amazing fruitful life when he was murdered.
On the other hand, babies are not born to die for our sins and when they are slaughtered before birth, at birth or after surviving an abortion, they have not lived fruitful lives or grown to adulthood.
Like I said no sin is greater than the murder or infanticide of a baby before birth, at birth or after surviving an abortion.
Bark up another tree with your lecturing and morality.
“I put homosexuality right in there with adultery, heterosexual, pre marital sex, bigamy and other sexual immoralities. Christians have to repent, and put sexual immorality behind them. That goes for gays, like it goes for other Christians.”
I think too often Christians classify certain sins as worse than others. We cannot compromise and validate sin, but should love every type of sinner, whether or not it offends our sensibilities.
I was in a Sunday school class one time, and someone was upset a Christian friend of theirs had befriended a gay man. I was glad the teacher spoke up and said we should love others and witness to them. As long as he wasn’t going to gay bars with the guy, there was nothing wrong with befriending him. I have been surprised a few times by the level of hostility of Christians toward gays. Some of it probably has to do with the radical gays who try to shove their agenda down our throats. We can’t compromise, but should love individuals. God desires no one should perish. That should be our desire as well.
And to the church of the Laodiceans write:
" These things says the Amen, the faithful and True Witness, the beginning of the creation of God: I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were cold or hot So then, because you are lukewarm, neither cold nor hot, I will spew you out of my mouth. Because you say,' I am rich, and have need of nothing--and do not know you are wretched, miserable,poor, blind and naked--
I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness and may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see.
As many as I love I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent.
( there still may be hope for tricky Ricky the barefoot pasyor)
Behold, I stand at the door and knock. if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come to him and dine with him and he with me.
To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with me on My throne, as i overcame and sat down with My Father in His throne>/b>
To me, I'd rather sit on the throne with the King of Kings not the fools gold throne of the homosexual "g*y" political agenda politically correct, of this world jerk wads..
From Revelation 3:...14-21
My hope is Warren prays straight from the Spirit and scares the demons out of EVERYONE watching and maybe the force of the sound of Jonah to Ninevah might save this country one final generation.
I think every one should be welcome to attend church services, provided they’re respectful. They shouldn’t be allowed to teach a Sunday school class or become members until they have proven themselves and are in agreement with the doctrines of the church.
Maybe he get Osteen to give him some pointers on PR ... LOL
You should read Matthew, Chapter 23 sometime. That’s just for starters. False teachers, compromisers, Scripture twisters, bad shepherds, et al., get rebuked by other Christians, and always have done. Deal with it.
“First off, Warren did not have anything that said ‘gays are not accepted’ here. Whereas, the gay lifestyle is one of sin, we all are sinners. If no sinners were allowed in the church, it would be empty. . have never seen anything from Warren which would suggest gays are not allowed. This story is BS.”
I agree - I can’t see Warren saying that or promoting that idea.
I certainly wouldn’t take this writer’s word for anything.
I do know the typical evangelical attitude toward homosexuality, and until proven otherwise I’ll believe it is Warren’s.
Homosexuals are sinners like anyone else. Sinners are welcome in church. Unrepentant sinners are not going to be accepted as members, because the process of accepting salvation includes repentance of sin.
Some sins are tougher than others to leave behind, and while for some its instantaneous, for others its a process. Accept Christ as your Lord and the process begins. Do not pretend homosexuality is not a sin, and don’t expect us to pretend it isn’t either. But God loves you, we’re prepared to love you, and if you accept God and accept Christ you will be healed of it.
As for the assaults on Warren’s character, I don’t know him. I do know he accepts no salary from his church, and he “reverse-tithes” from his outside income, giving 90% to the church and living on 10%.
A lot of people feel instant mistrust of a church that has grown by the thousands, because they’ve sat in a church of 200 for ten years. Each pastor has his mission, and its a mistake to envy the role someone else has taken on if that isn’t the one you were called to.
Is it a mistake for Warren to pray at the inauguration? Maybe. I do know that a guy who reverse-tithes isn’t driven by money. So thats not his motivation. I’m not big on ceremonial prayer, don’t ask me to lead a ceremonial prayer unless you want a real prayer. Probably the Obama crowd wants a ceremonial prayer; Warren will probably deliver a real prayer. If he doesn’t, then it was a mistake to go. But our country needs prayer, right now.
False teachers exist. And it is good to rebuke them.
I’m not sure Warren is as evil as FReepers would like to believe he is.
“Deal with it” — what kind of sophomoric sentiment is that? Correcting my doctrine with a concluding sentence like that?
I meant deal with it. Face up to it. Accept it, and quit trying to shut down the cyber-thought and speech of those who are not fans of Rick Warren. “Pastors” like Warren are going to get criticized by Christians who take the Bible seriously.
I think you guys have been had. The writer pulled your chain and you went for it.
See post 55, for Warren’s position on homosexuality.
What sin is committed when one is “intolerant”?
“Bark up another tree with your lecturing and morality”? What does that mean?
This all started with your comment #49, in which you said that Christians don’t hang out with non-Christians. Jesus proved otherwise, by hanging out with Judas ... let alone tax collectors and other sinners.
Indeed, while “we were still sinners, Christ died for us.” Yes, “Christ died for the ungodly.” What a friendly thing to do for us: “Greater love has no one than this, that someone lays down his life for his friends.”
jrooney — Jesus was critiqued by the religious people at His time for being “a friend of tax collectors and sinners.” Warren is no Jesus, that’s for sure, but he is not to be condemned for being friends with those whom the Lord would befriend.
Is he “unequally yoked”? No, offering friendly counsel is not the same as covenanting with someone.
Do you not have a single non-Christian friend or associate in your life?
Do you know the story behind “Roe”’s coming to the Lord? She was befriended. You’d rather see her rot in hell than be redeemed by the Lord’s grace?
Feel free to criticize him, he's not perfect, and in any case I'm sure his shoulders are broad enough, he can take it.
But the gold and riches part is probably misdirected. When his book sold, he paid back every dollar of salary he had received over the years, and now accepts no salary, and "reverse-tithes", living on 10% of his outside income and giving 90% to the church.
Not many pastors do that. Of course, not many are in a position to do that. He can, and he's doing it.
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